LoveofTruth
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WHY WATER BAPTISIM HAD TO GO AWAY ??
- Thread starter Dan Perez
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You are creating a straw man argument, since that is not what I said. Peter not only water baptized Jews in Acts two but also water baptized Gentiles in Acts 10.
Paul did water baptize and was glad he did not baptize more for the Corinthians were using the person that baptized them to show distinction between themselves and other Christians, so Paul has to be talking only about water baptism, since people cannot Spirit baptize anyone.
Paul never talks about baptizing people with the Spirit and does not mention Spirit Baptism or that his Gospel sermons were Spirit baptism.
When did Water Baptism cease?
This “baptism by the Spirit” is never referred to as “Preaching of the Gospel”.
John’s water baptism was not something taught by the Jewish religious leaders and they did not submit to John’s baptism. Christian water baptism is not something the Jewish religious leaders were doing, so how is it part of Judaism?
Acts 10:46… Then Peter said, 47 “Surely no one can stand in the way of their being baptized with water. They have received the Holy Spirit just as we have.” 48 So he ordered that they be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ.
Peter has them water baptized in the name of Jesus Christ.
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The "Clear reason" is as Paul says: 1 Cor. 1:14 I thank God that I did not baptize any of you except Crispus and Gaius, 15 so no one can say that you were baptized in my name
Yes, anyone can do the actual water baptizing, but only Paul could give a powerful Spirit led sermon, so he needed to use his time wisely preaching.
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LoveofTruth
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No straw man whatsoever, you are saying exactly that. You are implying that since Peter water baptized the Jews in Acts 2 we should also and dance Peter water baptized the Gentiles in Acts 10 we should also.
So you are saying that if they did something in acts we should also. But we see believers who were Jewish going to the temple and sacrificing and circumcising and keeping the whole law and Jewish customs zealously all through Acts as well. We even see Paul circumcise Timothy in Acts 16 yet he would not circumcise a gentile in Galatians 2 Titus. These matters are important as to why they did or didn’t do things. There is a context and time of transition or reformation when the old covenant was decaying fading away ready to vanish.But it hadn’t vanished for done yet.
I showed that Paul told why Christ sent him not to baptize but you seem to not see what the text says .Paul said he was not sent to baptize lest the cross of Christ should be of no effect.perhaps read again what I wrote.
I never say men baptize with the Spirit. Although Paul did lay hands on some and also said he wanted to impart some spiritual gift to them. .
The teaching or preaching of the word ,when believed baptizes or immerses them in the name etc.
Hebrews 9 talks about the diverse washings (baptismos in Greek) and carnal ordinances imposed until the time of reformation. You don’t seem to address Hebrews 9 much.
While Peter spoke words in Acts 10 the Holy Ghost fell in them that believed.
The diverse washings were many in OT. Johns figurative shadow of water baptism was among the many diverse washings the Jews did have many outward washing in water as well .So in Acts they were also doing these OT washings.
Peter was asking a question, and he was still under the law and following John water baptism as we see in Acts 11
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And I yet to see where Paul ever BAPTIZED with WATER. // HYDOR and do you have a verse and I know and
READ 1 Cor 1:13. !!
dan p
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Paul says: 1 Cor. 1:14 I thank God that I did not baptize any of you except Crispus and Gaius, 15 so no one can say that you were baptized in my name
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Again I am not saying we should promote water baptism, just because Peter did it, but because Christ told us in the Great Commission to baptize and preaching the gospel alone to people is not baptizing them. We have Paul baptizing people, Philipp baptizing people including gentiles, and we have secular history of people Christian baptizing people. We are never told not to baptize people and we can see the benefits of being baptized even today.
You left off the reason he gave: 1 Cor. 1: 15 so no one can say that you were baptized in my name.
Laying on of hands is never called baptizing them.
Again, at least some of the water baptisms were in the name of Christ.
Diverse Washings might be described as baptisms, but immersion water baptism would not have to be included in diverse washings.
So you are saying it was not Peter’s words that baptized them, but the Holy Spirit, so if we are called upon to baptize people it could only be water baptism?
