A whites-only community in Arkansas looking to start a franchise in Missouri

Stopped_lurking · May 24, 2026

Landon Caeli said:
Im not an expert on Chinese clan culture, and that was a bad link.

...I'm learning and comparing as I go on this, with an open mind, and I'm proud of that. I think Chinese clan culture, and whites-only communities in the U.S. are about the same thing.

Sweden don't think that openly racist behaviour is non-problematic in Sweden, China, or in the US. We are not perfect we have some historical laws that reach into today, for example to be considered Saami you need to have a parent, grandparent, or great-grandparent who spoke a Sámi language at home or have a parent who is or was on the electoral register (for the Saami parliament) (this is according to my personal understanding, it might be wrong!). However, rules made in historical contexts do muddy the waters a little but most think racial (to be fair, not even the most problematic think in terms of race but ethnicity) discrimination is a an explicitly bad thing. The reason I suspect is that the individual is considered of most weight, not any group they are part of.

Landon Caeli · May 24, 2026

Stopped_lurking said:
Sweden don't think that openly racist behaviour is non-problematic in Sweden, China, or in the US. We are not perfect we have some historical laws that reach into today, for example to be considered Saami you need to have a parent, grandparent, or great-grandparent who spoke a Sámi language at home or have a parent who is or was on the electoral register (for the Saami parliament) (this is according to my personal understanding, it might be wrong!). However, rules made in historical contexts do muddy the waters a little but most think racial (to be fair, not even the most problematic think in terms of race but ethnicity) discrimination is a an explicitly bad thing. The reason I suspect is that the individual is considered of most weight, not any group they are part of.

In the United States, in order to be a member of a native tribe, one has to have a certain percentage of their DNA aligned with the bloodline of the tribe in order to move in, and live on the reservation.

Looking at the Sami people, they seem very similar to Native Americans, in that they prefer tribalism to seperate themselves from others.

...I don't think the Sámi, or the American Indians are any more wrong than Tibetans or uyghurs... But, I wonder, should the white people in the OP be considered more wrong? Should they be vilified for their tribalism, and not the others?

FreeinChrist · May 24, 2026

Native Americans didn't move onto Reservations for a desire to be together as a tribe. They were moved to reservations by whites using armed force often while their tribal lands were taken (stolen per NAs) for white settlement. There was no room for NAs in the white settlements.

A prime example is the Indian Removal Act of 1930 under Andrew Jackson. The Cherokees were forced to leave their ancestral homes in the southeast to Oklahoma which was a harder place to live as they had been. This was done to increase the amount of land devoted to cotton, and to take resources like gold. The Seminole were also forced to leave their home because of the same act. Their lands had provided a safe haven for escaped slaves, and cotton farmers couldn't have that!

If a group such as the Chinese Americans were do do the same thing as this group in the OP, I best it would not be acceptable.

RDKirk · May 24, 2026

Landon Caeli said:
In the United States, in order to be a member of a native tribe, one has to have a certain percentage of their DNA aligned with the bloodline of the tribe in order to move in, and live on the reservation.

I don't think DNA counts; DNA would just show North American indigenous genetics, which is a far cry from being a member of a particular tribe. I think a person has to show direct relationship to someone on the historical tribal roles, regardless of DNA.

That's why there are black Americans with no DNA relationship whose family names are on Okahoma tribal registers because their families were brought as slaves in those tribes from the East coast. After Emancipation, they separated from those tribes--but their names are still on the rolls.

Landon Caeli · May 24, 2026

FreeinChrist said:
Native Americans didn't move onto Reservations for a desire to be together as a tribe.

But many Native Americans do desire to be together as a tribe. It works essentially the same as any clan system throughout the world.

Scotland, for example, had many clans until the British government subsequently passed a series of laws to crush the traditional clan system and dismantle Highland culture.

Scottish clans:

Stopped_lurking · May 24, 2026

Landon Caeli said:
In the United States, in order to be a member of a native tribe, one has to have a certain percentage of their DNA aligned with the bloodline of the tribe in order to move in, and live on the reservation.

Looking at the Sami people, they seem very similar to Native Americans, in that they prefer tribalism to seperate themselves from others.

...I don't think the Sámi, or the American Indians are any more wrong than Tibetans or uyghurs... But, I wonder, should the white people in the OP be considered more wrong? Should they be vilified for their tribalism, and not the others?

For me personally, yes. I would wish that persons are judged by their individual characteristics first. The Saami people was forced into their ethnicity long before the rest of society thought it ok to be Saami. It is an anachronistic twist, not something to try to emulate.

They don't live in reservations or anything like that.

durangodawood · May 24, 2026

Landon Caeli said:
But many Native Americans do desire to be together as a tribe. It works essentially the same as any clan system throughout the world.

Scotland, for example, had many clans until the British government subsequently passed a series of laws to crush the traditional clan system and dismantle Highland culture.

Scottish clans:

If USA had a population of, say, Welsh people who kept their Welsh culture and traditions in some serious way, I could understand them wanting to make a "Welsh community".

But just "whites" only, thats pure racial exclusivity born from a history of vicious racism.

