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Watch: CNN Cuts Tulsi Gabbard Off as She Lays Out the Inconvenient Facts of the Russia Hoax

A New Dawn

Bind my wandering heart to thee!
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Now try to remember 3 things.

1. Unlike Trump, she had grounds to say these things!
2. Unlike Trump - your timetable above stretches across years. That many wouldn't even cover an afternoon allotment of Trump's bellyaching and Tweeting in his peak mania phase about legitimately losing the 2020 election.
3. Trump started claiming "Quite frankly, we WON this election!" on election night! His NPD went into overdrive and he was a sore, sulky loser right from election night!


So where are we?

Reality check - Russia did the things, and Hillary rightly mentioned it but handed over power peacefully anyway.
Trump lost the election, then LIED about it being stolen - and people DIED at the Capitol and Fox got find 2/3 billion dollars for repeating his fraud.
Hillary bought and paid for the Steele dossier. It’s a complete fabrication that they used to go to the FISA court to get an illegal wiretap. What do you have that is credible?
 
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probinson

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You said that you'd never supported Trump. Period. That's been shown to be wrong.

I'll bet if we looked hard enough, we could find something that you agree with Trump on also. I guess that makes you a Trump supporter too, eh?
 
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probinson

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Hmmm....must have missed all that. Can't imagine why. Care to provide some documentation, so I can see what I missed the first time around?

On November 10, 2016, three days of protests in Portland, Oregon, turned into a riot, when a group of anarchists[2][7] broke off from a larger group of protesters who were opposed to the election of Donald Trump as president of the United States.
...
A number of businesses were damaged, and 26–29 people were arrested during the first day of the incident. Police used rubber bullets, pepper spray and flash bang devices to disperse the protesters who became violent.[8] During the riot, glass bottles and trash cans were thrown at police. Rioters used rocks and baseball bats to cause much of the damage. A dumpster was also lit on fire.[9]Members of the protest who opposed the violence intervened when a man tried to destroy a piece of electrical equipment with a bat. Another altercation began when a woman began throwing laundry detergent at people in the crowd.[10]
...
The protests remained ongoing into the night of November 12. Police arrested nineteen additional protesters who either refused to leave the area, or were suspected of other crimes. A reporter for local television station KOIN was assaulted.[4] In reaction to the ongoing disturbances, police closed Pioneer Courthouse Square and a two-block perimeter around the park, and warned that anyone who remained would face arrest.[4] Two other people were also assaulted, and a total of 62 people have been arrested as a result of the rioting and other disturbances.[5] On November 13, police updated the figure of total arrests to 113, with 71 arrested on November 12 alone.[6] Protesters reportedly threw lit road flares at police officers.[13]
...
Numerous businesses were damaged during the rioting. Windows of a Chase Bank, a Starbucks, and many other privately owned shops were smashed. Twelve vehicles at a Toyota dealership, across the Willamette River, had windows smashed out, and roofs caved in. Anti-Trump graffiti was spray painted on buildings downtown.[8][9] By the fourth day of the riots, Portland police chief Mike Marshman estimated that damages exceeded $1 million.[14]
 
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probinson

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Now try to remember 3 things.

1. Unlike Trump, she had grounds to say these things!

She did not. There was NEVER any evidence that the election was STOLEN!!! from Clinton. There was never any grounds for such a claim.
 
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A2SG

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On November 10, 2016, three days of protests in Portland, Oregon, turned into a riot, when a group of anarchists[2][7] broke off from a larger group of protesters who were opposed to the election of Donald Trump as president of the United States.
...
A number of businesses were damaged, and 26–29 people were arrested during the first day of the incident. Police used rubber bullets, pepper spray and flash bang devices to disperse the protesters who became violent.[8] During the riot, glass bottles and trash cans were thrown at police. Rioters used rocks and baseball bats to cause much of the damage. A dumpster was also lit on fire.[9]Members of the protest who opposed the violence intervened when a man tried to destroy a piece of electrical equipment with a bat. Another altercation began when a woman began throwing laundry detergent at people in the crowd.[10]
...
The protests remained ongoing into the night of November 12. Police arrested nineteen additional protesters who either refused to leave the area, or were suspected of other crimes. A reporter for local television station KOIN was assaulted.[4] In reaction to the ongoing disturbances, police closed Pioneer Courthouse Square and a two-block perimeter around the park, and warned that anyone who remained would face arrest.[4] Two other people were also assaulted, and a total of 62 people have been arrested as a result of the rioting and other disturbances.[5] On November 13, police updated the figure of total arrests to 113, with 71 arrested on November 12 alone.[6] Protesters reportedly threw lit road flares at police officers.[13]
...
Numerous businesses were damaged during the rioting. Windows of a Chase Bank, a Starbucks, and many other privately owned shops were smashed. Twelve vehicles at a Toyota dealership, across the Willamette River, had windows smashed out, and roofs caved in. Anti-Trump graffiti was spray painted on buildings downtown.[8][9] By the fourth day of the riots, Portland police chief Mike Marshman estimated that damages exceeded $1 million.[14]
Okay, youve documented riots in one city, though I didn't see "stolen election" as a specific reason, just a general protest against Donald Trump. Not sure that qualifies as riots "across America," let alone "stolen election" as a specific impetus.

