School Teachers, Nurses, Government Workers, CELEBRATING Charlie Kirk's murder

ThatRobGuy · 2025-09-15T09:50:40-0500

RocksInMyHead said:
There's a difference between "Islamic terrorism remains the greatest threat to our nation." and "We’ve been warning about the rise of Islam on the show, to great amount of backlash. We don’t care, that’s what we do here. And we said that Islam is not compatible with western civilization." (even laying aside the context of when those statements were made). Again, Kirk takes a step further, from Islamic terrorism to Islam as a religion in general.

RocksInMyHead said:
You can't tell me that "If I see a Black pilot, I’m going to be like, boy, I hope he’s qualified." would have been an acceptable thing to say in polite company at any point since the 1960s (or maybe even before that). And yet Charlie Kirk said that less than two years ago.

So is it way he's saying, or the ideas themselves?

Qualification-based concerns about affirmative action policies is by no means a rarity among the US population.

Per Pew Research:

Accepted students’ qualifications

Over half of Republicans (55%) say that when colleges consider race and ethnicity in college admissions, the students who are accepted to these schools are less qualified; 6% say they are more qualified, and about four-in-ten say either that these practices result in no change or that they are not sure.

By contrast, about half of Democrats (52%) say that the students who are accepted are neither more nor less qualified when race and ethnicity are taken into account. 20% say students are less qualified, equal to the share saying they are more qualified.

So while that view may be more pervasive on the republican side, it's not non-existent on the other side of the fence.

Same goes for the other topic as well:
Two-thirds of Republicans (68%) say Islam is not part of mainstream American society, while just 37% of Democrats express this view. And Republicans are twice as likely as Democrats to say there is a natural conflict between Islam and democracy (65% vs. 30%).

So while it may not be the "majority view" of Democrats, when you're getting up north of the 30% range, it's by no means a "fringe" viewpoint among democrats either.

However, what's interesting, is that their attitudes on these things shift based on the demographic dynamics

Americans for Meritocracy

Introduction Last summer, in Students for Fair Admissions v. Harvard (SFFA), the United States Supreme Court issued a blockbuster decision eliminating

manhattan.institute

RocksInMyHead · 2025-09-15T10:00:58-0500

ThatRobGuy said:
So is it way he's saying, or the ideas themselves?

Why not both? Again, sanewashing.

ThatRobGuy · 2025-09-15T10:29:16-0500

RocksInMyHead said:
Why not both? Again, sanewashing.

How exactly would "sanewashing" even apply to some of those ideas?

Questioning whether or not demographic-based hiring could have an impact on how well qualified the people in that profession end up being isn't an "insane" concern.

Nor is it "insane" to have some concerns about an ideology that lends itself to insular and non-assimilating behaviors. His statements about the concerns regarding Islam could've just as easily been said by a Sam Harris or Christopher Hitchens. In fact, I've heard Sam Harris (who's on the left) make even harsher critiques about Islam. (much to Ben Affleck's dismay apparently)

RocksInMyHead · 2025-09-15T10:39:20-0500

ThatRobGuy said:
How exactly would "sanewashing" even apply to some of those ideas?

Questioning whether or not demographic-based hiring could have an impact on how well qualified the people in that profession end up being isn't an "insane" concern.

It is if the "demographic-based hiring program" still requires people to meet qualifications. Y'know, like the airline industry.

ThatRobGuy said:
Nor is it "insane" to have some concerns about an ideology that lends itself to insular and non-assimilating behaviors.

It is insane to state that an entire religion encompassing over 2 billion believers is fundamentally incompatible with western civilization.

ThatRobGuy said:
His statements about the concerns regarding Islam could've just as easily been said by a Sam Harris or Christopher Hitchens. In fact, I've heard Sam Harris (who's on the left) make even harsher critiques about Islam. (much to Ben Affleck's dismay apparently)

And they've been criticized for those stances, so I'm not sure what your point is.

essentialsaltes · 2025-09-15T16:12:50-0500

'You want a fight?' Nancy Mace demands schools be defunded over reactions to Kirk's death

"We are urging Secretary of Education Linda McMahon to take decisive action to cut off federal funding from any elementary, secondary, and post-secondary educational institution refusing to hold teachers or administrators accountable for celebrating the murder of Charlie Kirk," Mace wrote on X, sharing a signed letter to United States Secretary of Education Linda McMahon.

