When did the anti-Israel stance start from the right?

It says that at one time israel will be alone. It’s part of that in the last days. Even America will abandon her. If pres trump does not get re-elected than sooner rather then later. But the rapture should be before this big war where they stand alone. But they have God and a few tricks up their sleeve when it happens- the war, and all Israel will be saved- the remnant.

I believe there is a place for criticizing the Israeli governments war involvement, the indiscriminate killing of innocents and children. I don't believe that is being antisemitic at all. However, abusing people simply because they are Jewish is antisemitic and it is a blight on the Church of God that is often heard within its walls.

It is a bad development. The camp of the saints ( Revelation 20:9 in relation to Revelation 20:1-15 ) comes to mind. Also John 4:21-26 & Romans 11:1-36, I believe, tells us to at least take notice of such matters.

Unqualified said:

If pres trump does not get re-elected…

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He’s ineligible for reelection.

A generational shift. Millenials and Gen Z often don't have the same sentiments about Israel as Boomers. Less holocaust guilt and Christian zionism. Younger Evangelicals tend towards amillenialism or post-millenialism, not dispensationalism.

There are two Israel's - an unredeemed nation and the family of faith.

The religion of the first is openly dismissive of Jesus.

There is plenty of evidence to suggest they plan to build the third temple.

Some think this will hasten the second coming so it should be supported to accelerate events.

Should believers support a nation that plans the resumption of animal sacrifice while blatently rejecting the sacrifice of Jesus?

Solum Aeternum said:

I know not every conservative is a Christian but it’s still whiplash in many conservative forums where there’s a big anti Israel stance. Reading Fox News comments about Israel and its overwhelming negative forwards that nation. I’m Christian, go to church and the consensus I always “Israel is right, defend them always”. I'm A/G denomination if that helps. I don’t remember the vitriol towards them ever like this. I expected it from the left but never from the right. Are Christians simply in their own bubble and island at the moment?

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Christians are moving away from Dispensational Futurism. The AG has not and this could be considered the "bubble". I was once AG and a fervent end times Israel advocate. I even encouraged all jews to move back to israel. I am now ashamed I did such a thing as now I know about the dark motivations of this eschatology.
You will need to do your own research to find out the end game of this teaching.
That being said, once this lens is lifted we can see the true Israel. A secular nation.

Be blessed.

Threads of antisemitism have a long history on the right. Things like Henry Ford championing "America First" and blaming 'the Jews' for getting the US into wars maps almost perfectly onto the rage today, with a little shift of the topic from 'all Jews' to Israel specifically. Why did we get involved in this mess with Iran that's raising gas prices?

AI Overview [Google "anger on the right over israel and the iran war"]

• Perception of Manipulation: A growing faction of conservatives express anger over the belief that the Israeli government's regional goals have successfully dragged the United States into a massive, costly military engagement that primarily serves Israeli interests rather than American security

Solum Aeternum said:

I know not every conservative is a Christian but it’s still whiplash in many conservative forums where there’s a big anti Israel stance. Reading Fox News comments about Israel and its overwhelming negative forwards that nation. I’m Christian, go to church and the consensus I always “Israel is right, defend them always”. I'm A/G denomination if that helps. I don’t remember the vitriol towards them ever like this. I expected it from the left but never from the right. Are Christians simply in their own bubble and island at the moment?

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Thank you for your support, Solum.

Antisemitism comes in waves. It's like time is a spiral, and when it spirals around again, some of the past bleeds through. So history does repeat but never quite the same way. We always know that things can turn on a dime: the group that supports us today can seek to kill us tomorrow. It really is very sad, but we've learned the hard way that no one can be truly trusted not to hurt us.

The last holocaust survivor in my synagogue is now in an assisted living facility. But she would say, "I've seen this all before."

There are a gazillion books out there with different theories on the world's oldest hate, and they all have different theories. The problem is, there always seems to be some subtype somewhere that doesn't fit into their framework. Nor can anyone explain why antisemitism is so different than all other forms of racism. Usually if someone is racist, the object of their hate is stupid and lazy. But antisemites consider Jews clever and devious...

We know its related somehow to our monotheism. Antisemitism exists only in those areas of the world that are either Christian or Muslim in culture. India and China have absolutely no problem with Jews or Judaism.

