Saint Peter says: Second Advent = Second Resurrection - All Other Theories Debunked

Jan001 said:

God desires for every person to be saved and to inherit eternal life. His son offered himself as a sacrifice to make salvation possible. He is patient; he doesn't desire that any enter the lake of fire.

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Remember at Pentecost when the Holy Spirit was poured out on "all flesh", but only those God chose to receive Him did receive Him.
If the Lord wants everyone to be saved, who can stop Him, or are you saying that it's a wish list He's powerless over starting with Adam.
Isaiah 14:
24The LORD of Hosts has sworn:
“Surely, as I have planned, so will it be;
as I have purposed, so will it stand.
25I will break Assyria in My land;
I will trample him on My mountain.
His yoke will be taken off My people,
and his burden removed from their shoulders.”
26This is the plan devised for the whole earth,
and this is the hand stretched out over all the nations.
27The LORD of Hosts has purposed,
and who can thwart Him?
His hand is outstretched,
so who can turn it back?

Jan001 said:

God doesn't take his gift of salvation back. Unfaithful Christians reject his gift by committing mortal sins; they spurn the Son of God and outrage the Holy Spirit of Grace. They prefer the pleasures of their sinfulness rather than the discipline necessary for godliness.

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God gives the gift of faith, salvation, the Holy Spirit by grace, but you're claiming that it isn't enough because in the end, salvation comes to man by the keeping of the law of commandments.

Jan001 said:

The Holy Spirit does not continue to live in a temple (Christian) defiled by mortal sin. He is given only to people who obey God; therefore, he is taken away from Christians who disobey.

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No where does it say that? There's only one mortal sin--unbelief. You're assuming things not stated.

Jan001 said:

If the Holy Spirit is not living in the Christian's temple (his soul) at the time of his death, he will not inherit eternal life.

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The Holy Spirit is the guarantee of eternal life and not a subject of man.

Ed Parenteau said:

Remember at Pentecost when the Holy Spirit was poured out on "all flesh", but only those God chose to receive Him did receive Him.
If the Lord wants everyone to be saved, who can stop Him, or are you saying that it's a wish list He's powerless over starting with Adam.

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God is almighty, all-powerful.

He grants every person the choice to believe in him or not. He grants to every person the choice to remain faithful to his commandments until death. God doesn't force people to love/obey him.

God is love. God will adopt us as his sons and daughters and grant us eternal life with him after we die if we have loved him in return. 1 John 4:8

Ed Parenteau said:

God gives the gift of faith, salvation, the Holy Spirit by grace, but you're claiming that it isn't enough because in the end, salvation comes to man by the keeping of the law of commandments.

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After Adam sinned, neither he nor his descendants could enter eternal life with God. Angels with swords barred heaven's entrance. That is why the spirits of Abraham and all other righteous people were in Hades instead of in heaven after their physical death. Genesis 3:24, Luke 16:23

God's son Jesus Christ died sacrificially on the cross to redeem us from Adam's sin. His sacrifice makes eternal life with God possible for all people. Romans 5:12, Romans 5:19

God first saves us when we believe and are baptized according to Jesus Christ's command. Jesus said belief in him together with our baptism will save us. Matthew 28:18-2, Mark 16:15-16

Ed Parenteau said:

No where does it say that? There's only one mortal sin--unbelief. You're assuming things not stated.

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Having contempt for one's fellow man is a mortal sin, and if this sin is not repented before he dies, he will be thrown into the lake of fire.

Matthew 5:22
But I say to you that if you are angry with a brother or sister, you will be liable to judgment; and if you insult a brother or sister, you will be liable to the council; and if you say, ‘You fool,’ you will be liable to the hell of fire.

Failing to provide sustenance to needy family members is a mortal sin, and if not repented before he dies, he will be thrown into the lake of fire.

1 Timothy 5:8
And whoever does not provide for relatives, and especially for family members, has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.

Matthew 25:31-46

Ed Parenteau said:

The Holy Spirit is the guarantee of eternal life and not a subject of man.

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The Holy Spirit guarantees eternal life only to the people who obey Him. Acts 5:32

Jan001 said:

God is almighty, all-powerful.

He grants every person the choice to believe in him or not. He grants to every person the choice to remain faithful to his commandments until death. God doesn't force people to love/obey him.

