Director of National Intelligence Gabbard calls for prosecution of Obama

ThatRobGuy · Saturday at 6:58 PM

Valletta said:
Committing felonies by using taxpayer money to influence a presidential election is a misuse of power that shows real contempt for the American people and democratic elections.

That's one of those aspects that bigger than either party, and is currently baked into the system itself.

I completely understand why people are unhappy with that arrangement, but invoking that sad reality about our political system in a one-directional fashion only undermines the credibility of the complaint, it doesn't strengthen it.

The US has direct public funding of Presidential campaigns through the "Presidential Election Campaign Fund", which is just direct funding of campaigns (which, campaigns are by their very nature, processes that seek to influence elections)

And that doesn't even delve into the litany of 501(c)(3) orgs that receive government grants and tax breaks, and try to influence elections via their 501(c)(4) "sister affiliates"

Those organizations use their "non-political activities :wink wink:" as a slush fund to funnel money to their sister organizations that do directly influence elections, or they claim the vague status as "issue advocacy", which is a crock, because everyone know which issue positions align with which party.

"I'm just advocating for pro-gun, pro-life, pro-Traditional marriage causes, but I'm not endorsing any candidate"
"I'm just advocating for pro-LGBT, pro-environment, pro-Minimum wage increase, but I'm certainly not encouraging you to vote for one candidate or the other"

Right....

While I think you and I have lots of points of agreement on certain issues (based on our posting histories), I'm not a fan of "throwing the book" at one side for something that's basically ubiquitous in our flawed system.

Hans Blaster · Saturday at 7:08 PM

ThatRobGuy said:
That's one of those aspects that bigger than either party, and is currently baked into the system itself.

I completely understand why people are unhappy with that arrangement, but invoking that sad reality about our political system in a one-directional fashion only undermines the credibility of the complaint, it doesn't strengthen it.

The US has direct public funding of Presidential campaigns through the "Presidential Election Campaign Fund", which is just direct funding of campaigns (which, campaigns are by their very nature, processes that seek to influence elections)

And that doesn't even delve into the litany of 501(c)(3) orgs that receive government grants and tax breaks, and try to influence elections via their 501(c)(4) "sister affiliates"

Those organizations use their "non-political activities :wink wink:" as a slush fund to funnel money to their sister organizations that do directly influence elections, or they claim the vague status as "issue advocacy", which is a crock, because everyone know which issue positions align with which party.

"I'm just advocating for pro-gun, pro-life, pro-Traditional marriage causes, but I'm not endorsing any candidate"
"I'm just advocating for pro-LGBT, pro-environment, pro-Minimum wage increase, but I'm certainly not encouraging you to vote for one candidate or the other"

Right....

While I think you and I have lots of points of agreement on certain issues (based on our posting histories), I'm not a fan of "throwing the book" at one side for something that's basically ubiquitous in our flawed system.

Rob, that's not what this is about. It is about some whinging from Trump's "media" allies about actual investigations into Russian election interference. (Whether it had any impact on the 2016 outcome or not.) It's not about public finance or non-profits dipping into politics.

ThatRobGuy · Saturday at 7:20 PM

Hans Blaster said:
Rob, that's not what this is about. It is about some whinging from Trump's "media" allies about actual investigations into Russian election interference. (Whether it had any impact on the 2016 outcome or not.) It's not about public finance or non-profits dipping into politics.

The post I was replying to said this:
"using taxpayer money to influence a presidential election is a misuse of power that shows real contempt for the American people and democratic elections."

As far as the election interference aspect goes...

I'm not terribly concerned whether or not the source of the interference comes from a rich person who likes to sip high end vodka in St. Petersburg vs. a rich person who likes to sip high end wine in Napa Valley.

BCP1928 · Saturday at 7:44 PM

Valletta said:
It's not about whether I'm serious, it's about whether Director Gabbard is serious.

I don't care if she is serious or not. If she wants to investigate Obama she is welcome to, as far as I am concerned--he's a big boy and can deal with it. The "own the libs" gloating is just childish.

Hans Blaster · Saturday at 8:16 PM

ThatRobGuy said:
The post I was replying to said this:
"using taxpayer money to influence a presidential election is a misuse of power that shows real contempt for the American people and democratic elections."