And nothing at all about your other claims.

Seems I'm leaning toward hyperbole after all.

-- A2SG, unless you have something more to offer?
 
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probinson

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Okay, one city had riots,

Screenshot 2025-08-06 at 11.35.51 AM.png


CBS reported on riots in Portland, OR, Denver CO, Oakland, CA and Minneapolis,MN. Can we classify that as "across America"?

though I didn't see "stolen election" as a specific reason, just a general protest against Donald Trump.

Fair enough. I don't know if the "stolen election" was the impetus for these violent riots, but I will say the rhetoric coming from the Democrats and the media certainly wasn't helping. In any event, it's a sad commentary on the people when they resort to violence because they don't like the outcome of an election. And yes, I'm referring to both 2016 and 2020.
 
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eclipsenow

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Hillary bought and paid for the Steele dossier. It’s a complete fabrication that they used to go to the FISA court to get an illegal wiretap. What do you have that is credible?
The fact that the CIA agents did not use the Steele Dossier but filed it in the Annex - more as a curiosity. They did their own work.
 
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The Barbarian

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Tell that to our secretary of defense.
Did he text his girlfriend about plans to frame a president?
I don't think he has anything to do with Trump's "Obama did it, too" attempt to divert attention from the things Trump and Epstein did. I was speaking of Hegseth's release of classified battle plans on social media, endangering the lives of our troops.
 
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The Barbarian

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In any event, it's a sad commentary on the people when they resort to violence because they don't like the outcome of an election. And yes, I'm referring to both 2016 and 2020.
After all, blocking traffic, throwing packs of soup at cops, and setting fire to trash bins is just as bad as attacking our Capitol, in hopes of overturning an election. (WFTH-I)
 
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A2SG

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View attachment 368189

CBS reported on riots in Portland, OR, Denver CO, Oakland, CA and Minneapolis,MN. Can we classify that as "across America"?
It's better. Okay, fine, you've managed to document that there were protests against the election of Donald Trump, and some resulted in riots.

Still sounds a bit like hyperbole, but not as much as before.

Fair enough. I don't know if the "stolen election" was the impetus for these violent riots, but I will say the rhetoric coming from the Democrats and the media certainly wasn't helping.
I recall very little noise on that front, but it is possible not much of it made its way here to Massachusetts. What specific rhetoric are you referring to, exactly?

And, more importantly, what did it result in? We all know Democrats are good at rhetoric, but following through? Not so much.

In any event, it's a sad commentary on the people when they resort to violence because they don't like the outcome of an election. And yes, I'm referring to both 2016 and 2020.
No argument there. I feel the same way when certain sports fans do similar things after a big game. Win or lose.

-- A2SG, we Americans may just be a violent bunch...look how we got started, after all.....
 
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probinson

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And nothing at all about your other claims.

Sigh.

At the 2:29 mark, "Hillary Clinton Voters Call to Overturn Results".
At the 2:33 mark, A petition for the Electoral College to make Hillary Clinton President.
At the 2:47 mark, "We are the victims of a bloodless coup."
At the 3:22 mark, "It will not be a peaceful change of power."

 
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A2SG

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Sigh.

At the 2:29 mark, "Hillary Clinton Voters Call to Overturn Results".
At the 2:33 mark, A petition for the Electoral College to make Hillary Clinton President.
At the 2:47 mark, "We are the victims of a bloodless coup."
At the 3:22 mark, "It will not be a peaceful change of power."

Note what I asked about actual things done about that rhetoric.

-- A2SG, follow-through, not exactly a Democratic party strength....
 
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probinson

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Still sounds a bit like hyperbole, but not as much as before.

Perhaps the reason I'm being a bit hyperbolic in my description is to counter the incessant downplaying of what happened in 2016.
 
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probinson

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Note what I asked about actual things done about that rhetoric.

-- A2SG, follow-through, not exactly a Democratic party strength....

You asked for evidence that these things happened, so I provided it. Again, the idea that we should just ignore the results of an election because we don't like the outcome is what I've been talking about.

You are correct that they didn't follow through, and neither did the Republicans. The riot at the Capitol did nothing to prevent the transfer of power based on the election results. It was all a bunch of noise that accomplished nothing.
 
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essentialsaltes

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I don’t believe the organization as a whole was biased, but the ones at the top calling the orders were.
Well, that's not Strzok or Page.
Texts to your girlfriend plotting to overthrow the “peaceful transfer of power”, especially when those orders
What orders? Strzok was making his own spicy comments. What are you quoting?

So are you saying that when my husband and I plot to do something illegal and the cops take my phone and read my texts I can sue them for breach of privacy and get $2M ?
You probably can if the 'cops' release them to the public (and don't charge you with any crimes).

I’m sure there are a lot of criminals who were put away for that very reason who will be interested to know they have been wrongfully imprisoned.
Strzok was not imprisoned, but he was wrongfully terminated.
 
