WHEN WAS THE LAW TAKEN AWAY. AND GRACE BEGAN. ??

Dan Perez · Dec 5, 2025

# 1 IN ////. EN. is a PREPOSTION

# 2. THAT HE SAITH //// LEGO. is. in. the PRESENT TENSE in. the ACTIVE VOICE

# 3 A. NEW. //// KAINOS. in. the ACCUSATIVE CASE in. the SINGULAR

# 4. COVENANT /// KAVEN

# 5. HE HATH MADE ///. PALAIOO. in. the PERFECT TENSE in. the INDICATIVE MOOD , and this MOOD , means you BETTER BELIEVE IT

# 6 THE /// HO is a DEFINITE ARTICLE in. the ACCUSATIVE CASE , in. the SINGULAR

# 7. FIRST ///. PROTOS. , in the ACCUSATIVE CASE , in the SINGULAR

# 8 OLD /// PALAOO , in. th PERFECT TENSE , in. the ACTIVE VOICE , in. the SINGULAR

# 9 NOW ///. DE. , is a CONJUNCATION

# 10 THAT WHICH DECAYETH. ,///. in the PRESENY TENSE , in the PASSIVE TENSE . in. the NOMINATIVE CASE. in. the SINGULAR in. the NUTER

# 11 AND ,/// KAI is a CONJUNCATION

# 12 WAXETH. OLD. , /// GORASHO. in. the PRESENT TENSE in. the ACTIVE VOICE means CHRIST is causing. it to be OLD is a PARTICIPL

in the NOMINATIVE CASE in. the SINGULAR and in. the NEUTER , meaning neither MALE or FEMALE

# 13. READY. , ///. ONGYS. is an ADVERB

# 14 TO VANISH AWAY , ///. APHANISMOS. in. the GENITIVE CASE in. the SINGULAR

#A. THIS MEAND THE OLD LAW OF MOSES has been sat aside FOREVER. !!

# B. And Rom 6:14 FOR YOU ARD NOT. //. OV s a DISJUNCATIVE PARTICLE NEGATIVE and means you will NEVERRRRR. be under

the LAW but UNDER GRACE. ,

# C This means that SALVATION is by ROM 10:9 and 10

# And John 3:3 and verse 5. will not save anyone and John is speaking to Israel ONLY. !!

dan p

BobRyan · Dec 5, 2025

Grace began in Gen 3, the moment Adam sinned , since God has stated that to was to die, and Adam lived over 900 years after he sinned.

The Law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant according to Jer 31 and according to Heb 8 and Heb 10.

"Sin is transgression of the Law" 1 John 3:4, still even in the NT age.

So then , it is "still a sin to take God's name in vain" just as it always was.

Dan Perez · Dec 5, 2025

BobRyan said:
Grace began in Gen 3, the moment Adam sinned , since God has stated that to was to die, and Adam lived over 900 years after he sinned.

The Law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant according to Jer 31 and according to Heb 8 and Heb 10.

"Sin is transgression of the Law" 1 John 3:4, still even in the NT age.

So then , it is "still a sin to take God's name in vain" just as it always was.

And just where did you see the word. GRACE //. CHARIS in. Gen 3. ?? ARE YOU ADDING TO Gen 3. ??

This my answer for you to consider !!

In Gen. 3:21 , DID //. ASA. is a CONJUNCATION. is a verb. in. the QAL. in. the IMPERFECT TENSE

The LORD //. YHOVA

GOD. // ELOHIM. is a PLURAL ABSOLUTE

MAKE. //. ASA. a verb in. the. in the IMPEFECT TENSE. in. the SINGULAR

COATS // KUTORET. in. the PLURAL

OF SKINS //. is a verb. in. the HIPHIL in. the IMPERTFECT TENSE. in v the PLURAL

AND CLOTHED THEM. //. is a verb in the HIPHIL. in. the IMPERFECT TENSE in. the PLURAL .

CHRIST killed an animal to cover their SIN !!

And BLOOD was SPRINKED

and his was what is called ATONEMENT. that. continued UNDER the under the LAW of Moses. where the LAW OF MOSES

WAS SET ASIDE in Acts 28:25-26 and in ISA 1_13

and specially Heb 8:13. !!!

dan p

BobRyan · Dec 5, 2025

BobRyan said:
Grace began in Gen 3, the moment Adam sinned , since God has stated that to was to die, and Adam lived over 900 years after he sinned.

The Law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant according to Jer 31 and according to Heb 8 and Heb 10.

"Sin is transgression of the Law" 1 John 3:4, still even in the NT age.

