Are you mixing the 2 Gospels together?

Lukaris · Apr 12, 2022

The Lord told the rich young man what he had to do as long as he lived to have everlasting salvation ( Matthew 19:16-19). The rich young man thought he had already done that which was his mistake which we can notice when we read the whole Gospel account ( Matthew 19:16-22). Very few of us can sell our possessions to be perfect in following the Lord ( also as the Lord preached in Matthew 5).

St. Paul repeats the same commandments the Lord gave to the rich young man ( Romans 13:8-10). He said salvation by grace involves is to be lived out in good works ( Ephesians 2:8-10). St. Paul lays out examples of our commitments to living out our faith in Romans 12:1-4. In the KJV the first verse says that this is our “reasonable service”.

St. Paul preached the Gospel of Jesus Christ as did Sts. Peter, John, James.

Even the basic conclusion of the old covenant calls us to live according to the same basic commandments ( Ecclesiastes 12:13-14). Of course, since the Lord has fulfilled the law love has priority ( but does not eliminate fear of the Lord) in keeping the commandments ( John 14:15-18). Much of what is said in all of Ecclesiastes 12 serves as sound preparation for what the Lord tells us in Matthew 24 & Matthew 25. This can also help us to avoid mistakes & misunderstanding of end times.

Fervent · Apr 12, 2022

ViaCrucis said:
I don't trust "spiritual people". "Spiritual people" are "wise in their own eyes" as the Scriptures teach, they act out on the impulses and disordered passions of the flesh and call it spirituality, piety, holiness, etc. The carnal man loves to be called spiritual, loves to be spiritual, loves to be special and "enlightened". And so he calls the soulish spiritual, and does not know what the spiritual ever is. They love speaking in riddles and esoteric word games.

-CryptoLutheran

It's an accountability issue, as the "spiritual people" always claim to only be accountable to God alone as if there are no areas where God makes us accountable to each other. Never trust a "teacher" who will not be taught.

Guojing · Apr 12, 2022

Strong in Him said:
Are you saying that there is more than one Gospel?
And that is I don't believe that, I'm interpreting Scripture wrongly?

Gospel in the greek means "good news".

Is it that blasphemous to simply say, "God has more than ONE good news" throughout scripture?

God has various good news given to different audience during different time periods

Let me give you some scriptural examples, again try to understand them as literally as you can.

God told Abraham the good news he will have many descendants like the stars of heaven and the sand in the shore in genesis 15:5-6
God told Abraham another good news, that he will make him a great nation, and in him, all the nations of the world shall be blessed (Galatians 3:8, Genesis 18:18, Genesis 22:18)

Notice this very gospel preached to Abraham, in him, all the nations of the world shall be blessed, we cannot preach it to anyone else today, so again don't misinterpret what Galatians 3:8 meant. =)

God told David the good news that a descendant from him will be ruling from his throne in 2 Samuel 7:12-16
God told Israel the good news, after about 400 years of complete silence, that this descendant from David is finally here in the flesh, to usher them into that promised kingdom of heaven on earth in Luke 1:67-75
Finally after Israel the nation rejected the messiah for the final time by stoning Stephen, God announced to the whole world the good news thru the apostle Paul that, all of us, gentiles or Jews can be saved thru believing in Jesus death burial and resurrection (Romans 11:11, 1 cor 15:1-4)

The last "gospel" is the only gospel we should preach today, and is the only gospel that saves today, that we both agree.

See, can you read with an open mind and realized, "Do I necessarily need to believe that there is only ONE gospel"? Is that what scripture literally says?

disciple Clint · Apr 13, 2022

BNR32FAN said:
Bless you friend, technically there are four gospel accounts but only one gospel. Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John are all telling of the same gospel or same “good news” from four different perspectives. Now one could argue that Mark & Luke were likely or possibly from multiple perspectives since they weren’t written from first hand experience of Christ’s ministry, they likely got their information from the apostles and it’s unknown how many apostles they got their information from however they could’ve also received it thru divine revelation. We don’t know for certain.

Yes there is the Gospel of John
the Gospel of Mark
the Gospel of Luke, and
the Gospel of Matthew
wow that makes four, true there is one kerygma. Luke was not an eyewitness, Mark as an eyewitness is debated by scholars

Strong in Him · Apr 13, 2022

Guojing said:
Gospel in the greek means "good news".

