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Europe needs to calm down about Greenland

Michie

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Is the United States about to invade Greenland?

If you listen to EU politicians and much of the U.S. legacy media, and actually take them seriously, then you might answer “yes.” President Donald Trump is going to unleash Delta Force to spirit away the prime minister before we nuke Nuuk (the capital of Greenland) and send in the Army to mop up survivors.

If you’ve followed this issue from the beginning and have tried to accurately understand how the president operates, then you should conclude that this brouhaha is all about negotiating. You also may think that the U.S. is just pursuing a long-term policy more vigorously, and that our allies in Europe really need to chill.

The issue of Greenland suddenly popped back up in the news recently, and I kid you not, because White House adviser Stephen Miller’s wife posted this on X.

This sent the European elite straight to their oft-used fainting couches, which they had to stay firmly emplaced on when Trump himself weighed in and said he still aims to acquire Greenland. This has been his goal since 2019 and has been, off and on, a U.S. strategic aim since the 19th century.

Continued below.
 

Helmut-WK

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Is the United States about to invade Greenland?
One never knows.
If you’ve followed this issue from the beginning and have tried to accurately understand how the president operates, then you should conclude that this brouhaha is all about negotiating.
OK, but what should we negotiate about?
There is a right of self-determination to any people, including Greenlanders (Innuits and Danes).

But Trump seems to wanr negotiations which do not include the Greenland people. Something like »I want Greenland«, what you do want to get for it«?

Well, if he really wants that, he may offer New-England (it could be renamed to New-Denmark, and of course it would enjoy the same autonomy than Greenland has by now). That would be a fair deal - land vs- land - and of course there will be negotiations about the size resp. the border line between USA and New Denmark.

The amount of agreement to such a deal would be, I guess, about the same in Greenland and New England.
 
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stevevw

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Is the United States about to invade Greenland?

If you listen to EU politicians and much of the U.S. legacy media, and actually take them seriously, then you might answer “yes.” President Donald Trump is going to unleash Delta Force to spirit away the prime minister before we nuke Nuuk (the capital of Greenland) and send in the Army to mop up survivors.

If you’ve followed this issue from the beginning and have tried to accurately understand how the president operates, then you should conclude that this brouhaha is all about negotiating. You also may think that the U.S. is just pursuing a long-term policy more vigorously, and that our allies in Europe really need to chill.

The issue of Greenland suddenly popped back up in the news recently, and I kid you not, because White House adviser Stephen Miller’s wife posted this on X.

This sent the European elite straight to their oft-used fainting couches, which they had to stay firmly emplaced on when Trump himself weighed in and said he still aims to acquire Greenland. This has been his goal since 2019 and has been, off and on, a U.S. strategic aim since the 19th century.

Continued below.
Lol I think thats because the media has TDS and are fixated already on everything Trump and bringing him down. The slightest sniff of a story involving the very thing they have been trying to narrate for 10 or more years now would be irresistible.

If Obama said the same thing then it would have been ok and a good and reasonable idea.

But your right this is the art of the deal and business. That is Trump forte. He is a business negociator. He is applying the same approach in politics and I think it works sometimes.

Look at waste and corruption. He brings in Musk to forensically check the books. A brilliant mind when it comes to efficency and finances. They discover billions in waste and fraud.

Trump bluffed Hamas with a straight faced proposition like in business and a deadline or the deals off. Hamas capitulated and released the hostages.

He always starts with hyperbole and extreme ideas to get the attention. Then the negociations begin. He says what he means and does what he says and people take it seriously. The good thing is its actually changed things in a very short time.

Look whats happened under his watch. The Isreali hostages released, Irans nuclear capability wiped out and no longer a threat to the world. Following up with further threats and now Iran is experiencing a revolution and people are rising up against the regime after all these years.

Captures Maduro and Venezuelans live in hope of freedom and democracy. Trump has negociated around another 6 peace deals around the world. Virtually has stopped the drugs and illegals coming in the US. This saving billions in dollars and millions in lives.

People may not agree with his approach but it sure has changed the world order in a short time. Before this it was the same old story of radicals continuing to get away with doing what they were doing and no one stopping them. Sending the message that its ok. Well now they know its not ok anymore lol.

Gee having done all that I think he deserved Greenland lol. Only joking.