Which is a complaint about using *GOVERNMENT* money, not donor money for campaigns. (And "public financing" is just "donors" marking boxes on the tax forms like suckers.)

ThatRobGuy said:
As far as the election interference aspect goes...

I'm not terribly concerned whether or not the source of the interference comes from a rich person who likes to sip high end vodka in St. Petersburg vs. a rich person who likes to sip high end wine in Napa Valley.

How patriotic of you.

ThatRobGuy · Saturday at 8:29 PM

Hans Blaster said:
How patriotic of you.

You mean how "un-racist" of me...

The fact that I see "foreign subversion" as being no worse than "domestic subversion" isn't a black mark on my record and doesn't conflict with any of my suppositions.

"The same concept is worse if it comes from another country" does, however, put a wrinkle in the progressive orthodoxy.

Hans Blaster · Saturday at 10:51 PM

ThatRobGuy said:
You mean how "un-racist" of me...

Race has nothing to do with it. Perhaps your sarcasm detector failed. Repeated this time with out sarcasm:

How UNpatriotic of you, Rob.

ThatRobGuy said:
The fact that I see "foreign subversion" as being no worse than "domestic subversion" isn't a black mark on my record and doesn't conflict with any of my suppositions.

What?!? The stupid Supreme Court ruled $=speech, so American rich guys can spend whatever they want on political campaigns. So long as it is legal, that isn't subversion, it's just a campagin donation. Foreign government or individuals are not legally allowed to donate, but the Russia business wasn't about money given to Trump's campaign, it was about a hostile foreign intelligence service taking direct actions in US politics. (It is a black mark.)

For more information, see portions of the Mueller Report, the Senate Intelligence report, and possibly the House Intelligence report.

ThatRobGuy said:
"The same concept is worse if it comes from another country" does, however, put a wrinkle in the progressive orthodoxy.

I don't claim to understand your politics, but this has nothing to do with "progressive orthodoxy".

Ophiolite · Sunday at 1:42 AM

I'm moving slowly towards the provisional conclusion that civilisation is too complicated for humans to do properly.

I don't have a Plan B.

HIM · Sunday at 4:31 AM

Valletta said:
"Their egregious abuse of power and blatant rejection of our Constitution threatens the very foundation and integrity of our democratic republic. No matter how powerful, every person involved in this conspiracy must be investigated and prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law, to ensure nothing like this ever happens again. The American people’s faith and trust in our democratic republic and therefore the future of our nation depends on it. As such, I am providing all documents to the Department of Justice to deliver the accountability that President Trump, his family, and the American people deserve."

BREAKING: DNI Tulsi Gabbard demands prosecution of Obama admin personnel over 2016 ‘treasonous conspiracy’ against Trump

“No matter how powerful, every person involved in this conspiracy must be investigated and prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.”

thepostmillennial.com

I think a deal should be cut for an admission of guilt with heavy fines and no jail time.

If where true then President Trump could have been found to be a traitor and could have faced the firing squad. Since President Obama's actions posed a threat on the President Trump's life, I think the same should happen to him. They should prosecute him for treason with the threat of death looming over the trail.

Valletta · Sunday at 3:23 PM

HIM said:
If where true then President Trump could have been found to be a traitor and could have faced the firing squad. Since President Obama's actions posed a threat on the President Trump's life, I think the same should happen to him. They should prosecute him for treason with the threat of death looming over the trail.

You lost me--and more importantly the discussion is not about what Trump did. We are talking about the Obama administration and Obama ordering Clapper to go ahead and promote a known fabrication to damage Trump's presidential campaign. Such would be a tremendous breach of trust by the Obama administration.

Desk trauma · Sunday at 3:30 PM

Valletta said:
You lost me--and more importantly the discussion is not about what Trump did. We are talking about the Obama administration and Obama ordering Clapper to go ahead and promote a known fabrication to damage Trump's presidential campaign. Such would be a tremendous breach of trust by the Obama administration.

Having to stretch back almost a decade for distractions now.

Vambram · Sunday at 3:37 PM

Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard detailed "striking" findings from declassified documents released Friday, claiming to showcase "overwhelming evidence" that an Obama-era cabal laid the groundwork for what would be the years-long Trump-Russia collusion probe after the 2016 election.

"The implications of this are frankly nothing short of historic," Gabbard said on this week's "Sunday Morning Futures."