Is it that blasphemous to simply say, "God has more than ONE good news" throughout scripture?

God has various good news given to different audience during different time periods

Yes.
But his Good News for all, and certainly for us, is that we sinners need no longer fear eternal death - permanent separation from God - because of our sins; he himself has paid that price. Because Jesus, who was man and God, lived a sinless life, laid down his life for us and was raised again, mankind can be reconciled to God.

Guojing said:
Let me give you some scriptural examples, again try to understand them as literally as you can.

God told Abraham the good news he will have many descendants like the stars of heaven and the sand in the shore in genesis 15:5-6

God told Abraham another good news, that he will make him a great nation, and in him, all the nations of the world shall be blessed (Galatians 3:8, Genesis 18:18, Genesis 22:18)

And when you hear the word "Gospel", do you immediately think, "The Gospel for Abraham was that God made promises to him/I rejoice in the Good News that Abraham received"?
I doubt it.
When we hear the word 'Gospel' we either think of one of the accounts of Jesus' life - the Gospel according to ..... - or we think of the Good News that sinners can be reconciled to God, that we deserved death and were given life, that we were blind but now we can see.

Guojing said:
See, can you read with an open mind and realized, "Do I necessarily need to believe that there is only ONE gospel"? Is that what scripture literally says?

For us, there is only one Gospel.
God can bless us, speak to us, guide us and answer our prayers every day, that's good news. But he only does that because we have a relationship with him and are reconciled to him. If it weren't for the Gospel of salvation, reconciliation and eternal life, that would not be possible.

The OP says "are you mixing the 2 Gospels together?"
I'm still not clear what he, or anyone else, believes the other Gospel to be.

apollosdtr · Apr 13, 2022

Peter John said:
Are you mixing the 2 Gospels together?

Nope.

Matthew 24:14 And this Gospel of the Kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations, and then shall the end come.

disciple Clint said:
Mark as an eyewitness is debated by scholars

John 15:26-27 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father: the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, He shall testify of Me: And ye also shall bear witness, because ye have been with Me from the beginning. Matthew 10:2-4

Mark's not on the list.

rturner76 · Apr 13, 2022

Works are the evidence of your faith as "Faith without works is dead"

Guojing · Apr 13, 2022

Strong in Him said:
And when you hear the word "Gospel", do you immediately think, "The Gospel for Abraham was that God made promises to him/I rejoice in the Good News that Abraham received"?
I doubt it.
When we hear the word 'Gospel' we either think of one of the accounts of Jesus' life - the Gospel according to ..... - or we think of the Good News that sinners can be reconciled to God, that we deserved death and were given life, that we were blind but now we can see.

I am simply saying the word "gospel" means good news in the Greek.

Put yourself in the shoes of Abraham, being childless at that ripe old age, which was a social disgrace during his time.

If God were to appear to you and tell you that:

Not only will you be an ancestor of an entire nation AND
every other nation will be blessed thru that nation that came from you.

Would you not have considered that as "extremely good news"?

That is precisely what Galatians 3:8 meant. Abraham received VERY good news from God.

Therefore, Abraham received "A gospel" from God, and to him it is THE gospel.

But as I said, that gospel is NOT that Christ died for his sins and rose again on the 3rd day for his justification, which is OUR gospel.

But both are GOSPELS, because both contained very good news.

Strong in Him · Apr 13, 2022

Guojing said:
I am simply saying the word "gospel" means good news in the Greek.

I know that.

The title of this thread, and question of the OP, is "are you mixing the 2 Gospels together?"
If you're saying that anyone who ever received good news in the Bible received a Gospel - so Abraham received good news, Sarah received good news, Deborah received good news when God gave them victory in battle, David received good news when he was anointed King, anyone who was ever called by God, given a miracle by God, saw, and sees, God answer their prayers, gets a job/pay rise/new house/gets married receives good news - and that if you looked at the Greek word, that would be Gospel; then there are thousands of Gospels.

How does any of that answer the OP who says that there are 2?

Guojing · Apr 13, 2022

Strong in Him said:
I know that.

