my eclectic view of futurism

I was raised in a Lutheran Protestant household that lacked all of the contemporary interest in future prophecy. Nevertheless, we as a family noticed something significant, prophetically, in 1967 with the 7 Days War. And I began to study biblical prophecy and the book of Revelation.

When I became engaged with the Jesus People and young Christian revival movements in the early 70s, there was a focus on Dispensationalism, and I pursued an interest in Futurist eschatology with a Dispensationalist slant. But it wasn't long before a number of inconsistencies became obvious to me, and I had trouble harmonizing all of the beliefs.

I then turned to a systematic approach to prophetic interpretation, looking for significant markers in biblical history where certain truths became determinative in all that followed. For example, important prophetic markers would be Abraham's Covenant promises and Daniel's Dream. What resides in these events provide an important backdrop for the rest of biblical prophecy.

And instead of following a particular prophetic school I became convinced that even if one school is better than another it was likely that other schools were held together by a few strands of important prophetic truths. I wasn't going to let a flawed school keep me from accepting something they saw and others rejected strictly because their truths came from another, flawed school.

Dispensationalism has carried most of the weight in building assumptions surrounding various interpretations of relevant passages of the Bible. It views the 70th Week of Daniel 9 as future and disconnected from the previous 69 Weeks mentioned there. And it views the "Abomination of Desolation," mentioned in both Dan 9 and Matt 24, as a reference to the Antichrist.

The Book of Revelation was looked at by Dispensationalists as separated into two parts, the present Church Age and the final 7 years of Antichristian rule. The Church would be Raptured just before the rise of Antichrist, coinciding with John's Rapture to Heaven to see his visions. What followed would be 7 years of Antichristian rule prior to the Battle of Armageddon and Christ's 2nd Coming.

Dispensationalists typically view Postribulationists as anachronistic to Futurist belief, even though many of them are Futurists. And they view Preterists as antithetical to Futurism, even though some of their beliefs can be held to by Futurists. For example, the belief by Preterists that much of the Olivet Discourse is about the fall of Jerusalem in 70 AD can be held to along with Futurist beliefs.

So, this is where I've come out. I believe the 70th Week of Daniel was fulfilled at the death of Christ. And I believe the Abomination of Desolation was fulfilled when the Roman Army defeated Jerusalem in 70 AD. I'm also a Postribulationist who believes in a future 3.5 year Reign of Antichrist with the Church being Raptured at the end of this period. And I believe the Olivet Discourse was focused primarily on the fall of Jerusalem in 70 AD, with the Roman Army being the Abomination of Desolation, and this event taking place literally in Jesus' generation, followed by a long age of Jewish exile, also called the "Great Tribulation."

I believe though discussion of the various issues sometimes leads to "bad blood," approaching the differences in a friendly way can have a positive effect. After all, we are pursuing Scriptural truth, which God gave to us for our edification. So I invite any and all takers on the issues I've raised?

keras said:

Douggg and I have batted the Prophetic Word around for years. He has not changed his stance and neither have I.
Other than a reference to the end time Anti-Christ and John 4:1, which does not prove a rapture of Christians, Douggg does not prove his points with scripture.
Here is my understanding of what will happen, supported by many scriptures. Anyone who thinks I have used a verse in the wrong context, please show me, I do not claim to know it all.

The enemies of the Lord gather - Micah 4:11-12, Ezekiel 36:2
They conspire to attack Israel - Psalms 83:1-8, Isaiah 21:2
They prepare their weapons - Psalms 7:12, Ezekiel 7:14
This is the situation today.

At the moment of attack, God will use His Creation, the sun to send fire; the entire energy wave spectrum.- Deuteronomy 32:22 & 34-43, Isaiah 30:26 & 30, Psalms 11:4-6, Isaiah 66:15-17, 2 Peter 3:7, Amos 1:1-15 & 2:1-5 , Psalms 50:1-3, Zephaniah 3:8, Revelation 6:12-17

The sun will explode with an extremely bright flash and the moon will reflect bright red - Isaiah 30:26, Joel 2:31, Acts 2:20, Habakkuk 3:4-5

The Lord will make their weapons recoil upon themselves, the Electro-Magnetic Pulse hit will cause them to explode - Psalms 7:13-16, Joel 3:4, Obadiah 15

Then the sun, moon and stars will be obscured by the approaching Coronal Mass Ejection - Psalms 18:11-12, Isaiah 13:9-13, Ezekiel 32:7-8, Amos 8:9, Joel 2:1-2

A huge superhot mass of hydrogen plasma approaches the earth – Joel 1:15-20, Malachi 4:1, Zephaniah 1:14-18

Everyone on earth will be shocked and terrified - Jeremiah 6:24-26, Ezekiel 21:5-7a, Isaiah 13:6-8, Revelation 6:15-17