"Over 100 documents that we released on Friday really detail and provide evidence of how this treasonous conspiracy was directed by President Obama just weeks before he was due to leave office after President Trump had already gotten elected. This is not a Democrat or Republican issue. This is an issue that is so serious it should concern every single American because it has to do with the integrity of our democratic republic," she continued.

Tulsi Gabbard details bombshell claims of Obama-era cabal's 'treasonous conspiracy' against Trump

DNI Tulsi Gabbard reveals declassified documents allegedly showing Obama officials manufactured intelligence to undermine Trump, announcing criminal referrals to DOJ.

www.foxnews.com

Desk trauma · Sunday at 3:40 PM

Vambram said:
Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard detailed "striking" findings from declassified documents released Friday, claiming to showcase "overwhelming evidence" that an Obama-era cabal laid the groundwork for what would be the years-long Trump-Russia collusion probe after the 2016 election.

"The implications of this are frankly nothing short of historic," Gabbard said on this week's "Sunday Morning Futures."

"Over 100 documents that we released on Friday really detail and provide evidence of how this treasonous conspiracy was directed by President Obama just weeks before he was due to leave office after President Trump had already gotten elected. This is not a Democrat or Republican issue. This is an issue that is so serious it should concern every single American because it has to do with the integrity of our democratic republic," she continued.

Tulsi Gabbard details bombshell claims of Obama-era cabal's 'treasonous conspiracy' against Trump

DNI Tulsi Gabbard reveals declassified documents allegedly showing Obama officials manufactured intelligence to undermine Trump, announcing criminal referrals to DOJ.

www.foxnews.com

I’m sure he’ll be in the dock within the month.

HIM · Sunday at 3:47 PM

Valletta said:
. We are talking about the Obama administration and Obama ordering Clapper to go ahead and promote a known fabrication to damage Trump's presidential campaign. Such would be a tremendous breach of trust by the Obama administration.

Of course

essentialsaltes · Monday at 8:24 AM

Desk trauma said:
Having to stretch back almost a decade for distractions now.

Maybe they can finally lock Hillary up.

wing2000 · Monday at 8:53 AM

Valletta said:
It's not about whether I'm serious, it's about whether Director Gabbard is serious.

...Tulsi attempting to claw her way back into Trump's inner circle.

rjs330 · Monday at 11:40 AM

More evidence that the whole Russia collusion/collaboration was a hoax perpetrated by Democrats trying to not just influence an election but take down a duly elected president.

I hope people go to prison for this.

BCP1928 · Monday at 12:05 PM

Vambram said:
Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard detailed "striking" findings from declassified documents released Friday, claiming to showcase "overwhelming evidence" that an Obama-era cabal laid the groundwork for what would be the years-long Trump-Russia collusion probe after the 2016 election.

"The implications of this are frankly nothing short of historic," Gabbard said on this week's "Sunday Morning Futures."

"Over 100 documents that we released on Friday really detail and provide evidence of how this treasonous conspiracy was directed by President Obama just weeks before he was due to leave office after President Trump had already gotten elected. This is not a Democrat or Republican issue. This is an issue that is so serious it should concern every single American because it has to do with the integrity of our democratic republic," she continued.

Tulsi Gabbard details bombshell claims of Obama-era cabal's 'treasonous conspiracy' against Trump

DNI Tulsi Gabbard reveals declassified documents allegedly showing Obama officials manufactured intelligence to undermine Trump, announcing criminal referrals to DOJ.

www.foxnews.com

Tulsi Gabbard cares about the integrity of our democratic republic? Who knew?

Pommer · Monday at 1:03 PM

rjs330 said:
More evidence that the whole Russia collusion/collaboration was a hoax perpetrated by Democrats trying to not just influence an election but take down a duly elected president.

I hope people go to prison for this.

Odd that the Trump Administration went to all the trouble to thoroughly investigate this, then.
Doubly odd that the GOP controlled Senate issued a report, as well.

essentialsaltes · Monday at 1:17 PM

rjs330 said:
More evidence

What evidence? We have Gabbard's opinion.

rjs330 said:
I hope people go to prison for this.

I wish the people who were convicted or pleaded guilty for colluding with Russia (and/or lying about it to federal agents) had gone to prison, but I think Trump pardoned them all.

Director of National Intelligence Gabbard calls for prosecution of Obama

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