So then , it is "still a sin to take God's name in vain" just as it always was.

Dan Perez said:
And just where did you see the word. GRACE //. CHARIS in. Gen 3. ?? ARE YOU ADDING TO Gen 3. ??

Most people know the actual meaning of grace so they know it when they see it in Gen 3. Adam and Eve are not killed immediately as God's warning in chapter 2 clearly indicated even in Eve's own statement at the start of 3.

The entire argument of the serpent in 3 is that God's warning was mere bluff as proven by the demonstration that eating the tree did not at all produce the instant death that was conveyed as the punishment.

Its the very simplest basics of the chapter that we are discussing at this point.

The story would have ended instantly when Eve ate the fruit were it not for grace that we see in the chapter.

eleos1954 · Dec 6, 2025

Dan Perez said:
# 1 IN ////. EN. is a PREPOSTION

# 2. THAT HE SAITH //// LEGO. is. in. the PRESENT TENSE in. the ACTIVE VOICE

# 3 A. NEW. //// KAINOS. in. the ACCUSATIVE CASE in. the SINGULAR

# 4. COVENANT /// KAVEN

# 5. HE HATH MADE ///. PALAIOO. in. the PERFECT TENSE in. the INDICATIVE MOOD , and this MOOD , means you BETTER BELIEVE IT

# 6 THE /// HO is a DEFINITE ARTICLE in. the ACCUSATIVE CASE , in. the SINGULAR

# 7. FIRST ///. PROTOS. , in the ACCUSATIVE CASE , in the SINGULAR

# 8 OLD /// PALAOO , in. th PERFECT TENSE , in. the ACTIVE VOICE , in. the SINGULAR

# 9 NOW ///. DE. , is a CONJUNCATION

# 10 THAT WHICH DECAYETH. ,///. in the PRESENY TENSE , in the PASSIVE TENSE . in. the NOMINATIVE CASE. in. the SINGULAR in. the NUTER

# 11 AND ,/// KAI is a CONJUNCATION

# 12 WAXETH. OLD. , /// GORASHO. in. the PRESENT TENSE in. the ACTIVE VOICE means CHRIST is causing. it to be OLD is a PARTICIPL

in the NOMINATIVE CASE in. the SINGULAR and in. the NEUTER , meaning neither MALE or FEMALE

# 13. READY. , ///. ONGYS. is an ADVERB

# 14 TO VANISH AWAY , ///. APHANISMOS. in. the GENITIVE CASE in. the SINGULAR

#A. THIS MEAND THE OLD LAW OF MOSES has been sat aside FOREVER. !!

# B. And Rom 6:14 FOR YOU ARD NOT. //. OV s a DISJUNCATIVE PARTICLE NEGATIVE and means you will NEVERRRRR. be under

the LAW but UNDER GRACE. ,

# C This means that SALVATION is by ROM 10:9 and 10

# And John 3:3 and verse 5. will not save anyone and John is speaking to Israel ONLY. !!

dan p

Grace & Law: Grace isn't freedom from God's law but power to keep it. Christ's sacrifice made atonement, allowing believers to live righteously, not by earning salvation but by receiving God's imputed righteousness through faith.

Hentenza · Dec 6, 2025

eleos1954 said:
Grace & Law: Grace isn't freedom from God's law but power to keep it. Christ's sacrifice made atonement, allowing believers to live righteously, not by earning salvation but by receiving God's imputed righteousness through faith.

No one is saved by keeping the law. You really need to study justification to understand the tremendous power of Jesus sacrifice,

Dan Perez · Dec 6, 2025

BobRyan said:
Most people know the actual meaning of grace so they know it when they see it in Gen 3. Adam and Eve are not killed immediately as God's warning in chapter 2 clearly indicated even in Eve's own statement at the start of 3.

The entire argument of the serpent in 3 is that God's warning was mere bluff as proven by the demonstration that eating the tree did not at all produce the instant death that was conveyed as the punishment.

Its the very simplest basics of the chapter that we are discussing at this point.

The story would have ended instantly when Eve ate the fruit were it not for grace that we see in the chapter.

