Does the Seventh-day Adventist Church Teach the Gospel?

SabbathBlessings said:

The shadows are what the Bible says they are....

what Jesus came to end. Dan9:27 not God's commandments, written by God, spoken by God- God's own Testimony Exo31:18 in God's ark in heaven Rev11:19 that God's saints through love Exo20:6 keep until the very end Rev14:12 Rev22:14

Heb 10:1 For the law, having a shadow of the good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with these same sacrifices, which they offer continually year by year, make those who approach perfect. 2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? For the worshipers, once [a]purified, would have had no more consciousness of sins. 3 But in those sacrifices there is a reminder of sins every year. 4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and goats could take away sins.
5 Therefore, when He came into the world, He said:

“Sacrifice and offering You did not desire,
But a body You have prepared for Me.
6 In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin
You had no pleasure.
7 Then I said, ‘Behold, I have come—
In the volume of the book it is written of Me—
To do Your will, O God.’ ”
8 Previously saying, “Sacrifice and offering, burnt offerings, and offerings for sin You did not desire, nor had pleasure in them” (which are offered according to the law), 9 then He said, “Behold, I have come to do Your will, [b]O God.” He takes away the first that He may establish the second. 10 By that will we have been [c]sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

The weekly Sabbath came before sin, before the fall, before one animal sacrifice and was never a shadow of Christ, but points to Him as our Creator Exo20:11 the only God we are to worship Rev14:7 and continues Isa 66:23 thus saith the LORD.

If one wishes to force Paul to teach against Christ, when Paul said everything had to be according to Him and teach that spending sanctified time honoring our LORD, God's blessing, Gods sanctification, the day that our Savior Jesus Christ is LORD of, the Sabbath day, is against man, when He said the Sabbath was made for man, that will have to be between those who teach this and God. Its certainly not what Paul believed or taught, Paul faithfully remembered the Sabbath day and kept every Sabbath holy decades and decades after the Cross Acts 13:42 Acts 13:44 Acts 15:21 Acts 16:13 Acts 17:2 Acts 18:4 just as Jesus said His faithful would Isa 56:6-7 Mat24:20. Paul was a servant of God Rom1:1 and servant is not greater than their master John13:16 and a servant serves the LORD the way He asks Isa 56:6, otherwise its not really serving, it saying we know better, something Paul warned about Rom6:16KJV

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Lots of pious posturing there, but in an altogether unworthy cause. The fact is that Gentiles we’re never called upon to keep the Sabbath. Arguments to the contrary are at best exercises in sophistry.

Jipsah said:

Lots of pious posturing there, but in an altogether unworthy cause. The fact is that Gentiles we’re never called upon to keep the Sabbath. Arguments to the contrary are at best exercises in sophistry.

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Only if we refuse to listen to God and what He said. God said the commandments are for those who love Him Exo20:6 the saints keep them until the end Rev14:12. Jesus is LORD of the Sabbath day, that He said was made for us and tells us why in His Word, to join ourselves to Him serve Him invited to everyone and to bless us, Jesus told mankind to live by what God said Mat4:4 we can always listen to another voice and make someone else our lord, He gives us free will, its why He said many will say LORD LORD, but He does not know. Mat7:21-23 Luke6:46-49 1John2:3-4

SabbathBlessings said:

Everyone is called to join themselves to the LORD, to serve Him, keep His covenant and Sabbath Isa 56:6. Its not that God does not call everyone, He does, not everyone responds because they want God's blessings on their terms, not God's Isa56:2 they want to serve the LORD on their terms, not how God's asks Isa 56:6. Jesus said the Sabbath was made for man, so unless one deems themselves not human, God made the Sabbath for you because He invited everyone to join themselves to Him and serve Him Isa 56:6 He wants to bless all of mankind Isa56:2, I personally would not reject God's invitation and blessings Psa 37:22 but God does give us free will on who we choose to serve Rom6:16KJV

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I don’t see anything in there about worship on days other than Saturday being forbidden.

On the other hand:

These key verses support worshipping and serving God every day:

• Psalm 113:3: "From the rising of the sun to the place where it sets, the name of the Lord is to be praised." This establishes a constant, 24/7 rhythm of worship. [1]
• Romans 12:1: "...to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship." Your entire life becomes an ongoing act of devotion. [1, 2, 3]
• Psalm 145:2: "Every day I will praise you and extol your name forever and ever."
• Hebrews 13:15: "Through Jesus, therefore, let us continually offer to God a sacrifice of praise—the fruit of lips that openly profess his name." [1, 2]”

And lest you attempt to say I’m quoting St. Paul incorrectly, and seek to invalidate the Psalms on some hitherto unknown pretext, consider that in Numbers 28:3-4 God HImself instructs Moses to implement daily worship in the Tabernacle.