God is love. God will adopt us as his sons and daughters and grant us eternal life with him after we die if we have loved him in return. 1 John 4:8

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Did God chose Israel because they would obey Him? They killed the prophets and murdered His Son.
Did Christ not say to the apostles:
John 15:16 You did not choose Me, but I chose you. And I appointed you to go and bear fruit—fruit that will remain—so that whatever you ask the Father in My name, He will give you
2 Thessalonians 2:13
But we should always thank God for you, brothers who are loved by the Lord, because God chose you from the beginning to be saved by the sanctification of the Spirit and by faith in the truth.

Ephesians 1:4
For He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world to be holy and blameless in His presence. In love

1 Peter 2:9
But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for God’s own possession, to proclaim the virtues of Him who called you out of darkness into His marvelous light.

Jan001 said:

After Adam sinned, neither he nor his descendants could enter eternal life with God. Angels with swords barred heaven's entrance. That is why the spirits of Abraham and all other righteous people were in Hades instead of in heaven after their physical death. Genesis 3:24, Luke 16:23

God's son Jesus Christ died sacrificially on the cross to redeem us from Adam's sin. His sacrifice makes eternal life with God possible for all people. Romans 5:12, Romans 5:19

God first saves us when we believe and are baptized according to Jesus Christ's command. Jesus said belief in him together with our baptism will save us. Matthew 28:18-2, Mark 16:15-16

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Adam was locked out of the garden preventing him from having eternal life. If he was a sinner, how could he get eternal life?

Jan001 said:

Having contempt for one's fellow man is a mortal sin, and if this sin is not repented before he dies, he will be thrown into the lake of fire.

Matthew 5:22
But I say to you that if you are angry with a brother or sister, you will be liable to judgment; and if you insult a brother or sister, you will be liable to the council; and if you say, ‘You fool,’ you will be liable to the hell of fire.

Failing to provide sustenance to needy family members is a mortal sin, and if not repented before he dies, he will be thrown into the lake of fire.

1 Timothy 5:8
And whoever does not provide for relatives, and especially for family members, has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.

Matthew 25:31-46

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Here's some worse than an infidel and the judgement Paul pronounces on him.
1 Corinthians 5:
1It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind that is not tolerated even among pagans, for a man has his father’s wife. 2And you are arrogant! Ought you not rather to mourn? Let him who has done this be removed from among you.
3For though absent in body, I am present in spirit; and as if present, I have already pronounced judgment on the one who did such a thing. 4When you are assembled in the name of the Lord Jesus and my spirit is present, with the power of our Lord Jesus, 5you are to deliver this man to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord.

In Matthew 5, Christ is pointing out that under the law, even the slightest sin such as insulting someone by calling them a fool, will lead to Gehenna
In Matthew 25, It was all leading up to the destruction of Jerusalem.
Read Matthew 10 where Jesus sends His disciples
23When they persecute you in one town, flee to the next. Truly I tell you, you will not reach all the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.
42And if anyone gives even a cup of cold water to one of these little ones because he is My disciple, truly I tell you, he will never lose his reward.”

Matthew 25:45 Then he will answer them, saying, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.’
--It's a near demonstrative pronoun referring to His apostles in chapter 10.

Jan001 said:

The Holy Spirit guarantees eternal life only to the people who obey Him. Acts 5:32

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Romans 10:8But what does it say? “The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart,” that is, the word of faith we are proclaiming: 9that if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. 10For with your heart you believe and are justified, and with your mouth you confess and are saved.
Where does it say "might be saved"?

precepts said:

2 Peter chapter 3 specifically proves the 2nd Advent is the 2nd Resurrection in Rev 20:19 to 21:1 because it specifically says we look forward to a new heaven and new earth when Christ returns, and a new heaven and earth only occurs at the 2nd resurrection. Rapture theory debunked!.

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Actually, Peter knew nothing about the new heaven and earth of Rev. 20-21, because he died before John received that.

The only new heaven and earth Peter knew about was foretold in Isaiah 65 and 66. And those passages speak about when God restores Israel and its temple worship after the End Times' judgments; events that correspond to Zechariah 14. Millennial, not post-millennial.