Thoughtcrime cancellation metastasis.

essentialsaltes · 2025-09-15T16:22:15-0500

Rep. Derrick van Orden is on quite a cancellation roll on Twitter.

Tropical Wilds · 2025-09-15T16:31:05-0500

essentialsaltes said:
'You want a fight?' Nancy Mace demands schools be defunded over reactions to Kirk's death
"We are urging Secretary of Education Linda McMahon to take decisive action to cut off federal funding from any elementary, secondary, and post-secondary educational institution refusing to hold teachers or administrators accountable for celebrating the murder of Charlie Kirk," Mace wrote on X, sharing a signed letter to United States Secretary of Education Linda McMahon.

Thoughtcrime cancellation metastasis.

I like the thought process that says if a teacher does something they don’t like, they’ll punish the entire community’s next generation.

Something something party that values life and protecting children something something something.

essentialsaltes · 2025-09-15T17:14:58-0500

Unsportsmanlike: Insufficient celebration, 15 yards

Six NFL teams don’t pay tribute to Charlie Kirk

Seven home teams around the NFL held moments of silence for Charlie Kirk on Sunday, but the Bengals, Lions, Colts, Vikings, Steelers and Ravens did not.

(two more games tonight, including the undefeated Raiders playing at home)

Bradskii · 2025-09-15T17:17:02-0500

ThatRobGuy said:
I recall Obama running on "marriage is between a man and woman" back then.

This is a fatuous version of of the schoolyard argument. 'Sir, he said that last week. So why can't I say it now!'

One, he was wrong when he said it. Two, I would have told he that he was wrong when he said it. Three, he wasn't quoting Leviticus as a punishment for it. And let's go four...it doesn't make it right when Kirk said it.

ThatRobGuy said:
Biden (2004): “The greatest threat we face is from Islamic extremists who are intent on killing Americans and undermining our way of life.”

Well, gee. Biden said that extremists who want to kill Americans are a threat. Hold the front page!

ThatRobGuy said:
Pelosi (2006): "Islamic terrorism remains the greatest threat to our nation."

And Pelosi said that in 2006 when Islamic terrorists killed 23 people in Egypt and over 200 people in Mumbai. I think that you might still have been clearing up after 9/11 at the time.

ThatRobGuy said:
"I am, you know, adamantly against illegal immigrants."

A majority of politicians would have said that at some point depending on the time, the place, the question and the audience. This might come as a surprise to you, but politicians, including Clinton, will often tell you what you want to hear. I'm sorry if that comes as a shock, but someone needed to tell you.

ThatRobGuy said:
My point wasn't that people are claiming his views are abhorrent "just because he's conservative", my point was about how fast the overton window is moving... where things that would've been perfectly acceptable for a democrat to say 10-15 years ago, are now labelled as "abhorrent far-right" positions.

Anyone from the Democrat party that said anything like what Kirk would spout on a daily basis and the way that he would say it would be treated as a pariah. If you want to support anything he said then come out and say so. But please, spare me the 4th grade arguments as a way to excuse them.

Trogdor the Burninator · 2025-09-15T17:23:55-0500

essentialsaltes said:
Six NFL teams don’t pay tribute to Charlie Kirk
Seven home teams around the NFL held moments of silence for Charlie Kirk on Sunday, but the Bengals, Lions, Colts, Vikings, Steelers and Ravens did not.

Nothing for hundreds of children murdered by psychotic gunmen in schools mind you - but we already knew that a lot of Republicans don't care about school shootings.