The atmosphere will be pushed aside – Revelation 6:14, 2 Peter 3:10, Isaiah 34:4

The whole earth will be enveloped by fire - Isaiah 66:15, Zeph. 3:8, 2 Peter 3:7

In the Holy Land, only a remnant will survive - Zechariah 13:8-9, Isaiah 6:11-13

He will punish His enemies, the attackers of Israel- Psalms 83, Isaiah 63:1-6, Habakkuk 3:12, Revelation 14 18-20, Isaiah 66:17, Isaiah 29:20-21, Hebrews 10:27

His enemies will become ashes - Malachi 4:3, Ezekiel 30:1-5, Jeremiah 49:2, Matthew 3:12b

Millions will die around the world - Psalms 97:3-5, Jeremiah 25:33, Isaiah 13:12

The Lord will protect those who call to Him - Isaiah 43:2, Joel 2:32, Acts 2:21

But many people will take shelter until it passes. Isaiah 2:19, Revelation 6:15

The survivors will form a One World Govt. - Daniel 7:23-24, Revelation 17:12

The Holy Land will be regenerated - Ezekiel 36:8, Joel 2:21-24, Isaiah 35:1-10, Amos 9:13-15, Jeremiah 33:12-14

And the Lord's faithful Christian peoples will gather there. - Psalms 107, Isaiah 35:1-10, Ezekiel 34:11-16, Isaiah 66:18b-21, Revelation 7:9-14

They will become the new nation of Beulah - Isaiah 62:1-5, Ezekiel 36:3-38, Jeremiah 31

They will build a new Temple – Zechariah 6:15, Haggai 2:9, Ezekiel 40 to 48

An attack by a Northern army will be won by the Lord – Ezekiel 38:22, Joel 2:20

The leaders of Beulah will break the Covenant with the Lord and sign a 7 year peace treaty with the leader of the O.W.G. Daniel 9:27, Isaiah 28:14-15

At the midpoint he will break the treaty and conquer Beulah-Daniel 9:27, Zechariah 14:1-2

Commencing the 7 Trumpets and 7 Bowls of the Great Tribulation - Rev 8:2 to Rev 19:10

Those who kept their faith in God will be taken to a safe place on earth. Daniel 11:32b, Revelation 12:14 The ’many’ who agreed to this 7 year Treaty, must remain. Revelation 12:17

3.5 years later, Jesus will Return in His glory, for His Millennial reign - Revelation 19:11-21, Matthew 24:30-31, Zechariah 14:3-4

The Lord has told us His plans and He will not relent or change them - Jeremiah 4:28
There are plenty more prophecies and scriptures to prove this scenario.
Believe it or not it’s up to everyone to decide! Psalms 19:11-12, Isaiah 48:6

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My problem with your scenario is that you seem to think the Scriptures comprise a puzzle which the shrewd person can piece together and come up with a last day series of events. In reality, many of these prophecies, far from being specific, are largely intended to provide a picture of God's character, in Salvation and in Judgment. Why on earth would there be some mystical insight into the last generation when all previous generations are equally important?

In fact, I think that much of what the book of Revelation says about the last generation is intended to inform Christians all during the ages because they go through similar things. While it's true that we can look back and see many prophecies that provided pieces of the Messiah's life, nobody really used them to anticipate him as by a crystal ball or secret code. They were designed to help the generations in which these prophecies were given because they went through similar experiences. And they were designed to confirm who Christ was after he had come.

I don't put much stock in trying to predict the future. If we know God today we'll have a good bead on where history is going. And the prophecies of Revelation will confirm this when the time comes. In the meantime we should recognize how these prophecies can help us today. That's my view, and I'm sticking with it.

keras said:

Because Jesus said:- The generation that sees the fig tree bud, that is; the Jews back as a nation in the Holy Land, THEY will see it all. Matthew 24:32-22
WE are that generation.

I view your policy of chewing over the Prophesies and making them into unintelligible mush, as a crime against the Prophets. It simply leaves people in the dark.

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"Criminal?" Well, I suppose you think that's a real Christian way of discussing differences? Such desperation does not suggest reasonable thought about what the Prophets meant.

The "generation" Jesus spoke of I believe referred to his own generation. He was warning about the utter annihilation of the Temple. All the signs preceeding that, and the annihilation itself, did take place in his generation.

Jesus was warning about an immediate need--not making predictions about the future in order to glorify the prophets who were able to "hear from God."

keras said:

Judah is the fig tree and Israel is the vine. The Biblical metaphors for todays Jewish State of Israel and the ten Northern tribes, still scattered around the world. Note that Jesus said Judah would bud and break into leaf, but not to bear fruit. We Christians are the Vine; are the peoples who bear the fruit of the Holy Spirit. Matthew 21:43
It is simply impossible to make the first Century people fit Matthew 24:32-34

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Actually it's impossible to state, positively, that the "fig tree" in this context means "Israel." In context we are told that the budding of the fig tree refers to signs of the imminent destruction of the Temple. Stating your own opinion is not the same as what the Bible states.