The prophetic evidence indicates to me that there will be both catastrophic earth changes (see Zech. 14:10, for example) AND a pole reversal, which will change the heavens; the constellations of which will reverse hemispheres. Reasons shown here:

7. “The Stars Will Fall From Heaven” = Pole Reversal? Shows how passages from Matthew 24, Luke 21, and Revelation 6, 9, and 12, about the stars falling from heaven in the era of the Second Coming, together indicate a reversal of Earth’s poles. Evidence about such pole reversals in the past is presented for comparison. https://www.worthychristianforums.com/blogs/entry/929-“the-stars-will-fall-from-heaven”-pole-reversal/

Ed Parenteau said:

Did God chose Israel because they would obey Him? They killed the prophets and murdered His Son.
Did Christ not say to the apostles:
John 15:16 You did not choose Me, but I chose you. And I appointed you to go and bear fruit—fruit that will remain—so that whatever you ask the Father in My name, He will give you
2 Thessalonians 2:13
But we should always thank God for you, brothers who are loved by the Lord, because God chose you from the beginning to be saved by the sanctification of the Spirit and by faith in the truth.

Ephesians 1:4
For He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world to be holy and blameless in His presence. In love

1 Peter 2:9
But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for God’s own possession, to proclaim the virtues of Him who called you out of darkness into His marvelous light.

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God desires for every person to be saved; therefore, he provides the grace necessary to believe and be saved. God desires belief, but he doesn't force it. He also doesn't prevent belief. He calls every person to repentance and belief. If they do these, they are chosen to be Jesus' disciples. If they remain obedient to him until their death, they will be chosen to inherit eternal life.

Matthew 22:12-14
and he said to him, ‘Friend, how did you get in here without a wedding robe?’ And he was speechless. 13 Then the king said to the attendants, ‘Bind him hand and foot, and throw him into the outer darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’ 14 For many are called, but few are chosen.”

Ed Parenteau said:

Adam was locked out of the garden preventing him from having eternal life. If he was a sinner, how could he get eternal life?

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First, Adam repented of his sin of idolatry against God, and then he lived according to God's commands until he died. Then, after his death, he resided in Hades until Jesus Christ reopened the entrance into heaven and escorted him there.

Ed Parenteau said:

Here's some worse than an infidel and the judgement Paul pronounces on him.
1 Corinthians 5:
1It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind that is not tolerated even among pagans, for a man has his father’s wife. 2And you are arrogant! Ought you not rather to mourn? Let him who has done this be removed from among you.
3For though absent in body, I am present in spirit; and as if present, I have already pronounced judgment on the one who did such a thing. 4When you are assembled in the name of the Lord Jesus and my spirit is present, with the power of our Lord Jesus, 5you are to deliver this man to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord.

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Paul excommunicated the incestuous adulterer from the fellowship of the church. He hoped this punishment would encourage the sinner to repent and confess his sins and thereby be restored to Christian fellowship before he died.

Ed Parenteau said:

In Matthew 5, Christ is pointing out that under the law, even the slightest sin such as insulting someone by calling them a fool, will lead to Gehenna

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Matthew 5:21-22

THE LAW OF MOSES:

21 You have heard that it was said to those of ancient times, ‘You shall not murder’; and ‘whoever murders shall be liable to judgment.’

THE NEW LAW OF CHRIST:

22 But I say to you that if you are angry with a brother or sister, you will be liable to judgment; and if you insult a brother or sister, you will be liable to the council; and if you say, ‘You fool,’ you will be liable to the hell of fire.

Matthew 12:36
I tell you, on the day of judgment you will have to give an account for every careless word you utter;

Ed Parenteau said:

In Matthew 25, It was all leading up to the destruction of Jerusalem.

42And if anyone gives even a cup of cold water to one of these little ones because he is My disciple, truly I tell you, he will never lose his reward.”

Matthew 25:45 Then he will answer them, saying, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.’

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This is the final judgment at the end of time.

If people aren't in fellowship with God when they die, none of the good deeds that they did during their lifetime will be remembered.

Ezekiel 33:13-16
Though I say to the righteous that they shall surely live (eternal life), yet if they trust in their righteousness and commit iniquity, none of their righteous deeds shall be remembered; but in the iniquity that they have committed they shall die (second death). 14 Again, though I say to the wicked, “You shall surely die,” yet if they turn from their sin and do what is lawful and right— 15 if the wicked restore the pledge, give back what they have taken by robbery, and walk in the statutes of life, committing no iniquity—they shall surely live, they shall not die. 16 None of the sins that they have committed shall be remembered against them; they have done what is lawful and right, they shall surely live.