These verses positively prove, together with the other verses you have been shown, the Hebrew custom of daily worship in the Tabernacle and the Temple and in the synagogues with the threefold daily prayer implemented by St. Ezra the Priest and St. Nehemiah the Prophet was not a false tradition of men, unlike the overzealous adherence to the Sabbath criticized by our Lord in Matthew 12:1-14, Mark 2:23-28, Mark 3:1-6, and Luke 6:1-11 (this legalism being a clear example of the traditions of men our Lord condemned in Mark 7:13).

It’s an understandable error to believe that the Sabbath must be adhered to in a legalistic manner, but the idea that worship on other days is forbidden does not survive any inspection; it also conflicts with the practice of your own SDA denomination, since nearly all SDA parishes celebrate Christmas with worship on Christmas Eve. Some SDA churches also have Vespers on Friday which start before the Sabbath begins.

The Liturgist said:

I don’t see anything in there about worship on days other than Saturday being forbidden.

On the other hand:

These key verses support worshipping and serving God every day:

• Psalm 113:3: "From the rising of the sun to the place where it sets, the name of the Lord is to be praised." This establishes a constant, 24/7 rhythm of worship. [1]
• Romans 12:1: "...to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship." Your entire life becomes an ongoing act of devotion. [1, 2, 3]
• Psalm 145:2: "Every day I will praise you and extol your name forever and ever."
• Hebrews 13:15: "Through Jesus, therefore, let us continually offer to God a sacrifice of praise—the fruit of lips that openly profess his name." [1, 2]”

And lest you attempt to say I’m quoting St. Paul incorrectly, and seek to invalidate the Psalms on some hitherto unknown pretext, consider that in Numbers 28:3-4 God HImself instructs Moses to implement daily worship in the Tabernacle.

These verses positively prove, together with the other verses you have been shown, the Hebrew custom of daily worship in the Tabernacle and the Temple and in the synagogues with the threefold daily prayer implemented by St. Ezra the Priest and St. Nehemiah the Prophet was not a false tradition of men, unlike the overzealous adherence to the Sabbath criticized by our Lord in Matthew 12:1-14, Mark 2:23-28, Mark 3:1-6, and Luke 6:1-11 (this legalism being a clear example of the traditions of men our Lord condemned in Mark 7:13).

It’s an understandable error to believe that the Sabbath must be adhered to in a legalistic manner, but the idea that worship on other days is forbidden does not survive any inspection; it also conflicts with the practice of your own SDA denomination, since nearly all SDA parishes celebrate Christmas with worship on Christmas Eve. Some SDA churches also have Vespers on Friday which start before the Sabbath begins.

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God commanded to keep the seventh day Sabbath holy. Exo20:8, 10 To work the other six days. Exo20:9. If someone takes issue with God's spoken and written Testimony Exo31:18 that's sits under His mercy seat Exo25:21 in heaven Rev11:19 where His word is settled Psa 119:89, that's not with me, but with the God who made Exo20:11, the only God we are called to worship Rev14:7

Should our best be given to God on the only day God commanded us to keep holy, the day He blessed and sanctified for holy use, or a day God made for works and labors.

I think you might be confusing dedication to God which we should do 365/24/7 with true and false worship according to Jesus.

Jesus related false worship as laying aside God's commandments quoting from the Ten Commandments where God also wrote the 4th commandment on how we should keep all days Exo20:8-11 for man-made traditions- Jesus said this makes God's word void, ones heart far from Him and our worship to Him in vain. Mat15:3-14 Isa 29:13 because it replacing the fear of God and keeping His commandments with the fear of God through mans traditions, something Jesus condemned. We can always finds ways, well God didn't say this, and ignore what He did say, that's always a choice people can make.


Why elevate something God never said to do over something God did say both written and spoken. Its choices we will all have to make and in the end, God will sort out those who hear and do what He says from those who speak His name but do as they wanted instead. Mat7:21-23

I know we won't agree on this and that's OK, I will agree to disagree.

