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I believe that ALL who ever lived will be in God’s Kingdom

Der Alte

This is me about 1 yr. old. when FDR was president
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Let's start with something simple, like telling the truth.

Does Mark 7:21-23 apply to you?
First I dislike be accused of lying. And I am discussing the vss. in your post #768 We can discuss Mark 7::21-23 at another time. I asked you to clarify the vss. quoted in post # 768 Again my question, "From reading this post [#768] one might understand that not nobody, not no how, is or can be saved. Is that what you are saying?" If I misunderstood you please correct me then we might discuss other vss.
 
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BelieveItOarKnot

Rom 11:32-God bound everyone to disobedience so...
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Right the knowledge of self-awareness is built in thanks to A&E.
Why blame them?

Mark 4:15 applied to them as well. The instant God spoke to them it was no longer "just them" involved.
But we have the power to understand God’s Will is smarter than ours and our allegiance should be to Him rather than our selfish ways.
I think it's safe to say the evil present within no one is in allegiance with God whatsoever.
It still all remains a matter of choice
Uh, no it doesn't. No one chooses themselves into a sinless state, ever.

God specifically bound everyone with disobedience and no amount of freewill can make that not so.
and once we realize our backwards nature there is no excuse not to take responsibility for our own actions.
That really doesn't have a thing to do with the fact that we all have evil lawless thoughts that defile us. It's just a hard line immovable fact. The only claimants that say it isn't so are simply exposed liars or outrageous hypocrites, instantly recognized as such in such phony claims.
It was a matter of choice in the Garden and it still is today
Sorry, choices of Adam and Eve were never the case. They both sinned before they ever ate the infamous fruit.

God meant there to be a first/natural man, planted in weakness, dishonor and corruption, and meant to die one way or another. To be followed by Salvation. 1 Cor. 15:42-46
 
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BelieveItOarKnot

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Simply put, our selfish self-serving nature. Look at Eve and Adam who were unaware of thei dual nature until they became aware of self. There was no way they could have been selfish prior as they couldn’t take anything for self because technically there was no “self”.

We today are aware of self but we need not be selfish. That is why God commanded us to love all as self so we would be givers, not takers.
Boy, your position is really set against the "self" isn't it?

Again, the evil present within ALL of us is utterly incapable of loving anyone.

Doesn't mean we can't love. It just means there is more than just that going on withIN

Paul nailed it in Romans 7:21 showing when he did good, evil was still present with him. It was never a one or the other deal. The light was meant to shine from the dark, by God's Own Command
 
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BelieveItOarKnot

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First I dislike be accused of lying.
The question was simple enough. I appreciate the attempted pirouette past it. We certainly can't be owning up to God's Words when they are against us can we?

As to your supposed insistence that people with evil thoughts can't be saved, that's a configuration in your own head.

Last time I checked the Gospel, God Saves sinners.
 
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BelieveItOarKnot

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Only those who want to self-justify their self-interest
You do remember that in order to be a disciple we are supposed to hate our own lives, right?

Don't you see the connection between the reality of Mark 7:21-23, the evil thoughts that defile EVERYONE is the basis of that hatred?
 
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BelieveItOarKnot

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Romans 12:21 "Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good."
Overcome does not mean evil is no longer present withIN all of us.

Can't overcome what you claim not to have
 
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Der Alte

This is me about 1 yr. old. when FDR was president
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The question was simple enough. I appreciate the attempted pirouette past it. We certainly can't be owning up to God's Words when they are against us can we?

As to your supposed insistence that people with evil thoughts can't be saved, that's a configuration in your own head.

Last time I checked the Gospel, God Saves sinners.
Nothing I posted says or implies that sinners can't be saved. Let's read my question again
"From reading this post [#768] one might understand that not nobody, not no how, is or can be saved. Is that what you are saying?" If I misunderstood you please correct me then we might discuss other vss.





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timothyu

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Did God knowingly create his own adversary … twice? (Satan,man/flesh)
No because it was the adversarial spirit that was created. God was aware of it.
Genesis 3: 22Then the LORD God said, “Behold, the man has become like one of Us, knowing good and evil.
 
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BelieveItOarKnot

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From reading this post [#768] one might understand that not nobody, not no how, is or can be saved. Is that what you are saying?" If I misunderstood you please correct me then we might discuss other vss.
The quite petty attempt above is to put some weird insistence that Mark 7:21-23 which I cited as applicable to all people means what you state above.

It doesn't

Maybe try again?
 
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JulieB67

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Overcome does not mean evil is no longer present withIN all of us.

Can't overcome what you claim not to have
I Peter 3:11 "Let him eschew evil, and do good; let him seek peace, and ensue it."

Psalms 37:27 "Depart from evil, and do good; And dwell for evermore."