Ed Parenteau said:

Romans 10:8But what does it say? “The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart,” that is, the word of faith we are proclaiming: 9that if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. 10For with your heart you believe and are justified, and with your mouth you confess and are saved.
Where does it say "might be saved"?

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A person's initial salvation doesn't guarantee he will inherit eternal life after he dies. At his death, he must still be faithful to God's commandments to inherit eternal life. Revelation 2:10


John 3:17
“Indeed, God did not send the Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.

1 Corinthians 15:1-2
Now I would remind you, brothers and sisters, of the good news that I proclaimed to you, which you in turn received, in which also you stand, 2 through which also you are being saved, if you hold firmly to the message that I proclaimed to you—unless you have come to believe in vain.

James 1:22
But be doers of the word, and not merely hearers who deceive themselves.

Jan001 said:

First, Adam repented of his sin of idolatry against God, and then he lived according to God's commands until he died. Then, after his death, he resided in Hades until Jesus Christ reopened the entrance into heaven and escorted him there.

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Scripture?

Jan001 said:

God desires for every person to be saved; therefore, he provides the grace necessary to believe and be saved. God desires belief, but he doesn't force it. He also doesn't prevent belief. He calls every person to repentance and belief. If they do these, they are chosen to be Jesus' disciples. If they remain obedient to him until their death, they will be chosen to inherit eternal life.

Matthew 22:12-14
and he said to him, ‘Friend, how did you get in here without a wedding robe?’ And he was speechless. 13 Then the king said to the attendants, ‘Bind him hand and foot, and throw him into the outer darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’ 14 For many are called, but few are chosen.”

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Romans 9:5In the same way, at the present time there is a remnant chosen by grace. 6And if it is by grace, then it is no longer by works. Otherwise, grace would no longer be grace.

So, are you saved by grace or by your works?
Besides Matthew 22 is Jesus talking to the chief priest and Pharisees and tells them He would send His army to burn their city down at which time the wedding would take place.

Jan001 said:

A person's initial salvation doesn't guarantee he will inherit eternal life after he dies. At his death, he must still be faithful to God's commandments to inherit eternal life. Revelation 2:10


John 3:17
“Indeed, God did not send the Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.

1 Corinthians 15:1-2
Now I would remind you, brothers and sisters, of the good news that I proclaimed to you, which you in turn received, in which also you stand, 2 through which also you are being saved, if you hold firmly to the message that I proclaimed to you—unless you have come to believe in vain.

James 1:22
But be doers of the word, and not merely hearers who deceive themselves.

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An inheritance is not something you earn. The believer is given eternal life upon believing.
They were being saved because salvation had not yet come.
Hebrews 9:27Just as man is appointed to die once, and after that to face judgment, 28so also Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many; and He will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who eagerly await Him.
The following people were revealed as "eagerly waiting" for Him.
Did God keep His word to them?

Englishman's Concordance
Romans 8:19 V-PIM/P-3S
GRK: τοῦ θεοῦ ἀπεκδέχεται
NAS: of the creation waits eagerly for the revealing
KJV: of the creature waiteth for the manifestation
INT: of God awaits
Romans 8:23 V-PPM/P-NMP
GRK: στενάζομεν υἱοθεσίαν ἀπεκδεχόμενοι τὴν ἀπολύτρωσιν
NAS: ourselves, waiting eagerly for [our] adoption as sons,
KJV: ourselves, waiting for the adoption,
INT: groan adoption awaiting the redemption

Romans 8:25 V-PIM/P-1P
GRK: δι' ὑπομονῆς ἀπεκδεχόμεθα
NAS: with perseverance we wait eagerly for it.
KJV: with patience wait for [it].
INT: in patience we await

1 Corinthians 1:7 V-PPM/P-AMP
GRK: μηδενὶ χαρίσματι ἀπεκδεχομένους τὴν ἀποκάλυψιν
NAS: gift, awaiting eagerly the revelation
KJV: no gift; waiting for the coming of our
INT: not one gift awaiting the revelation

Galatians 5:5 V-PIM/P-1P
GRK: ἐλπίδα δικαιοσύνης ἀπεκδεχόμεθα
NAS: by faith, are waiting for the hope
KJV: through the Spirit wait for the hope
INT: [the] hope of righteousness await

Philippians 3:20 V-PIM/P-1P
GRK: καὶ σωτῆρα ἀπεκδεχόμεθα κύριον Ἰησοῦν
NAS: also we eagerly wait for a Savior,
KJV: also we look for the Saviour,
INT: also [as] Savior we are awaiting [the] Lord Jesus

Hebrews 9:28 V-PPM/P-DMP
GRK: τοῖς αὐτὸν ἀπεκδεχομένοις εἰς σωτηρίαν
NAS: to those who eagerly await Him.
KJV: of many; and unto them that look for him
INT: to those that him await for salvation

Ed Parenteau said:

So, are you saved by grace or by your works?