# 1. And Gen 3:3 says the following. :

# 2 NOT /// LO is a PARTICLE. NEGATIVE

# 3. EAT , /// AKA is a verb. in. the QAL in. the IMPERFECT TENSE in. the PLURAL

# 4 OF IT /// MIN. is a PREPOSOTION. in. the PLURAL

# 5 NEITHER ///. is. a CONJUNCATION is a PARTICLE NEGATIVE

# 6 SHALL YE TOUCH ///. NAGA. in. the IMPERFECT TENSE. in. the PLURAL

# 7 IT ///. BO

# 8 LEST. ///. PEN is a CONJUNCATION

# 9 YE DIE. /// MUT is. in. the IMPEFECT TENSE in. the PLURAL

# A They did DIE !!

# B. Funny that I did NOT SEE THE. HEBREW WORD FOR BLUFF. unless you have a verse

# C. And we would not be here if die right away. !!

# D And in Gen 5:5 ADAM lived 930 years , WOW. !!

dan p

Dan Perez · Dec 6, 2025

BobRyan said:
Grace began in Gen 3, the moment Adam sinned , since God has stated that to was to die, and Adam lived over 900 years after he sinned.

The Law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant according to Jer 31 and according to Heb 8 and Heb 10.

"Sin is transgression of the Law" 1 John 3:4, still even in the NT age.

So then , it is "still a sin to take God's name in vain" just as it always was.

AND since you quoted 1 John 3;4 justing. asking what. you. say what 1. JOHN 5:18. means , that whosoever

is BORN OF GOD. , DOES NOT. SIN and the word NOT // OU. is a DISJUNCATIVE PARTICLE NEGATIVE

that. NEGATIVE MEANS YOU. CAN EVER. SIN EVER AGAIN , do you believe that verse. !!

And I believe that verse BUT is it for today. ??

dan p

Studyman · 2025-12-17T09:11:36-0600

Dan Perez said:
# 1 IN ////. EN. is a PREPOSTION

# 2. THAT HE SAITH //// LEGO. is. in. the PRESENT TENSE in. the ACTIVE VOICE

# 3 A. NEW. //// KAINOS. in. the ACCUSATIVE CASE in. the SINGULAR

# 4. COVENANT /// KAVEN

# 5. HE HATH MADE ///. PALAIOO. in. the PERFECT TENSE in. the INDICATIVE MOOD , and this MOOD , means you BETTER BELIEVE IT

# 6 THE /// HO is a DEFINITE ARTICLE in. the ACCUSATIVE CASE , in. the SINGULAR

# 7. FIRST ///. PROTOS. , in the ACCUSATIVE CASE , in the SINGULAR

# 8 OLD /// PALAOO , in. th PERFECT TENSE , in. the ACTIVE VOICE , in. the SINGULAR

# 9 NOW ///. DE. , is a CONJUNCATION

# 10 THAT WHICH DECAYETH. ,///. in the PRESENY TENSE , in the PASSIVE TENSE . in. the NOMINATIVE CASE. in. the SINGULAR in. the NUTER

# 11 AND ,/// KAI is a CONJUNCATION

# 12 WAXETH. OLD. , /// GORASHO. in. the PRESENT TENSE in. the ACTIVE VOICE means CHRIST is causing. it to be OLD is a PARTICIPL

in the NOMINATIVE CASE in. the SINGULAR and in. the NEUTER , meaning neither MALE or FEMALE

# 13. READY. , ///. ONGYS. is an ADVERB

# 14 TO VANISH AWAY , ///. APHANISMOS. in. the GENITIVE CASE in. the SINGULAR

#A. THIS MEAND THE OLD LAW OF MOSES has been sat aside FOREVER. !!

# B. And Rom 6:14 FOR YOU ARD NOT. //. OV s a DISJUNCATIVE PARTICLE NEGATIVE and means you will NEVERRRRR. be under

the LAW but UNDER GRACE. ,

# C This means that SALVATION is by ROM 10:9 and 10

# And John 3:3 and verse 5. will not save anyone and John is speaking to Israel ONLY. !!

dan p

Again, it is important to sort out the differences between what this world's religions promote, and what is actually taught in the Holy Scriptures, given all the warnings about the preachers of this world.

Gen. 6: 7 And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

8 But Noah found grace "in the eyes of the LORD".

9 These are the generations of Noah: Noah was "a just man" and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.

Both Noah and Abraham sinned, as all men have sinned. And they were both Saved by Grace. To deny this, is to deny the Holy Scriptures themselves.

Hawkins · 2025-12-17T09:34:31-0600

Romans 5:20-21
The law was brought in so that the trespass might increase. But where sin increased, grace increased all the more, so that, just as sin reigned in death, so also grace might reign through righteousness to bring eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Grace is somehow "layered". The first Grace granted is through the first Covenant received by Noah. Covenants serve as the effective judgment standard replacing the Judgment of Law. Only 2/3 angels can pass the Judgment of Law. No man can possibly pass the Judgment of Law (i.e., no Jesus is needed), just as put, "no man is righteous, not even one."