OT washings were done by the existing believer for cleansing and not like a burial.
No that does not come across in Acts 11.
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LoveofTruth
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A note:
Jeremiah 4: 14. O Jerusalem, wash thine heart from wickedness, that thou mayest be saved. How long shall thy vain thoughts lodge within thee?”
There washing has always been inward in the heart we also read of circumcising the foreskin of the heart etc. And Christ shaker dwell in our hearts by faith.
Jeremiah 4: 14. O Jerusalem, wash thine heart from wickedness, that thou mayest be saved. How long shall thy vain thoughts lodge within thee?”
There washing has always been inward in the heart we also read of circumcising the foreskin of the heart etc. And Christ shaker dwell in our hearts by faith.
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LoveofTruth
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Yes, you did imply this by using Peter’s actions in Acts 2 and 10
No, there is no water mentioned in Matthew 28x and it’s interesting how you put baptize (not the actual word baptizing) before preaching . The scripture again shows the reverse order and it is talking about another kind of immersion (baptism) in the name of…we never see this as a formula for water baptism in scripture. Not even once. So did apostles get that wrong?
The verse should read
Matthew 28: 19. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:”
Notice the teaching is doing something in the power of the Lord which is “baptizing” or immersing them in or into the bane… I’ve already discussed this in length here in.
And part of the clue to understanding what going in or into a nabe means is in scripture as well. Jesus taught them the word kept them in the name of the Father and manifested the name John 17 .
The burden is on you to show the order in Matthew 28.
And it is not saying that hen directly baptize. It says the teaching is immersing of baotizing in…
There are many baptism in scripture and only one saving baptism and that baptism is not into water. The saving baptism is into christ by the Spirit. When a person hears snd believes the goodies by faith he then enters into or is immersed into the grace (which is in Christ) by the Spirit who baptized all believers into the body of Christ.
Romans 5: 1. Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ: 2. By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.”
And Christ shall dwell in our hearts by faith, faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God.
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved. When a person truely believes (has faith) then he will be baptized into Christ bybyhevSpirit.
Yes, he did this so few times and said Christ sent him not to baptize, but to preach the gospel et. Paul also circumcised but was not sent to do it either and went into the temple where sacrificing was directed . But I’ve already discussed the transitional and reformations aspect of Acts.
Philip was a Jew and the Jews were bringing all into the sane state they were in which was still following OT covenant to some degree and in Acts 8 they hadn’t got to Acts 15 yet.
We Aldo see that Peter was trying to make the Gentiles live like the Jews in Galatians 2, and Paul withstood him for this as well. We can safely understand that Philip also was still in some measure under the old covenant and law as many other Jewish believers were at that time.
We have lots of confusion on secular history of many things being done. The error of Infant baptism for salvation was taught in history way back by many and is taught today as well. Lots of error cane in early.
Paul said Christ sent him not to baptize… lest the cross of Christ be made of no effect.
But it would seem that if men want to still dunk under water and do a ritual. I would not lighteth them as long as they do not do it for salvation or attack those who believe from scripture that it was to fade away with the other diverse washings in the time of reformation right after Christ death.
That was in relation to them misunderstanding and becoming carnal in sectarianism. They used baptism as a connection to the different leaders. Paul addressed this then said “besides” and pushed aside all water baptism talk and said besides Christ sent him not to baptize.
It may not be called baptizing them. But we do see when some laid hands on others they would be baptized with the Holy Ghost and Paul said he desired to impart some spiritual gift.
I thought they were all to be in the name of the Father and of the Son and the Holy Ghost according to your understanding of Matthew 18?
Did they get that wrong? According to your understanding?
We never see them fondest.
And to water baptize is still the sane outward act as Johns water baptism. But the “one baptism” is by the Spirit into Christ
Who said it wouldn’t. outward washings don’t wash the heart .
It doesn’t say we are called to water baptize. It says teaching …baptizing…in the name
Read the immersion in it in the Jordan river .The type of the Jordan river related to death to the old.
Yes it does, directly. Peter even mentions Johns water baptism there relating it to what he was trying to do.
And remember Peter was trying to make the Gentiles live like the Jews.
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