But I don't think its about territory or installing some absuive dictatorship. Trump is stopping dictators and bringing freedom to people. He is stopping terrorists and criminals who want to destroy those freedoms. He is giving the people back their rights and power. I don't think he would negate all that and become a dictator like Maduro who is murdering people and stealing all the money and selling drugs to kill people.

I am sure this is about negociating more control and rights for the US to that territory because it is an extention of the north American continent and should be part of the US territory as far as security and access.

Not necessarily to take over as a dictator but a reasonable and logical forward thinking reality for US and world security. That the US is now acting as owner and should be given the rights to that territory militarily and politically. Not necessarily sovereignty.
 
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Helmut-WK

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Look at waste and corruption. He brings in Musk to forensically check the books. A brilliant mind when it comes to efficency and finances. They discover billions in waste and fraud.
… and much of this turns out to be no waste. Cuts that cost lives, e.g. USAID.
Trump bluffed Hamas with a straight faced proposition like in business and a deadline or the deals off. Hamas capitulated and released the hostages.
No, that's simply not true. Hamas only released the hostages when Qatar (a strong supporter of Hamas) urged to do so, and Qatar did so after it was bombed by Israel, which did this without informing the US before.
Look whats happened under his watch.
OK …
The Isreali hostages released
As I explained above, this happened while Trump is president, but he has as much to do with that as with the latest earthquake.
Irans nuclear capability wiped out and no longer a threat to the world.
There is no proof for that, nor is a proof to the contrary. We can only guess.
Following up with further threats and now Iran is experiencing a revolution and people are rising up against the regime after all these years.
It were no any threats from abroad, it was the economic crisis which made the people revolt. And despite his annoncements, Trump doe nothing to stop the killing of several thousand persons. It seems the revolt is dying out by now, like any revolt before. There were far more protesters than in former revolts, there are far more death causalities (even 100+ dead iranian law enforcement members, the protest have been very heavy). But I can't see any positive result.
Captures Maduro and Venezuelans live in hope of freedom and democracy.
Really? MMaduro's Vice-President is now president, she makes a deal with Trump, what hope for democracy is there?
Maybe she even made a secret deal with Trump: I give Maduro to you, you let me be president. This would explain why the operation was so precise.
Trump has negociated around another 6 peace deals around the world.
Most of them ended quickly. In the Middle East, there is no real peace, Hamas still in power in Gaza (they have lost the military confrontation, like in that »cast lead« operation, it took more than ten years to launch the next strong attack in 2023), but got sympathies all over the world (absurd, but fact). In the eyes of Hamas & Co., it is a sort of victory.
Virtually has stopped the drugs and illegals coming in the US.
Any facts that prove this assertion?
People may not agree with his approach but it sure has changed the world order in a short time.
Yes. Putin and Xi now can point to Trump if anyone wants to blame then on their actions (Ukraine and future actions of Putin, Taiwan in case of Xi). Million people which depended on USAID are in despair by now, and hate the USA. A good situation for anyone who wants to recruit terrorists. The Ukraine in total despair, and the short-term objective of Putin (alienate the USA from her allies) is next to complete. The long-terms goals (destroy the USA, get Alaska and dominate Eastern Europe) will still have to wait, but from a Russian point of view there is hope Trump will be of more help in the future.

Yes, big changes, but change does not automatically mean things are better.
But I don't think its about territory or installing some absuive dictatorship.
Can we be sure?
Trump is stopping dictators
… only to install new dictators. Can you name any democrat that replaced a dictator due to Trump? Rodríguez (same as Maduro, only more open to make a deal)? al-Sharaa in Syria (islamist, former ally of ISIS)?
I don't think he would negate all that and become a dictator like Maduro
He is more like Erdoğan or other dictators that prefer softer means to make sure they win the next election.
I am sure this is about negociating more control and rights for the US to that territory because it is an extention of the north American continent and should be part of the US territory as far as security and access.
Yes, when one wants to enlarge a basis, which is there because of a treaty, the best way to negociate about that i to say: I want the territory, not just a treaty or renting, I want to own it, it is personal to me. //irony off
That the US is now acting as owner
The owner are the Greenlanders. They fought hard to get self-government from Denmark, and now they should be sold like cattle to the USA?
Not necessarily sovereignty.
In that point, you obviously disagree with Mr. Trump.
 