After all, "it’s worth it to have a cost of, unfortunately, some gun deaths every single year so that we can have the second amendment to protect our other God-given rights. That is a prudent deal. It is rational"

essentialsaltes · 2025-09-15T17:26:21-0500

Trogdor the Burninator said:
Nothing for hundreds of children murdered by psychotic gunmen in schools mind you

Well, not all of them.

“There have been moments following school shootings or an attack on a house of worship such as the Tree of Life Synagogue in Pittsburgh in 2018. There also have been moments following major international incidents such as Hamas attack on Israel in October 2023 and weather-related incidents such as major hurricanes and fires.”

Tropical Wilds · 2025-09-15T17:29:09-0500

essentialsaltes said:
Unsportsmanlike: Insufficient celebration, 15 yards

Six NFL teams don’t pay tribute to Charlie Kirk
Seven home teams around the NFL held moments of silence for Charlie Kirk on Sunday, but the Bengals, Lions, Colts, Vikings, Steelers and Ravens did not.

(two more games tonight, including the undefeated Raiders playing at home)

This is just a garbage year to be a Dolphins fan, from every angle, isn’t it?

Meanwhile several of our local businesses and one post office just opted to just take their flags down all together until they can out them full again.

essentialsaltes · 2025-09-15T17:33:15-0500

Oh, this may come in handy.

Musk vows to pay legal costs for users who get in trouble at work for their tweets

Bradskii · 2025-09-15T17:56:56-0500

ThatRobGuy said:
Questioning whether or not demographic-based hiring could have an impact on how well qualified the people in that profession end up being isn't an "insane" concern.

Do you honestly not see the difference between having a reasonable discussion on that matter if you think that addressing undeniable inequalities might in some cases have swung the pendulum too far and effectively saying out loud 'Hey, a black pilot. Do you think we're safe to fly?' Please tell me that you'd never consider saying any such thing and that you'd berate someone who did.

ThatRobGuy said:
Nor is it "insane" to have some concerns about an ideology that lends itself to insular and non-assimilating behaviors. His statements about the concerns regarding Islam could've just as easily been said by a Sam Harris or Christopher Hitchens.

Would you like me to post some links on what those guys think about some Christians as well? What they rile against is fundamentalism. The sort that Kirk exhibited.

Bradskii · 2025-09-15T18:00:21-0500

Trogdor the Burninator said:
After all, "it’s worth it to have a cost of, unfortunately, some gun deaths every single year so that we can have the second amendment to protect our other God-given rights. That is a prudent deal. It is rational"

And hey, you need a well armed militia to protect the citizenry against the government. Imagine if it started posting troops and armoured vehicles onto your streets!

essentialsaltes · 2025-09-15T18:14:58-0500

Pete Hegseth tells Pentagon staff to hunt for negative Charlie Kirk posts by service members

Several people have already been relieved of their jobs because of their posts on social media, defense officials told NBC News.

Several service members have been relieved from their jobs because of such posts, the officials said, adding that Hegseth’s directive also pertains to others associated with the Defense Department. It’s unclear exactly how many people have been disciplined.

One U.S. military officer said troops know they are not allowed to condone political violence, but being fired for criticizing a person, particularly a civilian who has no ties to the military, is extremely rare.

“We can’t criticize the commander in chief, but I can’t remember anyone ever telling me we can’t say anything critical about a civilian like this. He was not in our chain of command or anything,” the officer said.

essentialsaltes · 2025-09-15T18:45:09-0500

FEMA’s Top Counsel Has Quit. He’s the Third to Leave in Six Months.

“Your work is never easy, rarely appreciated and often misunderstood or mischaracterized, but it is essential,” Colt Hagmaier, FEMA’s acting chief counsel, wrote to staff announcing his departure.

Hagmaier had worked at FEMA for more than 13 years and was appointed to lead the chief counsel office after Joshua Stanton, a 14-year veteran of FEMA, was placed on administrative leave from the role in March.

Stanton lasted in the chief counsel role only one week. He had been appointed to replace former chief counsel Adrian Sevier, who had held the position for about a decade before leaving the agency two months into the Trump administration under unspecified circumstances.

