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TRUMP "MISSED THE DEADLINE" TO CALL OFF TX GERRYMANDERING; CALIFORNIA WILL NOW DRAW NEW, MORE “BEAUTIFUL MAPS”

probinson

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Yes, in response to Texas.

This time. When someone shows me that they're willing to toss their values aside in one instance, it makes it had for me to believe they wouldn't do it again in different circumstances.

Right. It’s like the people who voted for “America first” only to watch billions of dollars be sent to Argentina while Americans are standing in line for food rations.

That's one way to look at it. Another is to realize that if Democrats were to vote for a clean CR, the government would be operating on the same budget that was approved under Biden. But that's another topic entirely.
 
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rambot

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This time. When someone shows me that they're willing to toss their values aside in one instance, it makes it had for me to believe they wouldn't do it again in different circumstances.



That's one way to look at it. Another is to realize that if Democrats were to vote for a clean CR, the government would be operating on the same budget that was approved under Biden.
Is that the one that had all the cuts to Obamacare?
 
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probinson

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Is that the one that had all the cuts to Obamacare?

:rolleyes:

There are not "cuts to Obamacare" in the continuing resolution.

And honestly, there are enough other threads talking about the government shutdown that we probably don't need to start a sidebar here about it.
 
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essentialsaltes

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rambot

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:rolleyes:

There are not "cuts to Obamacare" in the continuing resolution.
If the cuts to Obamacare are NOT in the continueing resolution.....and you are saying that the budget is the EXACT Same as it was under Biden, where are teh savings from the cuts to Obamacare? I mean, there CERTAINLY have been cuts to Obamacare...where did they come from? Biden or the budget that was passed this summer?
 
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probinson

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If the cuts to Obamacare are NOT in the continueing resolution.....and you are saying that the budget is the EXACT Same as it was under Biden, where are teh savings from the cuts to Obamacare? I mean, there CERTAINLY have been cuts to Obamacare...where did they come from? Biden or the budget that was passed this summer?

Enhanced ACA premium tax credits were introduced during COVID in 2021, and those credits are set to expire on December 31, 2025. Democrats say they won't sign anything that doesn't include an extension of the credits and Republicans say they won't entertain extending the credits until the government shutdown is over. So, here we sit, waiting to see which side blinks first as they both attempt to leverage people's suffering for their own political gain.
 
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JSRG

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:rolleyes:

Please don't try to tell me that people don't want partisan gerrymandering when just days ago that's exactly what they voted for.
I don't see the issue here. Someone can think partisan gerrymandering is bad and should be removed, but as long as it exists, you have to make use of it given the other side is doing so.

For an analogy, suppose some players thought that body checking should be removed completely from hockey. But since it's legal and the other team is obviously going to do it, you just hurt yourself by refusing to engage in it. So as long as it's legal, you have to do it yourself to avoid the opposing team getting a big advantage. However, I don't see that as inconsistent with the position that it should be removed entirely.
 
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JSRG

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Not sure I agree.

The manner of holding elections is not the same as what we're voting for. The "manner of holding elections" is Tuesday or Weds. Or all week. Mail or in person.

In terms of what we're voting for, its pretty clear that in principle we're supposed to be voting for representatives. Gerrymandering degrades the concept of representation pretty severely.
I'm not sure how this exactly relates to what I was saying. I noted that according to the US Constitution:

The Times, Places and Manner of holding Elections for Senators and Representatives, shall be prescribed in each State by the Legislature thereof; but the Congress may at any time by Law make or alter such Regulations, except as to the Places of chusing Senators.

So the US Congress has the ability to overrule state rules on how to do the House of Representatives elections and abolish gerrymandering (or gerrymander even worse, unfortunately). This includes the ability to set up the districts themselves, require states to set up independent commissions to set up districts, or just throw districts out entirely and have it all done via proportional representation. All of that's right there. You seem to be focusing so heavily on the "manner" that you're ignoring the "times" and "places" part of it that grant the US congress this power.
 
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Bradskii

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Right. Because as you already stated, "No gerrymandering" is a secondary value for most voters.
Look, I don't want to smack the loud mouth in the bar upside the head. It's just not me. But...if he starts swinging punches at me then he's going to get whacked. I'm not going to stand there and let him keep beating me up.

Does that actually make sense to you?
 
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probinson

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Look, I don't want to smack the loud mouth in the bar upside the head. It's just not me. But...if he starts swinging punches at me then he's going to get whacked. I'm not going to stand there and let him keep beating me up.

Then it is you, when properly provoked. Were I in that same situation, I'd walk away.