SabbathBlessings said:

I know we won't agree on this and that's OK, I will agree to disagree.

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I don’t, because you’ve accused my church of profaning the Sabbath because we also worship on the First Day, despite that not only being allowed but explicitly commanded by Christ our True God in Numbers 28:3-4

SabbathBlessings said:

Should our best be given to God on the only day God commanded us to keep holy, the day He blessed and sanctified for holy use, or a day God made for works and labors.

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False dilemma, a logical fallacy. Also a red herring and a non-sequitur.

God commanded daily worship and daily sacrifices, which are by definition worship, in Numbers 28:3-4, there is no getting around that fact.

Also you yourself have objected to the intercession of the saints for, among other reasons, the idea that praying to them is worship*, but now “pray without ceasing” and prayer to God is not worship? This seems to be an arbitrary selection of verses.

*To be fair you also cited your belief in Soul Sleep, but that does not invalidate intercessory prayer since even if Soul Sleep is accurate, since the World to Come is eternal, that is to say, not temporally constrained, there is no reason why prayers could not be heard by those living therein; God exists outside of time having created it, a point which some Adventists don’t seem to understand (this point, and also divine omniscience, is also why the idea that He needs, at this point, 182 years and counting to complete an “investigative judgement” is unscriptural, a point you did not directly respond to but merely quoted numerous verses out of context.

I formally request you retract all allegations, implicit or explicit, that the Eastern Orthodox Church and other traditional churches including the Oriental Orthodox, the Roman Catholic Church, the Anglican Communion, GAFCON and Continuing Anglicans, and the Confessional Lutherans of the International Lutheran Conference and other confessional Lutheran churches such as ELDONA, and all other churches which worship on both Saturday and Sunday are somehow profaning the Sabbath, as well as any churches which teach their members to rest throughout the day on the Sabbath and then worship, refreshed, on Sunday (since the word used in the original Greek for worship, leitourgia, literally means “the work of the people” or “the work for the people” and if working is required on other days but prohibited on the Sabbath that would extend to worship.

Indeed several forms of Hebrew worship required carrying things into the temple and thus could only be done on days other than the Sabbath.

I don’t care if you accuse us of not keeping the Sabbath for other reasons, but the idea that we defile it by also worshipping on Sunday is manifestly erroneous and would also apply to your own denomination for worshipping on Christmas eve.

The Liturgist said:

I don’t, because you’ve accused my church of profaning the Sabbath.

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Where, show me where I said that. You can't because its not true. God will determine who does His will and those who claim it with their lips and do not, not us.

I'd be careful what you accuse others of, we can easily go through threads and see who is really doing the accusing, its usually the one who is claiming others of doing so that can never support with actual proof. Anyway, God knows everything Ecc 12:13-14 and I have faith He will righteously sort it all out soon enough.

The Liturgist said:

I don’t, because you’ve accused my church of profaning the Sabbath because we also worship on the First Day, despite that not only being allowed but explicitly commanded by Christ our True God in Numbers 28:3-4



False dilemma, a logical fallacy. Also a red herring and a non-sequitur.

God commanded daily worship and daily sacrifices, which are by definition worship, in Numbers 28:3-4, there is no getting around that fact.



I formally request you retract all allegations, implicit or explicit, that the Eastern Orthodox Church and other traditional churches including the Oriental Orthodox, the Roman Catholic Church, the Anglican Communion, GAFCON and Continuing Anglicans, and the Confessional Lutherans of the International Lutheran Conference and other confessional Lutheran churches such as ELDONA, and all other churches which worship on both Saturday and Sunday are somehow profaning the Sabbath, as well as any churches which teach their members to rest throughout the day on the Sabbath and then worship, refreshed, on Sunday (since the word used in the original Greek for worship, leitourgia, literally means “the work of the people” or “the work for the people” and if working is required on other days but prohibited on the Sabbath that would extend to worship.

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Don't hold your breath; like many of our current politicians, ego usurps reason.

MarkRohfrietsch said:

Don't hold your breath; like many of our current politicians, ego usurps reason.

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The first step is to even find proof of the allegation, since he can't actually quote me saying this, its like me scolding you because you told your mother that she is fat and demanding you to stop saying this when I have zero evidence of it ever happening. We can say anything, but doesn't make it true, but it does make someone a false witness which I think in God's eyes is going to be a problem, unless one repents- is sorry and turns from, but in the end God will sort it all out.