Hans Blaster
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Do atheists constantly change the goalposts?
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partinobodycular
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I'll take door number three... the evidence is irrelevant.
Yes, that's a choice some make.
Would the following words be any less meaningful to you if Jesus never lived?
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Most definitely, yes. It would be much, much less meaningful. At least it would be to me. If you take a bite of Sartre or Nietzsche, you'll know what I'm talking about.
And don't forget----I'm not cut out of the same cloth as the typical, evangelical brand Christian. And I never have been. So, I do see the world a bit differently and more contingently than they do, or even than does the typical Humanist.
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Well, you know us Historical Philosophers. We're just full of academic jibberish that you only hear in the halls of those other buildings on the university campus. Y'know, the ones you never visit.
No, not exactly. It's not necessary; and its sufficiency will depend on the person. No Jesus, no religion. Know Jesus, Know Eternity.
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Obviously, historical facts have to be interpreted and never really sit in isolation, even if they can be written or said in isolation.
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Hans Blaster
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Really, I don't (even know what those are).
Turns out I did go to that building, I just didn't notice them. It was a small department.
No, that's not how it works. Who is a Christian just because Jesus was a man?
Sounds too long.No Jesus, no religion. Know Jesus, Know Eternity.
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- Oct 28, 2006
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I've been here all along.
Size doesn't always matter. It's quality over quantity.
I never said anyone is a Christian merely because someone made a singular, isolated statement like, "Jesus was a man."
Why I'm being interpreted as if that's what I've said, I don't know.
That's sad to hear. But we can just drop this discussion right here since we both know where it leads to.
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Hans Blaster
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I thought you said "analytic". I never heard of "historical".
Is 20 faculty small? Some of the departments I was in were smaller.
That is the only thing we have been discussing -- why Jesus being a man who actually existed doesn't demonstrate any of the extraordinary claims. (And how it isn't "moving the goalposts" to say so.
Really, it does sound rather boring.
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Philosophy is a many roomed mansion, Hans. Sort of like that other many roomed mansion you live in----science.
I don't know. You're the one who said it seems smallish.
Maybe it is the only thing you think you've been discussing, but if you've studied Historiography, you'd realize it's never really that simple.
Somehow, I doubt it will be.
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Hans Blaster
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It was small compared to the physics department. I'm not the one who went to philosophy school. I don't know what a small or large department in that field is, but 20 faculty would definitely be a small physics department at a research university.
Are you trying to generate an argument?
Thankfully I won't have to worry about it.
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Yes, I know that's often the contrast between Philosophy and Science departments.
Nope.
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essentialsaltes
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Well, maybe cast your lot with those who would support the trivium.
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I’m not sure you understand the whole concept of what moving the goalposts means. You responded to something that had nothing to do with Jesus being God and moved the goalposts to include that as the topic of the conversation.
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Stopped_lurking
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Not all examples of widening the discussion is moving the goalposts. It is only if you discard evidence of a specific claim and demand other evidence of the same specific claim. That don't seem to be the case here.
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Hans Blaster
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The whole thing with the size of the departments sure seems like it as well. Don't know any philosophers. The closest I got was one work-study coworker who was majoring in philosophy. Just never had any interest and can't really think of much that seems less interesting. (Though, I did spot you discussing something even less appealing -- theology. Sorry, but it just is.)
I've got no soul to be tortured by infinite existence.
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stevevw
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I was pointing out that the alternative metaphysics are actually about belief. Material atheists will believe that reality is fundementally naturalistic or physical. All causes happen within this paradigm. Correct.
Wheres if God is creator then for the theist they believe reality is fundementally supernaturaal. Or was created by the supernatural. Rgiught Gid uses nature.
The difference is that for the material atheist Gods creation, nature is given the creative power. But they are both metaphysical beliefs so it would be natural that goal posts are alwasy changing. They don't even start from the same premise.
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Bradskii
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Whut? I simply pointed out the obvious fact that accepting that there was someone called Jesus has nothing to do with accepting that He is divine. It has nothing to do with God. Unless you also accept that what He was reported to have said and did is true.
I can't make that any clearer.
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Hans Blaster
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Too bad this boring garbage is not the subject of the thread.
I never followed the Rgiught Gid or thought reality was fundamentally supernaturaal.
Technically Steve, what you are doing is not a goalpost shift, but a -- Look! Squirrel!
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Actually, according to the very argument in the OP, that is exactly the case. Go back and read the OP to verify for yourself.
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