The title of this thread, and question of the OP, is "are you mixing the 2 Gospels together?"
If you're saying that anyone who ever received good news in the Bible received a Gospel - so Abraham received good news, Sarah received good news, Deborah received good news when God gave them victory in battle, David received good news when he was anointed King, anyone who was ever called by God, given a miracle by God, saw, and sees, God answer their prayers, gets a job/pay rise/new house/gets married receives good news - and that if you looked at the Greek word, that would be Gospel; then there are thousands of Gospels.

How does any of that answer the OP who says that there are 2?

Yes, I am so happy you are finally seeing it.

As for the OP question, I believe he is narrowing it to the 2 main gospels preached in the New Testament, which I had earlier given you.

God told Israel the good news, after about 400 years of complete silence, that this descendant from David is finally here in the flesh, to usher them into that promised kingdom of heaven on earth in Luke 1:67-75
Finally after Israel the nation rejected the messiah for the final time by stoning Stephen, God announced to the whole world the good news thru the apostle Paul that, all of us, gentiles or Jews can be saved thru believing in Jesus death burial and resurrection (Romans 11:11, 1 cor 15:1-4)

Strong in Him · Apr 13, 2022

Guojing said:
Yes, I am so happy you are finally seeing it.

No; I've always known that Gospel means "Good News", so that's not new.
I disagree that anything and everything in the Bible and in our lives that's good can be a Gospel. I, for one, certainly never say to anyone, "have you heard the latest Gospel? My niece is getting married." Or, "I had another Gospel yesterday - I got a letter from a long lost friend."
Possibly that is how they talked in the Greek speaking world; but we're not Greek.

Guojing said:
As for the OP question, I believe he is narrowing it to the 2 main gospels preached in the New Testament, which I had earlier given you.

That's my whole point; for the Christian, there is ONE Gospel from God to mankind - peace, reconciliation with God and eternal life, all through Jesus.

Guojing · Apr 13, 2022

Strong in Him said:
No; I've always known that Gospel means "Good News", so that's not new.
I disagree that anything and everything in the Bible and in our lives that's good can be a Gospel. I, for one, certainly never say to anyone, "have you heard the latest Gospel? My niece is getting married." Or I had another Gospel yesterday - I got a letter from a long lost friend."
Possibly that is how they talked in the Greek speaking world; but we're not Greek.

That's my whole point; for the Christian, there is ONE Gospel from God to mankind - peace, reconciliation with God and eternal life, all through Jesus.

But are you aware of the content of the gospel of the kingdom, which is

God told Israel the good news, after about 400 years of complete silence, that this descendant from David is finally here in the flesh, to usher them into that promised kingdom of heaven on earth in Luke 1:67-75

By your stand, that is also A gospel that was valid during Jesus's first coming, would you agree?

Strong in Him · Apr 13, 2022

Guojing said:
But are you aware of the content of the gospel of the kingdom, which is

God told Israel the good news, after about 400 years of complete silence, that this descendant from David is finally here in the flesh, to usher them into that promised kingdom of heaven on earth in Luke 1:67-75

That's not the Gospel of the Kingdom, and to most of them it wasn't even good news.

After 400 years without a prophet, God sent John the Baptist, who told people to repent and be baptised in preparation for the One who was to come.
When Jesus came and started his ministry, very few recognised him as the Messiah - and usually, anyone who did was told not to tell anybody else. This was because the Jewish leaders had preconceived ideas about what the Messiah would be like; they expected him to be a warrior king who would drive out the Romans.

Jesus taught about the Kingdom, certainly. He showed us what life would look like if/when God was ruling as king - the blind would see, the lame would walk, the outcast would be looked after instead of being ignored, lepers would be cleansed. He demonstrated those very things by his actions - and then went to the cross so that our sin could be forgiven, we could be reconciled to God and become his children.
We cannot enter the Kingdom unless we are born again, John 3:3.
There is no kingdom without a King - that is the Good News.

Guojing said:
By your stand, that is also A gospel that was valid during Jesus's first coming, would you agree?

Something is only good news if people believe and receive it.
Someone phones me to say I have won a competition and they wanted me to go and be presented with a cheque so they could take a photo for publicity purposes.
If I believed them and received the cheque, it would be good news - if I believed them and it WAS a scam, it wouldn't be.

apollosdtr · Apr 13, 2022

Strong in Him said:
There is only ONE Gospel, Galatians 1:6-7.