One FEMA employee told NOTUS that Hagmaier worked hard to protect the staff below him from the political decisions at the agency. In his departing email to staff, he advised FEMA employees to place “people above politics.”

[Recently, some FEMA staffers have been fired for their speech in re Charlie Kirk. It's not clear, but it's not a stretch that this may have been the straw. The letter itself is passionate but not very explicit about any reasons.]

Oompa Loompa · 2025-09-15T19:15:35-0500

Stopped_lurking said:
I tried to watch the video (I jumped around a bit), but are there no fact checkers? How is the audience supposed to know who is right?

The same way people were able to do it before "fact checkers" like snopes. By being informed. Liberal universities dont inform, they indoctrinate. For many of these students, they have never heard any point of view outside of their safe spaces. Therefore, they are completely unprepared to argue against it.

Oompa Loompa · 2025-09-15T19:19:02-0500

essentialsaltes said:
Pete Hegseth tells Pentagon staff to hunt for negative Charlie Kirk posts by service members
Several people have already been relieved of their jobs because of their posts on social media, defense officials told NBC News.

Several service members have been relieved from their jobs because of such posts, the officials said, adding that Hegseth’s directive also pertains to others associated with the Defense Department. It’s unclear exactly how many people have been disciplined.

One U.S. military officer said troops know they are not allowed to condone political violence, but being fired for criticizing a person, particularly a civilian who has no ties to the military, is extremely rare.

“We can’t criticize the commander in chief, but I can’t remember anyone ever telling me we can’t say anything critical about a civilian like this. He was not in our chain of command or anything,” the officer said.

All of a sudden, calls for violence, celebrating murder, and terrroristic threats are now protected free speech to liberals. Because that is what got those people fired.

ThatRobGuy · 2025-09-15T20:01:10-0500

Bradskii said:
Anyone from the Democrat party that said anything like what Kirk would spout on a daily basis and the way that he would say it would be treated as a pariah. If you want to support anything he said then come out and say so. But please, spare me the 4th grade arguments as a way to excuse them.

Not in the era I was referring to.

And it's not an attempt to excuse, them, it's an attempt to highlight that they're being held to a lopsided standard to begin with.

Basically "the things we decided to stop saying/doing just recently, are now the deciding factor in whether or not a person is acceptable"

The progressive wing of the Democratic party have become the political equivalent of someone who just went vegan last month. They'll talk about it constantly, and the very same behaviors they used to engage in last month are now the attributes they point to, to call someone barbaric who still does it.

For many of the personalities that get labelled "far right" today, if you put them in a time machine and sent them back a bit, they wouldn't be.

Just as a fun thought exercise...and while I know AI isn't a definitive source, I decided to ask it where Ron DeSantis would fall on the political spectrum if we were to send him back to 2005 in a time machine.

Immigration

DeSantis today: Hardline on border security, opposes mass amnesty, supports E-Verify, pushes deportations, against sanctuary cities.
2000–2005 context: That’s basically mainstream bipartisan. The 2006 Secure Fence Act (for hundreds of miles of fencing) passed with 26 Senate Democrats voting “yes,” including Hillary Clinton, Joe Biden, and Barack Obama. Even union Democrats wanted tighter immigration controls to protect wages.
In 2005, DeSantis’s stance would look centrist.

Marriage & LGBTQ Issues

DeSantis today: Opposes gender-affirming care for minors, skeptical of transgender rights expansion, supports parental rights in schools, has spoken against same-sex marriage historically (though it’s now settled law).
2000–2005 context: Almost identical to mainstream Democrats back then. John Kerry, Hillary Clinton, and Barack Obama all opposed same-sex marriage in that era. Transgender rights weren’t even a mainstream issue yet.
In 2005, DeSantis would look center-left or mainstream Democrat on this topic.