Yes, you are right. We are getting it from both the right and the left. As a Jew I am politically homeless.

Add to that Muslim antisemitism, which is distinct; right now Muslim antisemitism is by far the most violent, the most powerful, and the financial force driving pundits, college protests, and social media bots. Most of the antisemites currently on the left and right are just poor chumps that have bought into the propaganda coming from the Muslim world.

And while it exists nowhere near the same levels as before the holocaust, there are still some Christian antisemites. It's quite common online for me to be told "The Jews killed Jesus," or "You reject God," or "You are the synagogue of Satan." My favorite: apparently I'm a communist waging war on Christianity and trying to make society secular.

I personally have given up trying to fix antisemitism. We have tried everything: assimilation, education, extraordinary acts of altruism.... It has all failed. My focus is now on our survival. I want to see us thrive despite antisemitism. And quite honestly, while we can't fix antisemitism, we do know what stops it. (See the Poway attack and Temple Israel attack).

Jeff Carr said:

I believe there is a place for criticizing the Israeli governments war involvement,

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Criticizing the Israeli government? Of course it's okay. Every Jew I know is Zionist and also deeply disturbed by Netanyahu's government.

Jeff Carr said:

the indiscriminate killing of innocents and children.

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Right, because dropping leaflets telling Gazans to leave the area because it is going to be bombed is the indiscrimiante cilling of innocents and children.

Tell me, do you spend equal time criticizing Hamas for using innocents and children as human shields?

Jeff Carr said:

I don't believe that is being antisemitic at all. However, abusing people simply because they are Jewish is antisemitic and it is a blight on the Church of God that is often heard within its walls.

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Here is the thing, Jeff. The people who are "anti-Israeli" and "anti-Zionist" are not attacking Israeli embassies. They are setting synagogues on fire, bombing Jewish preschools with children in them, and shooting Jewish families celebrating holidays at the beach. It's fine to criticize Israel--I do. But unless you are extraordinarily careful, you will find yourself in bed with antisemites who use anti-Zionism as a front to hate Jews. The fact that you are already crossing the line into inaccurate accusations should be setting off alarms and red flashinig lights.

Carl Emerson said:

There are two Israel's - an unredeemed nation and the family of faith.

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We are a TRIBE. It's probably a good idea to say it aloud: TRIBE. It helps for it to finally sink in. TRIBE.

Carl Emerson said:

The religion of the first is openly dismissive of Jesus.

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Oh, it's more than that and you know it. It's because both Christianity and Islam want to replace Judaism. Our continued existence digs at some of the very assumptions Christians have. If God did indeed form a covenant with us and send us the prophets, then rationally you would expect us to be the first CONVERTS. But we are the opposite. We are the one ethnicity that is most resistant to conversion efforts. That's a problem. That's a very deep and very serious problem for Christians, and IMHO the root of a 2000 year hatred.

Carl Emerson said:

There is plenty of evidence to suggest they plan to build the third temple.

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Very few Jews want this. Remember that the state of Israel HAS the Temple mount. Al Aqsa continues to exist only because Jews allow it to continue to exist.

Carl Emerson said:

Should believers support a nation that plans the resumption of animal sacrifice while blatantly rejecting the sacrifice of Jesus?

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Are you equally hateful of the first century Nazarenes who, under James, fully kept Jewish law including Temple sacrifices? Are you aware that the only reason that Paul was in the Temple in Acts 21 was to help some Nazarite Nazarenes complete their sacrifice for atonement?

I'd tackle your "Jesus is the sacrifice thing," but this is a Christian forum, and I am a guest. If you really want to know why, find a Jew and ask, and ask them somewhere that they feel free to answer.

essentialsaltes said:

Why did we get involved in this mess with Iran that's raising gas prices?

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Before the Iranian revolution in 1979, Iran was a close ally of both the US and Israel. It was a Muslim majority country, but had a secular state.

In 1979, Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini successfully led the revolution and became the religious leader of Iran, imposing Sharia. The US became the "Great Satan" and Israel became the "Little Satan." You must be young if you don't remember how Iranian students, with the support of Khomeini, took 52 American hostages and held them captive for 444 days. The truth is, Iran has been at war with the US and Israel ever since 1979. Much of it has been through proxies such as Hamas and Hezbollah.

