Brightfame52
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CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.
Imputed Righteousness. The True & The False.
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fhansen
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Nah, only a truly great God, a God of love, would want His creation involved in their sanctification unto salvation, as a good parent desires their children to become responsible for themselves. It all begins with grace initiating faith, a gift we must still accept, embrace, and act upon. Or not. But those who do, and who remain and persevere, will turn out to be good soil, produing much good fruit.
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Brightfame52
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Brightfame52
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Brightfame52
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Brightfame52
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All you do is exalt man and his doings, very little about Christs doing and accomplishments .When you do say anything about Christ its interwoven with man and his responsibilities, which overshadows Christ.
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fhansen
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It doesn't overshadow Christ. Man's only hope of being righteous is in and because of Him, 'apart from whom we can do nothing'. But if a concept of a strictly imputed righteousness means that man can enter heaven without personal holiness-actually being holy- then we're not fully cognizant of how God works in us.
"Make every effort to live in peace with everyone and to be holy; without holiness no one will see the Lord." Heb 12:14
"To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life." Rom 2:7
"For if, by the trespass of the one man, death reigned through that one man, how much more will those who receive God’s abundant provision of grace and of the gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man, Jesus Christ!" Rom 5:17
"Just as you used to offer yourselves as slaves to impurity and to ever-increasing wickedness, so now offer yourselves as slaves to righteousness leading to holiness. When you were slaves to sin, you were free from the control of righteousness. What benefit did you reap at that time from the things you are now ashamed of? Those things result in death! But now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves of God, the benefit you reap leads to holiness, and the result is eternal life." Rom 6:19-22
"Therefore, brothers and sisters, we have an obligation—but it is not to the flesh, to live according to it. For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live. For those who are led by the Spirit of God are the children of God." Rom 8:12-14
This effort of ours is to join ranks with God now, acknowledging our need for righteousness and our absolute inability to achieve it without Him. Adam had thought otherwise, that he had no need for God-and our world is the result.
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Carl Emerson
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This is a straw man...
A true believer - because of His indwelling presence, will never do such a thing because the Spirit of the Fear of the Lord seals him against it.
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Carl Emerson
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On this thread I see an attack on the very heart of the Gospel.
John 3
16 “For God so loved the world, that He gave His only Son, so that everyone who believes in Him will not perish, but have eternal life.
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Brightfame52
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fhansen
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A true believer is one who has persevered to the end, producing good fruit, proving themselves to be good soil. Until then it's all just talk. And faith, itself, is born out by how we live, the choices we make, and continue to make, daily. The absolute best understanding of God's work in and purpose for man, what He does for and in us and what He expects from us, is summed up concisely in this simple yet profound quote of a 16th century believer:
"At the evening of life we shall be judged on our love".
If faith doesn't get us there, then it's worthless. And I'm confident from my readings of them that virtually every ECF would've understood and agreed with that. But the gospel's been quite undermined and compromised by some since that time.
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The heart of Jesus Christ's gospel:
A person who truly believes in Jesus Christ obeys his commandments. Romans 10:16, Hebrews 3:18-19
A person who truly loves Jesus Christ obeys his commandments. John 15:10
A person who truly knows Jesus Christ obeys his commandments. 1 John 2:3-4
People who claim they believe in him, know him, or love him, but don't obey his commandments, are called liars.
What is the eternal punishment for all liars?
Revelation 21:8
But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”
God did not send his beloved son to earth to subject himself to a humiliating and excruciatingly painful death on the cross so that humans could commit grievous sins without personal, everlasting consequences. Hebrews 10:29-30
Matthew 7:14
Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.
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A true believer is a person who remains faithful—obeys God's commandments—until his death. He does not commit grievous sins when tempted. He resists and overcomes the temptations, steadfast in his obedience to God.
The Christians who believe only for a while:
1 John 2:19
They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out, that it might be plain that they all are not of us.
Luke 8:13-14
And the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear the word, receive it with joy; but these have no root, they believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away. 14 And as for what fell among the thorns, they are those who hear, but as they go on their way they are choked by the cares and riches and pleasures of life, and their fruit does not mature.
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Carl Emerson
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Carl Emerson
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Those who went out were not true believers. THEY WERE NOT CHRISTIANS. As Paul said they were not of us.
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Carl Emerson
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Those who preach salvation by works fail to experience the assurance of salvation guaranteed in John 3:16 and fail to understand the timeless nature the Cross covering all sin past present and future for the True believer.
No wonder walking into some churches is like walking into a funeral where folks are far from celebrating the love and life if Jesus but live in fear of losing salvation by not being good enough. This is a denial of what Jesus has done for us on the cross, setting us free from the curse of the law. It is a sad misrepresentation of the faith and demands self effort in the place of the salvation Jesus paid for with His suffering and His life...
No wonder walking into some churches is like walking into a funeral where folks are far from celebrating the love and life if Jesus but live in fear of losing salvation by not being good enough. This is a denial of what Jesus has done for us on the cross, setting us free from the curse of the law. It is a sad misrepresentation of the faith and demands self effort in the place of the salvation Jesus paid for with His suffering and His life...
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