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Is enforcement of immigration laws wrong?

2PhiloVoid

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Romans chapter 13, 1 peter 2:13, and Titus chapter 3 teach us to obey the law. Is illegal immigration ungodliness? Is it rebellion against God's government authorities?

What is legal and what is ethical are not necessarily synonymous. Keep this in mind as this mess is sorted out.
 
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weary2025

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What is legal and what is ethical are not necessarily synonymous. Keep this in mind as this mess is sorted out.
If Gods government authorities say its illegal to come inside the US in an illegal way, how is that wrong? Does this mean we Christians should go around violating the immigration laws of every nation?
 
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2PhiloVoid

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If Gods government authorities say its illegal to come inside the US in an illegal way, how is that wrong? Does this mean we Christians should go around violating the immigration laws of every nation?

If the government suddenly began to insist and litigate by pronouncing that Jesus isn't the Christ and that no one should worship Him and that we should instead vow allegiance to asserting that only 'Caesar is god," should be obey? (This is what happened to Christians in the 1st to 3rd centuries in Europe).

Government acting within the parameters which God decides only includes those laws that keep the general order, not specifics that may be drawn upon and which are included, however covertly, over theological, ontological or even specific ethical principles.

Sure, the government has the authority to pronounce what is currently illegal, but that in and of itself, doesn't finalize whether or not the laws involved are either ethical or approved by God. We don't want to commit the fallacy of Hasty Generalization from a very tiny passage from the 13th chapter of Paul's letter to the Romans.
 
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Hentenza

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Why is enforcement of immigration laws bad? Every nation does it. Its called law and order
It is not unless you violate your own constitution. The 4th amendment is foundational to the rule of law and the actions of ICE are not reasonable. A police force should never discriminate by the color of someone’s skin or the language one speaks. There is no physical or appearance difference between a legal Hispanic immigrant and an illegal Hispanic immigrant. So the issue is not the present laws but the unlawful and immoral administration of the immigration laws. Secondly, a race should not be demonized by an administration in order to get people to justify discrimination. These are not the values of a free society that is mainly composed of immigrants.
 
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Hentenza

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If the government suddenly began to insist and litigate by pronouncing that Jesus isn't the Christ and that no one should worship Him and that we should instead vow allegiance to asserting that only 'Caesar is god," should be obey? (This is what happened to Christians in the 1st to 3rd centuries in Europe).

Government acting within the parameters which God decides only includes those laws that keep the general order, not specifics that may be drawn upon and which are included, however covertly, over theological, ontological or even specific ethical principles.

Sure, the government has the authority to pronounce what is currently illegal, but that in and of itself, doesn't finalize whether or not the laws involved are either ethical or approved by God. We don't want to commit the fallacy of Hasty Generalization from a very tiny passage from the 13th chapter of Paul's letter to the Romans.
That is true which is why my use of these verses in Romans 13 is general rather than nuanced. Many Christians died during the first century persecutions because they refused to do the immoral and unethical bidding of the governing bodies. That’s well documented.
 
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2PhiloVoid

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That is true which is why my use of these verses in Romans 13 is general rather than nuanced. Many Christians died during the first century persecutions because they refused to do the immoral and unethical bidding of the governing bodies. That’s well documented.

.... yes, that, and the fact that my view of immigration isn't tempered by a generic (and often misunderstood) application of what Paul says, but rather by a more nuanced application of how 'Moses' delineated what SHOULD BE more or less the permits by which people of God value (or condemn) strangers from other nations who come 'into our country.'

Obviously, the U.S. isn't Israel, but for a nation that likes to tout its identity as a new 'Light on a Hill,' one would think the immigration laws would be consistently more prone to reflecting Old Testament (and even New Testament) parameters. Unfortunately, that's not what we see today, from the Left or the Right.
 
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jacks

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To answer the question Is Enforcement of Immigration Laws Wrong?

I'd say the answer is No. No country in the world lacks immigration laws. Every nation has some form of immigration policy or legal framework governing who may enter, reside, work, or naturalize within its borders.

I think the controversy is how they are being enforced. It seems the pendulum has perhaps swung too far. For awhile we basically didn't enforce them, now we are enforcing them in a drastic manner. Hopefully we as a society will find a workable balance.
 
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Tuur

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Take your pick to verify the facts.
FYI
The data showing a shift in targeting toward individuals without criminal records—including those with legal status—comes from a variety of sources, including non-partisan organizations and the government’s own statistics.
For instance, TRAC (Transactional Records Access Clearinghouse), a non-partisan data research center at Syracuse University, tracks ICE's own internal numbers. Their reports from February 2026 show that 73.6% of current ICE detainees have no criminal convictions. Similarly, the Cato Institute, a prominent libertarian think tank that frequently supports conservative fiscal and limited-government policies, published an analysis of leaked ICE data in late 2025. Their findings confirmed that nearly three out of four people booked into ICE custody had no criminal record, which they noted directly contradicted the administration's public emphasis on "criminal aliens."
Even FactCheck.org, which focuses on verifying claims regardless of party, noted that the percentage of detainees with no convictions or pending charges jumped from roughly 15% in early 2025 to over 42% by January 2026. While the administration's official position, as stated on the DHS website, is that they focus on "criminal illegal aliens" and national security risks, the data reported across these diverse organizations—ranging from libertarian to academic—consistently shows that the net has been widened to include non-criminals and those who were previously considered "low priority" or legally present.
Well, there is one. Your secular argument equates a lack of priors with innocence. Not so. A first offender is still an offender despite the lack of priors. Overstaying a visa or being in the US illegally is a violation of the law. Period. Don't like the law? Lobby to change it.
 