Foreign Policy

DeSantis today: More skeptical of foreign interventions; critical of “forever wars,” though still hawkish on China and terrorism.
2000–2005 context: That would actually line him up with the anti-war left or libertarians at the time. In 2003–2005, the mainstream (Bush Republicans and many Democrats) backed Iraq and Afghanistan. Skepticism of foreign wars was more Howard Dean / Dennis Kucinich territory.
In 2005, DeSantis would be seen as leaning dovish, which was left-coded back then.

Economics / Trade

DeSantis today: Populist economics — skeptical of globalization, supports tariffs, wants to protect American manufacturing.
2000–2005 context: That would have made him sound like a labor-left Democrat or Ross Perot populist, since both Bush Republicans and establishment Democrats were pro–free trade.
In 2005, DeSantis’s economics would sound center-left populist.

Cultural Issues (Schools, DEI, Woke Politics)

DeSantis today: Fights against “woke” policies in schools, opposes CRT/DEI mandates, frames himself as pro-parental rights.
2000–2005 context: These issues didn’t exist in the mainstream yet. But his general cultural stance would line up with Bush-era cultural conservatism (opposition to “political correctness,” pro-family values).

⚖️ Overall Placement

If you put DeSantis (2025) into the 2000–2005 spectrum:

On immigration → centrist (same as Biden/Clinton at the time).
On marriage/LGBT → mainstream Democrat position in 2005.
On foreign policy → left-coded anti-war stance.
On trade/economics → populist center-left.
On culture wars → Bush-era mainstream right.

Net effect: He would probably be seen as a Bush-style conservative or Lieberman-style Democrat governor with some surprising overlaps with old-school Democrats. Not “far right” at all.

School Teachers, Nurses, Government Workers, CELEBRATING Charlie Kirk's murder

Part of the IT crowd

Accepted students’ qualifications​

God is innocent; Noah built on a floodplain!

Part of the IT crowd

God is innocent; Noah built on a floodplain!

Fact-Based Lifeform

'You want a fight?' Nancy Mace demands schools be defunded over reactions to Kirk's death​

Fact-Based Lifeform

Little Lebowski Urban Achiever

'You want a fight?' Nancy Mace demands schools be defunded over reactions to Kirk's death​

Fact-Based Lifeform

Six NFL teams don’t pay tribute to Charlie Kirk​

Old age should burn and rave at close of day;

Senior Veteran

Fact-Based Lifeform

Little Lebowski Urban Achiever

Six NFL teams don’t pay tribute to Charlie Kirk​

Fact-Based Lifeform

Musk vows to pay legal costs for users who get in trouble at work for their tweets​

Old age should burn and rave at close of day;

Old age should burn and rave at close of day;

Fact-Based Lifeform

Pete Hegseth tells Pentagon staff to hunt for negative Charlie Kirk posts by service members​

Fact-Based Lifeform

FEMA’s Top Counsel Has Quit. He’s the Third to Leave in Six Months.​

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Pete Hegseth tells Pentagon staff to hunt for negative Charlie Kirk posts by service members​

Part of the IT crowd

Immigration​

Marriage & LGBTQ Issues​

Foreign Policy​

Economics / Trade​

Cultural Issues (Schools, DEI, Woke Politics)​

⚖️ Overall Placement​

Similar threads

Accepted students’ qualifications

'You want a fight?' Nancy Mace demands schools be defunded over reactions to Kirk's death

'You want a fight?' Nancy Mace demands schools be defunded over reactions to Kirk's death

Six NFL teams don’t pay tribute to Charlie Kirk

Six NFL teams don’t pay tribute to Charlie Kirk

Musk vows to pay legal costs for users who get in trouble at work for their tweets

Pete Hegseth tells Pentagon staff to hunt for negative Charlie Kirk posts by service members

FEMA’s Top Counsel Has Quit. He’s the Third to Leave in Six Months.

Pete Hegseth tells Pentagon staff to hunt for negative Charlie Kirk posts by service members

Immigration

Marriage & LGBTQ Issues

Foreign Policy

Economics / Trade

Cultural Issues (Schools, DEI, Woke Politics)

⚖️ Overall Placement