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Ephesians 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,

No faith, no grace.

WilliamLhk said:

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,

No faith, no grace.

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Ephesians 2:5made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in our trespasses. It is by grace you have been saved!
Either way, it is the gift of God and no works involved.

Ed Parenteau said:

Scripture?

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If you had been locked out of Eden, would you have repented of the sin that caused your eviction? I certainly would have.

Ed Parenteau said:

Romans 9:5In the same way, at the present time there is a remnant chosen by grace. 6And if it is by grace, then it is no longer by works. Otherwise, grace would no longer be grace.

So, are you saved by grace or by your works?
Besides Matthew 22 is Jesus talking to the chief priest and Pharisees and tells them He would send His army to burn their city down at which time the wedding would take place.

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Grace is what saves me.

I am saved by grace; I maintain this grace by cooperating with the Holy Spirit in my soul, who helps me obey the Law of Christ. If I continue in his grace until my death, I will be approved to inherit eternal life.

Law of Christ:

Galatians 6:2
Bear one another’s burdens, and in this way you will fulfill the law of Christ.

James 2:15-17
If a brother or sister is naked and lacks daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and eat your fill,” and yet you do not supply their bodily needs, what is the good of that? 17 So faith by itself, if it has no works, is dead.

Jesus Christ, the judge of all humankind, has his own criteria, which he will use to appoint people to either eternal life or to the eternal lake of fire. Matthew 25:31-46

Ed Parenteau said:

An inheritance is not something you earn. The believer is given eternal life upon believing.

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An inheritance is also something you can reject through your own disobedience.

John 3:36
Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever disobeys the Son will not see life, but must endure God’s wrath.

Ed Parenteau said:

An inheritance is not something you earn. The believer is given eternal life upon believing.

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Your first statement is true and your second statement is false. If your second statement was the case, then why would Jesus have said things like this...

Revelation 2:10 Do not fear any of those things which you are about to suffer. Indeed, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison, that you may be tested, and you will have tribulation ten days. Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life.

This is just talking to true believers here. I don't see anywhere here where Jesus guaranteed that all of them would "be faithful until death" after being tested. I don't see anything here where He says He would ensure that they would be faithful until death. If that was the case, why would He talk about them being tested? Would He test His own ability to ensure that they remained faithful? Of course not. It was their responsibility to remain faithful to Him. It's not about earning the inheritance of eternal life, it's about staying faithful to the One who promises eternal life to those who submit themselves to Him. Putting one's trust entirely in Christ is not a case of earning eternal life. Only if someone was putting trust in themselves or something else or someone else besides Christ could it be said that they were trying to earn eternal life.

Jan001 said:

If you had been locked out of Eden, would you have repented of the sin that caused your eviction? I certainly would have.


Grace is what saves me.

I am saved by grace; I maintain this grace by cooperating with the Holy Spirit in my soul, who helps me obey the Law of Christ. If I continue in his grace until my death, I will be approved to inherit eternal life.

Law of Christ:

Galatians 6:2
Bear one another’s burdens, and in this way you will fulfill the law of Christ.

James 2:15-17
If a brother or sister is naked and lacks daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and eat your fill,” and yet you do not supply their bodily needs, what is the good of that? 17 So faith by itself, if it has no works, is dead.

Jesus Christ, the judge of all humankind, has his own criteria, which he will use to appoint people to either eternal life or to the eternal lake of fire. Matthew 25:31-46

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Spiritual Jew said:

Your first statement is true and your second statement is false. If your second statement was the case, then why would Jesus have said things like this...

Revelation 2:10 Do not fear any of those things which you are about to suffer. Indeed, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison, that you may be tested, and you will have tribulation ten days. Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life.