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Tuur

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The owner are the Greenlanders. They fought hard to get self-government from Denmark, and now they should be sold like cattle to the USA?
And the Lousisiana Purchase? What about Alaska? What about the Gadsden Purchase? The US Virgin Islands? Florida? Were the peoples there sold like "cattle," too?
 
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Vambram

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And the Lousisiana Purchase? What about Alaska? What about the Gadsden Purchase? The US Virgin Islands? Florida? Were the peoples there sold like "cattle," too?
Unfortunately, too many people don't remember our history. I am very glad that the USA bought the Louisiana Purchase, Alaska and those other lands as well.
 
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stevevw

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… and much of this turns out to be no waste. Cuts that cost lives, e.g. USAID.
Thats a straight out falsehood. Even this week they are discovering billions of dollars in waste and fraud. Already this is the biggest fraud in US history. Thats not just waste but plain outrigh theft.
No, that's simply not true. Hamas only released the hostages when Qatar (a strong supporter of Hamas) urged to do so, and Qatar did so after it was bombed by Israel, which did this without informing the US before.
The Isrealis themselves thanked Trump for his help. Trump setup the 20 point ceasefire plan and part of that was freeing the hostahes. Trump then said that all hell would break loose if the hostages were not freed and a few days later they were released.

Its obvious to most people that Trump had a hand in this. That you don't acknowledge this shows bias.

As surviving hostages are released, Israel celebrates Trump as a hero
There is no proof for that, nor is a proof to the contrary. We can only guess.
Lol, the US bombed Irans nuclear base. Of course its a setback to Irans nuclear capabilities and helps world peace that they are set back at least. You can't bring yourself to acknowledge Trump has helped stop evil people and done good by this.
It were no any threats from abroad, it was the economic crisis which made the people revolt. And despite his annoncements, Trump doe nothing to stop the killing of several thousand persons. It seems the revolt is dying out by now, like any revolt before. There were far more protesters than in former revolts, there are far more death causalities (even 100+ dead iranian law enforcement members, the protest have been very heavy). But I can't see any positive result.
If Obama did this he would be hailed a hero. I think you spectulate to early and one sided. I will hope that the revolution keeps rising and not get negative and dismiss it because you hate Trump. I think this time it will happen. This time its different.
Really? MMaduro's Vice-President is now president, she makes a deal with Trump, what hope for democracy is there?
Every hope as like you said she now deals with Trump and if Trump just took out the president do you think that they are going to allow the VP to start working with the Narcos and stealing all the oil and money.