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Bradskii

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I'll bet if we looked hard enough, we could find something that you agree with Trump on also. I guess that makes you a Trump supporter too, eh?
No. I'm not sure you're grasping this. If I denigrate something that Trump did then it's what he did that I denigrate. If I support something that he did then it's what Trump did which is what I support. In the second example I cannot say that I have never supported anything he's done. Obviously.

Now if you want a general comment made on whether I think he's the worst president the US has ever had or I think he's the best there's ever been, then I'll give you my personal view. Which will be based on the totality of things that he has done, how he did them, why he did them and whether they were a good thing or not. Plus, rather obviously, his character. Or, more to the point, his lack of it.

Let's remind each other what you said:
Please find a single post where I've supported ANYTHING Trump has done...
Now if you want to insist that you are not a Trump supporter then be my guest. Perhaps you think he's as odious as I do. But that sentence above is clearly and undeniably wrong, as I have shown. You have supported SOMETHING that he has done. As you said:
But agreement on a specific policy position does not indicate "support" for that candidate...
Again, your statement wasn't that you didn't support Trump, but, that you hadn't supported ANYTHING he has done. The sentence above, which refers to his EO on transgender women and educational grants is an acceptance that you did agree with it.
 
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probinson

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No. I'm not sure you're grasping this.

Actually, I'm not sure you're grasping this. This is what you first said when you claimed I was a Trump supporter:

I get this a lot. So many people spend such a large amount of bandwidth denigrating the Democrats and supporting everything that Trump does, excusing his all-to-obvious faults, handwaving away his monstrously ridiculous statements and rejecting any attacks on his credibility, his character, his misogyny, his lies etc and then, when they've spent all this time supporting Trump and cheer leading the GOP, they say 'What me? A supporter? Heaven forbid!'

When you're ensconced in the GOP camp, waving the GOP flag and throwing rocks at the opposition then you will be treated as a supporter of said group.

So you started by saying "supporting everything that Trump does." Strike 1.
Then you moved on to "excusing his [sic] all-to-obvious faults". Strike 2.
Next up, "handwaving away his monstrously ridiculous statements". Strike 3.
On to, "rejecting any attacks on his credibility, his character, his misogyny, his lies". Strike... 4?
And finishing up with, "spent all this time supporting Trump". Absolutely not.

I asked for evidence of any of these claims, and of course you couldn't provide any.

Then when it became obvious this was not an accurate description of me, you pivoted to, remember that time when you agreed with Trump on that thing, as if that were clear evidence that I was a "supporter" of Trump.

You are being intentionally disingenuous.

But if it will make you feel better, I will admit that my statement about not supporting anything Trump has done was a poor choice of words. Clearly there are things Trump has done that I have agreed with. But going back to your original claim, I am not, nor have I ever been, a "Trump supporter".
 
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Bradskii

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Actually, I'm not sure you're grasping this. This is what you first said when you claimed I was a Trump supporter:

So you started by saying "supporting everything that Trump does." Strike 1.
Then you moved on to "excusing his [sic] all-to-obvious faults". Strike 2.
Next up, "handwaving away his monstrously ridiculous statements". Strike 3.
On to, "rejecting any attacks on his credibility, his character, his misogyny, his lies". Strike... 4?
And finishing up with, "spent all this time supporting Trump". Absolutely not.
And you will not fail to notice (or perhaps you did fail) that I said:

'So many people spend such a large amount of bandwidth denigrating the Democrats and supporting everything that Trump does...etc etc'

I was making a general complaint about what a lot of people do in this forum. If I was blaming you for all these things then I would have said:

'You spend such a large amount of bandwidth denigrating the Democrats and supporting everything that Trump does...etc etc'
Then when it became obvious this was not an accurate description of me...
It wasn't a description of you, but of 'so many people' in general. I then went on to say that if you are supporting what the GOP does then you will be included with these people, but you denied that you had supported anything. That has shown to be incorrect. As you confirm below.
But if it will make you feel better, I will admit that my statement about not supporting anything Trump has done was a poor choice of words. Clearly there are things Trump has done that I have agreed with. But going back to your original claim, I am not, nor have I ever been, a "Trump supporter".
Nobody made that claim. I pointed out that you supported things that the GOP had done and you denied it. As above, you've now admitted that you clearly did.
 
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probinson

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And you will not fail to notice (or perhaps you did fail) that I said:

'So many people spend such a large amount of bandwidth denigrating the Democrats and supporting everything that Trump does...etc etc'

So you were replying to me, and then launched into a diatribe that wasn't about me? Alrighty then.

I was making a general complaint about what a lot of people do in this forum. If I was blaming you for all these things then I would have said:

'You spend such a large amount of bandwidth denigrating the Democrats and supporting everything that Trump does...etc etc'

Fair enough.

It wasn't a description of you, but of 'so many people' in general.

Ah. "So many people." ;) Got it. Could you provide evidence of just one of these people, who spend all kinds of time and energy supporting Trump but then claim they're not a Trump supporter?

I then went on to say that if you are supporting what the GOP does then you will be included with these people,

What a weird take. As we've already established, simply agreeing with a position does not indicate that you agree with the person or party in general. I guess when one is consumed with the two party system, this is the inevitable outcome of that false dichotomy. You're either for us or against us!
 
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