This is just talking to true believers here. I don't see anywhere here where Jesus guaranteed that all of them would "be faithful until death" after being tested. I don't see anything here where He says He would ensure that they would be faithful until death. If that was the case, why would He talk about them being tested? Would He test His own ability to ensure that they remained faithful? Of course not. It was their responsibility to remain faithful to Him. It's not about earning the inheritance of eternal life, it's about staying faithful to the One who promises eternal life to those who submit themselves to Him. Putting one's trust entirely in Christ is not a case of earning eternal life. Only if someone was putting trust in themselves or something else or someone else besides Christ could it be said that they were trying to earn eternal life.

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I believe crowns are rewards to be earned and not a condition of salvation to the "true" believer or else the following verses are false.
They are unconditional and in the present tense.
John 11:25
25Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. Whoever believes in Me will live, even though he dies. 26And everyone who lives and believes in Me will never die. Do you believe this?”
27“Yes, Lord,” she answered, “I believe that You are the Christ, the Son of God, who was to come into the world.”
John 3:16
For God so loved the world that He gave His one and only Son, that everyone who believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life.
John 5:24
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.
1 John 5:13
I have written these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that you may know that you have eternal life.
John 6:47
Truly, truly, I tell you, he who believes has eternal life.

Much of the new testament is a dichotomy between the true and false--false apostles, false teachers, false brothers, false prophets and the tests that reveal the true from the false. A true believer keeps His commandments and the false don't. He has removed our hearts of stone and put a heart of flesh in it's place with the commandments written on them making us a new created people for His purpose and to do His will. But if we sin, we have Jesus as our advocate before the Father, and if Jesus be for us, who can be against us?

Ed Parenteau said:

I believe crowns are rewards to be earned and not a condition of salvation to the "true" believer or else the following verses are false.

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Jesus was not talking about a literal crown when He referred to the crown of life. The crown of life symbolically represents eternal life. You don't think that a condition of salvation is being faithful until death? You don't think someone has to be willing to suffer and even die for Christ in order to be saved in the sense of how scripture talks about being saved if we endure to the end?

Matthew 10:21 “Now brother will deliver up brother to death, and a father his child; and children will rise up against parents and cause them to be put to death. 22 And you will be hated by all for My name’s sake. But he who endures to the end will be saved.

Luke 21:17 And you will be hated by all for My name’s sake. 18 But not a hair of your head shall be lost. 19 By your patience possess your souls.

How is what Jesus said above any different than saying that those who are faithful until death will receive the crown of life?

The context of Revelation 2:10 is in relation to not being hurt by the second death. So, that means it's talking about being given eternal life rather than suffering eternal death.

Revelation 2:10 Do not fear any of those things which you are about to suffer. Indeed, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison, that you may be tested, and you will have tribulation ten days. Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life.11 “He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. He who overcomes shall not be hurt by the second death.” ’

Ed Parenteau said:

They are unconditional and in the present tense.
John 11:25
25Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. Whoever believes in Me will live, even though he dies. 26And everyone who lives and believes in Me will never die. Do you believe this?”
27“Yes, Lord,” she answered, “I believe that You are the Christ, the Son of God, who was to come into the world.”
John 3:16
For God so loved the world that He gave His one and only Son, that everyone who believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life.
John 5:24
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.
1 John 5:13
I have written these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that you may know that you have eternal life.
John 6:47
Truly, truly, I tell you, he who believes has eternal life.

Much of the new testament is a dichotomy between the true and false--false apostles, false teachers, false brothers, false prophets and the tests that reveal the true from the false. A true believer keeps His commandments and the false don't. He has removed our hearts of stone and put a heart of flesh in it's place with the commandments written on them making us a new created people for His purpose and to do His will. But if we sin, we have Jesus as our advocate before the Father, and if Jesus be for us, who can be against us?

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Your understanding of those verses is flawed. Those verses refer to the hope of inheriting eternal life. That's why John 3:16 talks about those who believe will not perish but will have eternal life. The time when people perish, which refers to the second death, is the day of judgment in the future. That is when believers will inherit eternal life as well. We don't currently have eternal life. We look forward to inheriting it. We have the hope and promise of eternal life as long as we remain faithful until death. We must be faithful until death in order to receive eternal life. The crown of life is not a literal crown, but rather symbolically represents the eternal life that we will inherit when Jesus comes in the future as long as we are faithful unto death (or until He returns, whichever comes first).