Does that actually make sense to you?

Yes. It means that you have values that you'll set aside given the right circumstances.
 
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Bradskii

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Then it is you, when properly provoked. Were I in that same situation, I'd walk away.
In this case It's not an option, so irrelevant
Yes. It means that you have values that you'll set aside given the right circumstances.
Of course. Same as our chums in California. We all do it given the right set of circumstances. Like being beaten up but deciding to fight.
 
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rambot

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Then it is you, when properly provoked. Were I in that same situation, I'd walk away.
Interesting strategy. So lying prone on the ground while he's kicking you, you'd just...get up and walk away and he'd just be in awe and stop pummelling you.
Edit:
Also, this ACTUALLY relates to gerrymandering not at all.
 
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rambot

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And as IF the next Democratic isn't going to exploit every loophole Trump has already blown wide open.
Like Larry Flynt raises from the dead and runs as a public health care supporting, poor helping, Obama loving socialist.
 
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durangodawood

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I'm not sure how this exactly relates to what I was saying. I noted that according to the US Constitution:

The Times, Places and Manner of holding Elections for Senators and Representatives, shall be prescribed in each State by the Legislature thereof; but the Congress may at any time by Law make or alter such Regulations, except as to the Places of chusing Senators.

So the US Congress has the ability to overrule state rules on how to do the House of Representatives elections and abolish gerrymandering (or gerrymander even worse, unfortunately). This includes the ability to set up the districts themselves, require states to set up independent commissions to set up districts, or just throw districts out entirely and have it all done via proportional representation. All of that's right there. You seem to be focusing so heavily on the "manner" that you're ignoring the "times" and "places" part of it that grant the US congress this power.
I don think so. Regarding "holding elections"

Time: Tues, or all week - for example
Place: County court houses, or online, etc
Manner: hand counted paper ballots, or various machines, etc

How elections get held is a different question than what things exactly you are voting on. In this case, the thing you are voting for is a representative in congress. Discretion over the mechanics of holding elections should not allow states (nor the congress) to degrade the whole concept of representation.
 
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essentialsaltes

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Republicans, including ‘cowardly’ Schwarzenegger, take heat for lopsided loss on Prop. 50

Former House Speaker Kevin McCarthy of Bakersfield, the once-prodigious Republican fundraiser, reportedly had vowed that he could raise $100 million for the opposition but ended up delivering a small fraction of that amount.

Assemblyman Carl DeMaio (R-San Diego), a conservative firebrand, called on state GOP Chair Corrin Rankin to step down and faulted other Republican leaders and longtime party operatives for their failure to defeat the measure, calling them “derelict of duty and untrustworthy and incompetent.”

“Unless serious changes are made at the party, the midterms are going to be a complete disaster,” DeMaio said, also faulting the other groups opposing the effort.

[As for the Ah-nold thing, he was the face of a lot of the anti-50 ads that ran. His spox points the finger at the Republican message that couldn't admit that redistricting Texas was wrong.]

“We were clear from the beginning that he was not going to be a part of the campaign and was going to speak his mind,” said Daniel Ketchell, a spokesman for the former governor. “His message was very clear and nonpartisan. When one campaign couldn’t even criticize gerrymandering in Texas, it was probably hard for voters to believe they actually cared about fairness.”

On election day, he emailed followers about gut health, electrolytes, protein bars, fitness and conversations to increase happiness. There was no apparent mention of the Tuesday election.
 
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rambot

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Enhanced ACA premium tax credits were introduced during COVID in 2021, and those credits are set to expire on December 31, 2025. Democrats say they won't sign anything that doesn't include an extension of the credits and Republicans say they won't entertain extending the credits until the government shutdown is over. So, here we sit, waiting to see which side blinks first as they both attempt to leverage people's suffering for their own political gain.
So Republicans won't extend the credit and don't want Americans to save that money and spend it on food and such?
 
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The Barbarian

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:rolleyes:

Please don't try to tell me that people don't want partisan gerrymandering when just days ago that's exactly what they voted for.
Republicans are outraged that democrats are now doing what the republicans are doing. The problem is, a complete ban on Gerrymandering would benefit the democrats. So the SCOTUS is not going to outlaw that particular form of corruption.
 
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Desk trauma

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Republicans are outraged that democrats are now doing what the republicans are doing. The problem is, a complete ban on Gerrymandering would benefit the democrats. So the SCOTUS is not going to outlaw that particular form of corruption.
Im waiting on the ruling stopping blue states from doing it but not Texas et all because reasons.
 
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