Two different gospels:

The Holy Spirit

by keeping Jesus' Commandments. John 14:15-17 keep My Commandments ... the Spirit of truth
VS
by faith. Galatians 3:2-5 by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith

The law of sin and death

Matthew 5:22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment; and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council; but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.
VS
Romans 8:1-2 [There is] therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

Aussie Pete said:
Paul preached the Kingdom of God also.

Paul never kept the Commandments of Jesus, didn't teach the parables of the Kingdom of Heaven: "christ crucified" is Paul's gospel. Where Paul uses "Kingdom of God", he doesn't quote Jesus... he's talking about some after-death thing, and writing some thou-shalt-not-list... to grace-believers. (shrug)

Acts 15:19-20 Wherefore my sentence is: that we trouble not them which from among the Gentiles are turned to God, but that we write unto them that they abstain from pollutions of idols and fornication and things strangled and blood.

Galatians 2:8 (For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles)

Genesis 17:1-14 ... every male throughout your generations, and the servant born in the house and he that is bought with money, of every son of a stranger, who is not of thy seed. 13 He that is born in thy house, and he that is bought with money shall be surely circumcised, and My Covenant shall be on your flesh for an Everlasting Covenant.

apollosdtr · Apr 13, 2022

Strong in Him said:
That's not the Gospel of the Kingdom, and to most of them it wasn't even good news.

After 400 years without a prophet, God sent John the Baptist, who told people to repent and be baptised in preparation for the One who was to come.

There is no kingdom without a King - that is the Good News.

Something is only good news if people believe and receive it.

Truth doesn't require belief, it's true whether you believe it or not.

The circumcision never stopped preaching the Gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven on Earth to the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel. (Matthew 10:5-7)
John was sent to make straight paths: repent of their sins and turn back to God.
When John was sent to prison by Satan, Jesus went to Galilee with the message, Repent, for the Kingdom of Heaven draws near. (Matthew 4:12-17)
When Jesus came back re-glorified, He sent His 11 Disciples into the nations with the words He had taught them... including: Repent, for the Kingdom of Heaven draws near... and all of Matthew 5:19-20--Matthew 7:24-25. In fact, all of Matthew and John... since THESE are the witnesses of John 15:26-27. Two circumcision Gospels, Two Witnesses.

apollosdtr · Apr 13, 2022

HTacianas said:
What is it exactly that causes you to believe that only Romans through Philemon was written to us and that there are two gospels?

I have a problem with that, too, actually.
Like Tonto says, "What do you mean we, white man?"
Not everyone here is a gentile... so, not everyone is an "us."

Some are circumcision-by-birth.
Some are proselytes of the House of Israel.
And some don't know they're the circumcision, and don't really know why they hear His voice.

Clare73 · Apr 13, 2022

honey badger said:
if you kept the first commandment "thou shall not eat of it" which is one and the same as picking up your cross as it is to pour out your soul, then the book will reveal its mystery to you, but until you do so your just jumping about in a puddle calling it deep ....

Yep. . .cross-bearing is not the problem.

apollosdtr · Apr 13, 2022

HTacianas said:
You are attempting to use two different groups to prove two different gospels. And in doing so you are relying on words added to the KJV as a means of clarification.

1Cor.1:23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;

Jesus didn't preach "Christ crucified" to the poor...

Matthew 11:5 The blind receive their sight, and the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, and the deaf hear, the dead are raised up, and the poor have the Gospel preached to them.

Galatians 2:7
As _____ of the circumcision __ unto Peter...

Not a complete sentence... fill in the blanks?

apollosdtr · Apr 13, 2022

BNR32FAN said:
He’s saying that Paul’s epistles are a different gospel (good news) than Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John which is disagree with. Paul taught the same gospel, he just didn’t write another gospel account.

...and Matthew and John are different from Luke and Mark. Someone even says Jesus' body was broken for thee... which John says can not have happened without breaking Scripture.

apollosdtr · Apr 13, 2022

BNR32FAN said:
Paul preached the same gospel that Christ did because there is only one gospel not two or four, just one.

Why didn't Paul quote Jesus' Gospel to the Circumcision?

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Are you mixing the 2 Gospels together?

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