The context of the following verse is in relation to the time in the future when Jesus comes with His angels.

Matthew 25:46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”

Romans 2:6 God “will repay each person according to what they have done.” 7 To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life.

Ed Parenteau said:

I believe crowns are rewards to be earned and not a condition of salvation to the "true" believer or else the following verses are false.
They are unconditional and in the present tense.
John 11:25
25Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. Whoever believes in Me will live, even though he dies. 26And everyone who lives and believes in Me will never die. Do you believe this?”
27“Yes, Lord,” she answered, “I believe that You are the Christ, the Son of God, who was to come into the world.”
John 3:16
For God so loved the world that He gave His one and only Son, that everyone who believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life.
John 5:24
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.
1 John 5:13
I have written these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that you may know that you have eternal life.
John 6:47
Truly, truly, I tell you, he who believes has eternal life.

Much of the new testament is a dichotomy between the true and false--false apostles, false teachers, false brothers, false prophets and the tests that reveal the true from the false. A true believer keeps His commandments and the false don't. He has removed our hearts of stone and put a heart of flesh in it's place with the commandments written on them making us a new created people for His purpose and to do His will. But if we sin, we have Jesus as our advocate before the Father, and if Jesus be for us, who can be against us?

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Thank you for sharing your views.

Spiritual Jew said:

Your understanding of those verses is flawed. Those verses refer to the hope of inheriting eternal life. That's why John 3:16 talks about those who believe will not perish but will have eternal life. The time when people perish, which refers to the second death, is the day of judgment in the future. That is when believers will inherit eternal life as well. We don't currently have eternal life. We look forward to inheriting it. We have the hope and promise of eternal life as long as we remain faithful until death. We must be faithful until death in order to receive eternal life. The crown of life is not a literal crown, but rather symbolically represents the eternal life that we will inherit when Jesus comes in the future as long as we are faithful unto death (or until He returns, whichever comes first).

The context of the following verse is in relation to the time in the future when Jesus comes with His angels.

Matthew 25:46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”

Romans 2:6 God “will repay each person according to what they have done.” 7 To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life.

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That's not what the grammar teaches. Asking Google AI to compare John 3:16 and John 5:24 in the Greek.

In John 5:24, the phrase "has eternal life" uses the verb ἔχει (echei), which is the present indicative active form of the same verb (ἔχω).
While both verses promise eternal life, shifting from the subjunctive mood in John 3:16 to the indicative mood in John 5:24 completely alters the grammatical perspective from a stated purpose to an absolute present fact.

1. Mood: Potential Purpose vs. Present Reality​

• John 3:16 (ἔχῃ - Subjunctive): This is the mood of potentiality and design. It answers the question "Why did God give His Son?" The answer is: so that believers might have life. It looks forward to the intended outcome.
• John 5:24 (ἔχει - Indicative): This is the mood of absolute certainty and objective fact. It answers the question "What is the immediate status of the person who hears and believes?" The answer is: they possess it right now. There is no "might" or "should" here; it is an undeniable reality.

2. Tense Aspect: Continuous Design vs. Continuous Possession​

Both verbs are in the present tense, which means they both carry an ongoing, continuous aspect. However, they apply that continuity differently:

• In John 3:16, the present subjunctive emphasizes the continuous flow of the life intended for the believer.
• In John 5:24, the present indicative emphasizes current, linear duration in time. The moment a person hears and believes, they enter a state of continuous possession that stretches into the future.

3. The Structural Shift​

The surrounding grammar in John 5:24 locks this assurance into place with three distinct clauses:

1. Present Possession: "ἔχει ζωὴν αἰώνιον" — He currently and continuously has eternal life.
2. Future Immunity: "εἰς κρίσιν οὐκ ἔρχεται" — He does not come into judgment (a present tense used with a futuristic certainty).
3. Completed Transition: "μεταβέβηκεν ἐκ τοῦ θανάτου εἰς τὴν ζωήν" — He has already crossed over from death into life. This uses the perfect tense, meaning an action happened in the past with ongoing, permanent results.

Summary of the Comparison​

John 3:16 establishes the grand divine purpose that eternal life be available to all who believe, while John 5:24 applies that purpose as a shattering present reality for the individual believer.
Would you like to look at the perfect tense verb for "crossed over" (μεταβέβηκεν) in John 5:24 to see how it guarantees this present possession,