But I guess the only thing you care about is gas prices.

Meowzltov said:

But I guess the only thing you care about is gas prices.

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I was only trying to diagnose why some elements of 'the right' [not me] are particularly upset about Israel right now. Gas prices don't affect me directly all that much.

essentialsaltes said:

I was only trying to diagnose why some elements of 'the right' [not me] are particularly upset about Israel right now.

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If we traced the money supporting pundits on the right, who or what do you think we would find?

Solum Aeternum said:

I know not every conservative is a Christian but it’s still whiplash in many conservative forums where there’s a big anti Israel stance. Reading Fox News comments about Israel and its overwhelming negative forwards that nation. I’m Christian, go to church and the consensus I always “Israel is right, defend them always”. I'm A/G denomination if that helps. I don’t remember the vitriol towards them ever like this. I expected it from the left but never from the right. Are Christians simply in their own bubble and island at the moment?

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My own belief is that it's because Israel has lost the moral high ground.

Meowzltov said:

We are a TRIBE. It's probably a good idea to say it aloud: TRIBE. It helps for it to finally sink in. TRIBE.


Oh, it's more than that and you know it. It's because both Christianity and Islam want to replace Judaism. Our continued existence digs at some of the very assumptions Christians have. If God did indeed form a covenant with us and send us the prophets, then rationally you would expect us to be the first CONVERTS. But we are the opposite. We are the one ethnicity that is most resistant to conversion efforts. That's a problem. That's a very deep and very serious problem for Christians, and IMHO the root of a 2000 year hatred.

Very few Jews want this. Remember that the state of Israel HAS the Temple mount. Al Aqsa continues to exist only because Jews allow it to continue to exist.

Are you equally hateful of the first century Nazarenes who, under James, fully kept Jewish law including Temple sacrifices? Are you aware that the only reason that Paul was in the Temple in Acts 21 was to help some Nazarite Nazarenes complete their sacrifice for atonement?

I'd tackle your "Jesus is the sacrifice thing," but this is a Christian forum, and I am a guest. If you really want to know why, find a Jew and ask, and ask them somewhere that they feel free to answer.

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Shalom - really appreciate your input.

I am travelling today so I will respond later -

Solum Aeternum said:

When did the anti-Israel stance start from the right?​

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It's always been there, it just goes in cycles.

The 'fun' thing about living in modern times is that the rapidity and availability of information, particularly algorithmically guided information, means that these cycles get quicker and the amplitude is greater.

There's LONG been an anti-Israel stance among US conservatives.

In the immediate wake of the 1948 formation of Israel, there were attempts to conflate the country's soft socialism/collectivisation as "Communism" and continue the decades long demonisation that associated Jews and Communism together.

There was also a decided 'anti-Zionist' camp among US conservative movements in the mid 1950s that portrayed Israel as Imperialist and advocated for a non-interventionist US policy. William F Buckly/National Review and other 'New Right' groups and figures peddled a sort of soft anti-Zionism, while more fringe figures like Willis Corto/Liberty Lobby, Robert Welch/John Birch Society and went MUCH harder into implied or explicit antisemitism.

The New Right's anti-zionism petered out in the mid to late 1960s, when Israel became a 'bulwark against Communism' in the Middle East. However, the hard rights antisemitism continued unabated, albeit somewhat more hidden from view/for internal consumption only.

The New World Order conspiracy theorism of the 1990s seems to have attracted a new round of public anti-Israeli sentiment from the right. Pat Buchanan's presidential candidacy seems really have drawn it out into the open.


If you want a (somewhat incomplete) history, then David Austin Walsh's Taking America Back, The Conservative Movement and the Far Right is probably the best guide to the subject. You can find it online without leaving the first page of Google.

Meowzltov said:

If we traced the money supporting pundits on the right, who or what do you think we would find?

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Mostly ad revenue from large numbers of viewers.

Meowzltov said:

If we traced the money supporting pundits on the right, who or what do you think we would find?

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A BUNCH of mid-sized supplement and alternative medicine companies, a few large companies (oil interests and private equity in particular, some defense & aerospace and tech) and a few dozen billionaires (Koch brothers, Adelson, Mellon, Musk, Andresseen, Fisher, Griffin, Schwarzman, Walton family etc, etc.)