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Tuur

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i believe to get papers in usa is really hard,
and someone told it can take years.
if you come from europe with money i think is a lot easier.
That could be why they risk getting in illegally
Eh...not necessarily. Money makes many things easier regardless of point of origin. Why someone is in the US illegally varies. But, having known naturalized citizens, who were not necessarily well off, becoming a US citizen isn't impossible.
 
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Fantine

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It makes me sick to think that some Christians look to their Bibles in order to self-righteously feel justified for jettisoning the "tired, poor, huddled masses yearning to breathe free."

Hopefully your Christian beliefs have taught you what God/Jesus is all about, including his two great commandments. Stop looking for loopholes to wiggle out of being the kind of people God wants you to be.
 
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Hentenza

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It makes me sick to think that some Christians look to their Bibles in order to self-righteously feel justified for jettisoning the "tired, poor, huddled masses yearning to breathe free."

Hopefully your Christian beliefs have taught you what God/Jesus is all about, including his two great commandments. Stop looking for loopholes to wiggle out of being the kind of people God wants you to be.
The Holy Scriptures is what Christians look for guidance not in the doctrines of man. The scriptures teach the Christian the way of life taught by Jesus and the apostles. The scriptures teach that hatred of things are against the teachings of Christ and that we must work for those in need. However, the secular authorities have laws that we, as Christians, need to follow but always with an eye to the Christian scriptural teachings. It’s disturbing that you throw your own brothers and sisters under the bus simply because they go to the Holy Scriptures for guidance.
 
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Platte

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Under our Constitution, everyone in the United States should enjoy certain fourth amendment rights.

ICE is operating outside the Constitution. They are not immigration officers, they are a poorly-trained paramilitary force who have arrested and detained thousands of citizens unlawfully and even killed innocent people in cold blood.

They are invading homes without warrants.

When the "law" is being broken by those who are supposed to enforce it, and when "the Law" is being interpreted by a 39 times convicted felon who breaks the law daily and dares Congress and the Courts to stop him, this Bible verse does not apply.

ICE is acting unlawfully.
What would really help is if those people who are not here legally would self report and/or self deport. That reporting would give them a legal avenue to their fourth amendment rights (which they really don't have as non citizens but we do generally provide selective constitutional rights at our discretion - for example they don't have 2nd amendment rights). That would limit ICE interations and or neccessity. Those trying to remain in the U.S. without reporting or deporting are putting themselves, other illegals, and U.S. citizens at risk.
 
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Fantine

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What would really help is if those people who are not here legally would self report and/or self deport. That reporting would give them a legal avenue to their fourth amendment rights (which they really don't have as non citizens but we do generally provide selective constitutional rights at our discretion - for example they don't have 2nd amendment rights). That would limit ICE interations and or neccessity. Those trying to remain in the U.S. witho3ut reporting or deporting are putting themselves, other illegals, and U.S. citizens at risk.
You do realize our workforce will be depleted, prices will rise, and tax revenues decreased because of the purging of immigrants, the overwhelming majority honest and hardworking.
I daresay most of them work harder in a week that our uninformed, impulsive, avaricious chief executive works in a whole year. I hope the good ones ride it out till we trade him in for a better model.
 
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Hentenza

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You do realize our workforce will be depleted, prices will rise, and tax revenues decreased because of the purging of immigrants, the overwhelming majority honest and hardworking.
I daresay most of them work harder in a week that our uninformed, impulsive, avaricious chief executive works in a whole year. I hope the good ones ride it out till we trade him in for a better model.
That’s nonsense. Nothing like this happened during the Clinton, Bush, and Obama administrations and they deported millions of illegal immigrants during their respective administrations. The problem that I have is not that illegal immigrants need to be deported but the way that the Trump administration is going about it.
 
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iarwain

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Democrats seem to always oppose the law. First it was "defund police." Now its demonize ice. But is this love and is it godliness?
I've seen those protestors and how they behave. They didn't seem to be spreading much love from I could see, they were cursing ICE, fighting with ICE, throwing objects at them, and were just generally all around obnoxious.
 
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weary2025

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I've seen those protestors and how they behave. They didn't seem to be spreading much love from I could see, they were cursing ICE, fighting with ICE, throwing objects at them, and were just generally all around obnoxious.
Thats rebellion against God's government authorities. Its a sin that provokes God's wrath
 
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weary2025

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I've seen those protestors and how they behave. They didn't seem to be spreading much love from I could see, they were cursing ICE, fighting with ICE, throwing objects at them, and were just generally all around obnoxious.
Thats rebellion against God's government authorities. Its a sin that provokes God's wrath
 
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