The second layer is through the New Covenant, as sin increased, Grace increased all the more. The judgment standard described by the New Covenant is "Faith alone". Only Faith will serve as the judgment standard for humans under the New Covenant, that is, those who choose to believe in Jesus. (since only God can judge faith precisely, humans don't have the capability to judge how much faith a human has, humans need to evaluate faith through one's works).

These two layers of Grace are only possible with Jesus' self-sacrifice. Or else no man is savable, all men shall be destroyed with the flood. With Jesus, Noah represents a counter reset for humanity to extend and with humans judged by Covenants instead of Law.

Hentenza · 2025-12-17T10:26:02-0600

eleos1954 said:
Grace & Law: Grace isn't freedom from God's law but power to keep it. Christ's sacrifice made atonement, allowing believers to live righteously, not by earning salvation but by receiving God's imputed righteousness through faith.

You didn’t finish the circular logic. As long as we keep the law and are obedient. So you add to salvation by the grace of God through faith. Now it is salvation by faith and works of the law.

Tell me, did the law showed the way to repentance?

Always in His Presence · 2025-12-17T12:56:22-0600

The Law was never taken away - it was fulfilled.

Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh, 4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit

Dan Perez · 2025-12-17T14:18:17-0600

Always in His Presence said:
The Law was never taken away - it was fulfilled.

Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh, 4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit

And I believe it was FULFILLED. , but do you have a verse , just asking. and I have a verse but you go FIRST

since you said out was FULFIIED. you must have a verse ??

dan p

Studyman · 2025-12-17T14:28:28-0600

Always in His Presence said:
The Law was never taken away - it was fulfilled.

Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh, 4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit

Yes, there was never a Law given by God that could take away sins. Only by the Grace of God can the remission of Sin occur, and this by sending His Own Son to condemn Sin in the Flesh. Now we are free from sin, and the bondage of death, and are now free to, as Paul teaches, "Repent, Turn to God and do works worthy of repentance. In other words, now we can "Yield ourselves" servants to obey God, which is Righteousness, without condemnation of past sins.

Dan Perez · 2025-12-17T14:46:06-0600

Studyman said:
Again, it is important to sort out the differences between what this world's religions promote, and what is actually taught in the Holy Scriptures, given all the warnings about the preachers of this world.

Gen. 6: 7 And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

8 But Noah found grace "in the eyes of the LORD".

9 These are the generations of Noah: Noah was "a just man" and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.

Both Noah and Abraham sinned, as all men have sinned. And they were both Saved by Grace. To deny this, is to deny the Holy Scriptures themselves.

Will you reply tp POST # 8. if you can. ??

Is the LAW of Moses still to be KEPT. ??

dan p

Studyman · 2025-12-17T15:18:16-0600

Dan Perez said:
Will you reply tp POST # 8. if you can. ??

I did, Noah and Abraham were saved by Grace, God led Abraham's children out of Egypt (Sin) by His Grace. God always looks on the heart of man who would join themselves to Him, based in His Lovingkindness and Mercy.

Dan Perez said:
Is the LAW of Moses still to be KEPT. ??

dan p

First, it's not Moses Law, it's God's Law. This is an important Biblical Truth to keep in our minds, in my view.

Secondly, Noah and Abraham were saved by Grace, not "works of a Law" added 430 years after God said Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.".

God's definition of Holy, Just and Good has always existed, and will always exist in my view. But the Priesthood Covenant God made with Levi, concerning burnt offerings and sacrifices for the remission of a man's sins, wasn't "ADDED" until after the golden calf incident, and was always temporary. Only to be in place Till the Prophesied High Priest of God, "After the Order of Melchizedek" should come, at which time the sacrificial "works of the Law" were to cease, and vanish.

The deceiver would have us believe that God's definition of Holy, Just and Good, given to mankind through Moses, grew old and vanished, but the Holy Scriptures doesn't support this popular philosophy in my view. But this deceiver has always taught against obedience to God, therefore I don't listen to it.

God's Laws are still to be kept, at least this is what Jesus and Paul and the Prophets teach, when all their Words are considered, in my understanding.

Always in His Presence · 2025-12-17T16:19:38-0600

Dan Perez said:
And I believe it was FULFILLED. , but do you have a verse , just asking. and I have a verse but you go FIRST

since you said out was FULFIIED. you must have a verse ??

dan p

sure - It is right there in the post you quoted - kind of hard to miss....

WHEN WAS THE LAW TAKEN AWAY. AND GRACE BEGAN. ??

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