Laodicean60 · May 24, 2026

essentialsaltes said:
Orwoll contends RTTL’s criteria reflect “shared ancestral values,” not hatred or violence

There shouldn't be a Only anything. But if they allow this they should allow the Muslim one in texas.

essentialsaltes · May 24, 2026

Laodicean60 said:
There shouldn't be a Only anything. But if they allow this they should allow the Muslim one in texas.

No such thing. The EPIC plan is open to all.

RDKirk · May 24, 2026

Laodicean60 said:
There shouldn't be a Only anything. But if they allow this they should allow the Muslim one in texas.

An important difference is whether or not it's set up in an already-incorporated city or township.

But I'd agree that there shouldn't be an "only" anything on the scale of a town or village.

There are still "sundown towns" around the US, but at least today they're just exits on the Interstate that I zoom past at 70mph. I remember as a kid before the Interstates became ubiquitous that we had to drive right down the middle of such towns on any highway journey.

Hans Blaster · May 24, 2026

Landon Caeli said:
...I don't think the Sámi, or the American Indians are any more wrong than Tibetans or uyghurs... But, I wonder, should the white people in the OP be considered more wrong? Should they be vilified for their tribalism, and not the others?

'white' is not a tribe. It is a broad nebulous category without coherence.

RDKirk · May 24, 2026

Hans Blaster said:
'white' is not a tribe. It is a broad nebulous category without coherence.

"White" is not a tribe, but "Anglo-American" is somewhat more definable (or at least recognizable) as a culture, and includes more than "white" people.

Immigrants from southern and eastern Europe were not considered exactly "white" except to the extent that they assimilated into Anglo-Americanism.

FreeinChrist · May 24, 2026

Landon Caeli said:
But many Native Americans do desire to be together as a tribe. It works essentially the same as any clan system throughout the world.

But the Native Americans did not create the reservation system nor where their reservations would be. That was decided by the US government.
They live on the reservation for monetary reasons as well.

Tinker Grey · May 24, 2026

Hans Blaster · May 24, 2026

RDKirk said:
"White" is not a tribe, but "Anglo-American" is somewhat more definable (or at least recognizable) as a culture, and includes more than "white" people.

Wouldn't "Anglo-American" be a subset of "white"? Not all of us pale, Euro-Americans are from Blighty.

RDKirk said:
Immigrants from southern and eastern Europe were not considered exactly "white" except to the extent that they assimilated into Anglo-Americanism.

Oh, I know.

Tinker Grey · May 24, 2026

RDKirk said:
An important difference is whether or not it's set up in an already-incorporated city or township.

But I'd agree that there shouldn't be an "only" anything on the scale of a town or village.

There are still "sundown towns" around the US, but at least today they're just exits on the Interstate that I zoom past at 70mph. I remember as a kid before the Interstates became ubiquitous that we had to drive right down the middle of such towns on any highway journey.

You sent me down a rabbit hole. Most of the websites report historical sundown towns.

But, there is a fair indication that such towns, official or not (hence your quotes), exist. I can't guess what the actual risk is.

However, it sickens me that anyone should have to consider such things in the US. I'm sorry.

Landon Caeli · May 24, 2026

FreeinChrist said:
But the Native Americans did not create the reservation system nor where their reservations would be. That was decided by the US government.
They live on the reservation for monetary reasons as well.

Well yes, that's true, I think I may have misunderstood your point. I think at the same time though, the Native Americans were already tribespeople living amongst each other, and would remain that way going forward with or without the US intervention in their lives.

FreeinChrist · May 24, 2026

Landon Caeli said:
Well yes, that's true, I think I may have misunderstood your point. I think at the same time though, the Native Americans were already tribespeople living amongst each other, and would remain that way going forward with or without the US intervention in their lives.

Probably as it was for safety and there was a community effort for food. At least then.

Bradskii · May 24, 2026

Landon Caeli said:
Is it illegal in Australia, for completely private groups, such as clubs, to dictate who may or may not be a member based on religion, ethnicity, or any other possible condition they choose, including skin color?

Yes. Summary from AI:

In Australia, private clubs cannot legally discriminate based on race. Federal legislation, specifically the Racial Discrimination Act 1975, makes it unlawful to treat someone less favourably or deny them opportunities based on their race, colour, descent, or ethnic origin in public life—which includes clubs and associations.

While private clubs are exclusive, Australian anti-discrimination laws strictly regulate their membership and guest policies.

RDKirk · May 24, 2026

Tinker Grey said:
You sent me down a rabbit hole. Most of the websites report historical sundown towns.

But, there is a fair indication that such towns, official or not (hence your quotes), exist. I can't guess what the actual risk is.

However, it sickens me that anyone should have to consider such things in the US. I'm sorry.

When I was in high school, this was in 1969, our school played a basketball game against a still-for-sure sundown town in Oklahoma. We had very strict rules: Nobody went there in a private vehicle, we all rode the school bus. We got off the bus, went right into the gym, stayed in the visitor's bleachers, did not leave for snacks or anything, went in small groups to the restroom, played the game, got back on the bus, and drove straight out of town.

A whites-only community in Arkansas looking to start a franchise in Missouri

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