Plus this is something the people are behind. Once again a rising up of people given hope by Trump. Even the rightly elected president of Venezuela María Corina Machado who recieved the Nobel Peace prize acknowledged Trumps intervention as the most significant change towards democracy and was willing to share the Nobel Peace prize with Trump.
Maybe she even made a secret deal with Trump: I give Maduro to you, you let me be president. This would explain why the operation was so precise.
Actually you may be right. Though I heard it was key military personel who stood down to allow Maduro to be taken. This only shows that the Venezuelans were working with Trump to get rid of Maduro. There is no new secret diciatorship going on.
Most of them ended quickly. In the Middle East, there is no real peace,
Actually they are still ongoing. The middle east deal is still ongoing and it is working so far. The others have not ended. One was just signed 2 weeks ago.
Hamas still in power in Gaza (they have lost the military confrontation, like in that »cast lead« operation, it took more than ten years to launch the next strong attack in 2023), but got sympathies all over the world (absurd, but fact). In the eyes of Hamas & Co., it is a sort of victory.
Yes they are deluded. All I can say is watch this space. I don't think having come this far that they are going to just let Hamas stay in power. They will be gone by years end I reckon. Then the rebuild begins. I think we will see a new and different Gaza in the near future.
Any facts that prove this assertion?
Obviously I meant where Trump has targeted the imports. Border crossings of illegals has virtually come to a stand still. Obviously along with that the drugs they tried to sneak in. But also the drug boats have just about stopped from Venezuela. Thats probably going to save 1,000s of lives and stop the chaos and problems associated.
Yes. Putin and Xi now can point to Trump if anyone wants to blame then on their actions (Ukraine and future actions of Putin,
Show where Trump has invaded another nation. He has only help free them the exact opposite of dictatorship. You seem to really hate Trump and will deny any good he has done. That seems bias.
Taiwan in case of Xi). Million people which depended on USAID are in despair by now, and hate the USA.
It seems all the people around the world, the Christians in Nigeria, the Venezuelans and other south American nations and Iran under dictatorships are calling for Trump to help them. They see the good he is doing.
A good situation for anyone who wants to recruit terrorists.
How, the terrorist are reducing. They are being defied and the people are rising up against such evil. People are sick of the terror.
The Ukraine in total despair, and the short-term objective of Putin (alienate the USA from her allies) is next to complete. The long-terms goals (destroy the USA, get Alaska and dominate Eastern Europe) will still have to wait, but from a Russian point of view there is hope Trump will be of more help in the future.
If thats been their aim all along then I think the US is a lot safer under Trump than say Biden.
Yes, big changes, but change does not automatically mean things are better.
True but I also don't think its as bad as you make out. There is a lot of good that has happened.
Can we be sure?
I think so. Trump has never done such a thing in 10 years.
… only to install new dictators. Can you name any democrat that replaced a dictator due to Trump? Rodríguez (same as Maduro, only more open to make a deal)? al-Sharaa in Syria (islamist, former ally of ISIS)?
How says that the VP is being allowed to act as a dictator. She stated she would cooperate. Its early days so we will have to wait and see. But so what getting Maduro is good full stop. He was indicted and is now facing justice for the evil he has done.
He is more like Erdoğan or other dictators that prefer softer means to make sure they win the next election.
Really, soften dictatorship. Thats silly. You could say all presidents are soft dictators with that measure. He is more a negociator. The middle man who brings parties together to achieve a better outcome.
Yes, when one wants to enlarge a basis, which is there because of a treaty, the best way to negociate about that i to say: I want the territory, not just a treaty or renting, I want to own it, it is personal to me. //irony off
Ok fair enough. We will have to wait and see,. But I suspect it will end like all the other false claims that Trumps a dictator. Going nowhere.
The owner are the Greenlanders. They fought hard to get self-government from Denmark, and now they should be sold like cattle to the USA?
I agree that the Greenlanders should have the right to remain a sovereign nation.
In that point, you obviously disagree with Mr. Trump.
Yes if it comes down to taking a nations sovereignty against their will. Of course. How could they justify Isreals rights if they then deny a nation in their own region.

I don't necessarily agree with Trump on everything. I am just pointing out some good things I think he has done.

The whole Greenland thing will have to play out legally and an an internations court. But I don't think it will get to that. It may even blow over for a while while negociations are sorted or not.
 
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Helmut-WK

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And the Lousisiana Purchase? What about Alaska? What about the Gadsden Purchase? The US Virgin Islands? Florida? Were the peoples there sold like "cattle," too?
Yes, because they were not asked. Which was normal in monarchies (Like Napoleon).

There is the right of people to determine their fate by themselves. Introduced by US president Wilson, mote than a hundred years ago.

It seems you want to end that right. Do you also want to abolish other human rights?
(And please, don't come with the old Kremlin slogan »human rights are only a weapon for our enemies«)
 
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Tuur

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Yes, because they were not asked. Which was normal in monarchies (Like Napoleon).
That's really precious, particularly since the US approached Napoleon about buying New Orleans and Napoleon went "How much will you give us for the whole thing?"
 
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Helmut-WK

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That's really precious, particularly since the US approached Napoleon about buying New Orleans and Napoleon went "How much will you give us for the whole thing?"
But you agree that this was before the right of self-determination was proclaimed by the USA?
 
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Tuur

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But you agree that this was before the right of self-determination was proclaimed by the USA?
No, I don't, because the US was founded in 1776 and the Louisiana Purchase didn't happen until 1803.
 
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Helmut-WK

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No, I don't, because the US was founded in 1776 and the Louisiana Purchase didn't happen until 1803.
1776 is about the right to start a revolution, not about the right of the inhabitants of greater Louisiana to be asked whether they want to be purchased by the USA (not to mention the question whether the Indians there have a right to be asked).

Self-determination was proclaimed during WW I., by president Wilson.
 