Psalms 34:14 "Depart from evil and do good; Seek peace, and pursue it."
 
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BelieveItOarKnot

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I Peter 3:11 "Let him eschew evil, and do good; let him seek peace, and ensue it."

Psalms 37:27 "Depart from evil, and do good; And dwell for evermore."

Psalms 34:14 "Depart from evil and do good; Seek peace, and pursue it."
The point will stand. God saves sinners. No one is sinless.

Did you you sins are "NOT COUNTED" against people? 2 Cor. 5:19, or did you deny that one? Don't recall.

Did you know unbelief is a SIN? John 16:8-9
 
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Aseyesee

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No because it was the adversarial spirit that was created. God was aware of it.
Genesis 3: 22Then the LORD God said, “Behold, the man has become like one of Us, knowing good and evil.
God would have known before the consequence of his actions ...
 
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JulieB67

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No one is sinless.
Whoever stated that on this thread??

Did you you sins are "NOT COUNTED" against people?
And are you really going to continue with this lie when the rest of the word -for example Christ's Revelation to John tells us the exact opposite? Sins count.

Revelation 2:5 "Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent."

Revelation 2:7 "He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God.

Revelation 2:16 "Repent; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will fight against them with the sword of my mouth."

Revelation 2:17 "He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden man'-na, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knowth saving he that receiveth it."


Revelation 2:21 "And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not.

Revelation 2:22 "Behold, I will cast her into bed, and them that commit adultery with her unto great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds.


Revelation 3:3 "Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon you."

Revelation 3:5 "He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels."

Revelation 20:15 "And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire."


We see the condition in all of these verses -he who overcomes.

? 2 Cor. 5:19, or did you deny that one? Don't recall.

Paul states also that sins are counted against the people. Only those that are reconciled with God will not have their sins imputed.

First let's get this verse out of the way because the Judgement Seat of Christ is for people, not Satan and his angels who have already been judged to the Lake of Fire



II Corinthians 5:10 "For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad."


Revelation 20:12"And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works."

Book of life is opened, why is that if all are saved at this point? Again, Satan and his angels have already been judged and are not in the book of life. This book of life that is opened is the very same book that is talked about in chapter 3 when it states he overcomes will not have his name blotted out of the book of life. So yes, as much as you want to deny this truth, it counts.

Revelation 20:13 "And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works."

Revelation 20:14 "And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death."
The lake of fire "is" the second death.

We know from an earlier verse that people, yes people who don't take part in the first resurrection are in danger of the second death. To say otherwise would also be a denial.

Revelation 20:6 "Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years."

Revelation 20:15 "And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire."



I Corinthians 5:15 "And that He died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto Him Which died for them, and rose again."

Do you know what that means? God's will over our own.


I Corinthians 5:16 "Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we Him no more."

I Corinthians 5:17 "Therefore if any man be in Christ he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new."

II Corinthians 5:18 "And all things are of God, Who hath reconciled us to Himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;"


Verse 19 is in context with these verses. It doesn't state all in that verse it states "us". Only those are given the ministry of reconciliation.

I Corinthians 5:19 "To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto Himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them, and hath committed unto us the world of reconciliation."

The ones reconciled with Christ will not have their transgressions imputed against them.

We see as I have posted with everyone will appear before the Judgement Seat of Christ. And all of the books are opened at that point.


II Corinthians 5:20 "Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

Paul is praying that we be reconciled to God. Why would he pray in the very next verse if all are already reconciled regardless?? You are not making sense with your beliefs. Context matters.

And nice sidetrack of the verses I posted about "departing from evil"
 
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Aseyesee

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Your choices here are limited in the example of Jesus being tempted by/of Satan in the desert.

Either Jesus was Satan, tempting himself in the desert OR Satan was a separate agent aka the tempter, the spirit of disobedience, the devil, the great red dragon, leviathan, the tare, the goat, etc etc.

God is not the author of confusion, yet confused the language of the people at the tower of Babel.

There is a line of distinction drawn between people and devils. They are not treated the same by God

The more interesting aspect of scripture is, it shows us these two distinct agencies occupy the same pair of shoes.

With one sole exception, of course.

Jesus was tempter. But without sin.

None of us have that distinction.
So when do you believe someone gets their (literal) devil?
 
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BelieveItOarKnot

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And are you really going to continue with this lie when the rest of the word -for example Christ's Revelation to John tells us the exact opposite? Sins count.
Your position can't comprehend that there is an adversary, an enemy present within every person and instead you automatically insert only people and forgets to see the enemies altogether

It's a common form of spiritual blindness

Your positions can't see it
 
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BelieveItOarKnot

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Then Jesus really wasn't tempted like we are ...
Only IF you read half the scripture and forgot the "but without sin" part

I'd call being God in the flesh somewhat of a huge difference, wouldn't you?
 
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