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rebornfree

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Is the United States about to invade Greenland?

If you listen to EU politicians and much of the U.S. legacy media, and actually take them seriously, then you might answer “yes.” President Donald Trump is going to unleash Delta Force to spirit away the prime minister before we nuke Nuuk (the capital of Greenland) and send in the Army to mop up survivors.

If you’ve followed this issue from the beginning and have tried to accurately understand how the president operates, then you should conclude that this brouhaha is all about negotiating. You also may think that the U.S. is just pursuing a long-term policy more vigorously, and that our allies in Europe really need to chill.

The issue of Greenland suddenly popped back up in the news recently, and I kid you not, because White House adviser Stephen Miller’s wife posted this on X.

This sent the European elite straight to their oft-used fainting couches, which they had to stay firmly emplaced on when Trump himself weighed in and said he still aims to acquire Greenland. This has been his goal since 2019 and has been, off and on, a U.S. strategic aim since the 19th century.pĺ
Continued below.
I doubt that we in Europe are going to calm down when we see an overseas territory, of a close neighbour and ally, being regarded as a piece of land up for grabs and the wishes of its population not even considered. The USA might like Greenland but it belongs to others and they have their own laws and culture which they want to keep. Katie Miller’s post is extremely offensive.

If Trump wants to negotiate for more military bases there, then do so with Greenland's and Denmark's Governments. In fact, it's probably a good idea to have NATO bases within the Artic Circle in several countries. Even querying with the Governments, about whether Greenland would like to become American, would be okay as long as he accepted their answer with no ill feeling. Stating that you're having something which is not yours, and is not up for sale, is not acceptable. As for our elite taking to their fainting couches, maybe it's because we've learnt the lessons of the last century and we don’t like seeing another country's sovereignty being threatened.
 
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stevevw

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I think in Europe nations claiming a land which is actually within the American noth continent and completely seperate from mainland European continent seems a little unreal.

I mean the US has to regard Greenland as an extension of their territory as its part of their territory. To then say a nation in a different territory should be the guardian and have overseering rights to everything that goes into protecting and securing such a region seems rediculous.

Its like saying that someone in another suburb is responsible for the house next door to me. When my property actually is part of the neighbouring property and they are in another suburb. Its logical that as Greenland is part of the US territory as a continent and its an extention of their territory for which needs to be secured. That the US have rights to this.
 
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Tuur

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I doubt that we in Europe are going to calm down when we see an overseas territory, of a close neighbour and ally, being regarded as a piece of land up for grabs and the wishes of its population not even considered. The USA might like Greenland but it belongs to others and they have their own laws and culture which they want to keep. Katie Miller’s post is extremely
A good illustration of irreconcilable differences between the US and Europe. We’re not going to see eye-to-eye on this, particularly being that Western Europe regularly changed territories and supported such well into the 20th Century.

I would not be surprised if the US and EU end up coming to blows within our lifetime. It’s not just Greenland; our differences are that great and will only increase.
 
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Akita Suggagaki

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Little Anthony must get his way.
1768593437172.jpeg
 
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rebornfree

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I think in Europe nations claiming a land which is actually within the American noth continent and completely seperate from mainland European continent seems a little unreal.

I mean the US has to regard Greenland as an extension of their territory as its part of their territory. To then say a nation in a different territory should be the guardian and have overseering rights to everything that goes into protecting and securing such a region seems rediculous.

Its like saying that someone in another suburb is responsible for the house next door to me. When my property actually is part of the neighbouring property and they are in another suburb. Its logical that as Greenland is part of the US territory as a continent and its an extention of their territory for which needs to be secured. That the US have rights to this.
Well, if someone in another suburb owned the house next door to you it would be their responsibility. However, I think that Greenland is self-governing so I'm not sure how much say Denmark would have in its future. I appreciate that it is in North America, but if it was to be part of another country, on geographic grounds, it would make more sense for it to become part of Canada. However, I think that some of its citizens want it to remain a Danish Territory and others want independence from Denmark. So why would they want to be part of another country?

Even if it wasn't for the Danish connection I think Europe would concerned about Trump's attitude towards it. It's not just land; it's people's homes and way of life. You can't just say that you are going to have someone else's property and ride roughshod over their thoughts and feelings.
 
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