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Cessationism isn't biblical
- Thread starter Dustoff
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Guojing
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I am sure you are aware that the book of Corinthians was written before Acts 28.
There is a reason, why in his epistles written after that, he made no more mention of that gift, and in several places, he has written that there are no longer healing guarantees (Philippians 2:26-27, 1 Timothy 5:23, 2 Timothy 4:20)
But since these passages do not support your doctrine, you considered them irrelevant.
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Guojing
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You are creating your own laws now. Not following the Bible.
Which is why you have zero Scripture for it.
God bless!
Ciao
I used so many different scripture passages there.
If you have alternative interpretations of them, you could share them
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ARBITER01
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The whole of the NT church teachings was given to Paul from Jesus. It seems you are unable to understand how His ministry and work was carried on through us, hence why we find the gifts listed in a letter to a gentile church.
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I had said: "I'm saying it was never Jesus' mission to heal everyone, and it's not today."
They're not remotely the same statements.
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Guojing
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Fair enough, thanks for clarifying
Then how would you understand Acts 10:38?
38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.
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Guojing
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No... you claimed outright without Scripture...
"You cannot use Rahab as an example for us today."
You made that up. lol
That is my conclusion, the supporting premises are listed after that.
You don't understand how logical arguments work?
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Zceptre
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Your second point in the list refers to males... In this point you are using an example that doesn't apply to Rahab.
The third point you concede to the opposing argument.
The fourth point you threw the rules you are claiming out the window and jumped on the grace train.
The fifth point you are stating that God's example doesn't matter and included no Scripture again.
The sixth point your Scripture is totally irrelevant to the discussion as it is referring to believing, not adoption or conversion into God's family.
Don't attempt to indirectly insult me with implications through questions please. lol It looks bad on you.
Good day.
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Guojing
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Your second point in the list refers to males... In this point you are using an example that doesn't apply to Rahab.
The second point you concede to the opposing argument.
The third point you threw the rules you are claiming out the window and jumped on the grace train.
The fourth point you are stating that God's example doesn't matter and included no Scripture again.
The fifth point your Scripture is totally irrelevant to the discussion as it is referring to believing, not adoption or conversion into God's family.
Don't attempt to indirectly insult me with implications through questions please. lol It looks bad on you.
Good day.
There is a big difference between "having zero scripture" and "I disagree with your interpretation of scripture"
Good day to you as well.
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1 Cor 12:7,11
Now to each one the manifestation of the Spirit is given for the common good ... All these are the work of one and the same Spirit, and he distributes them to each one, just as he determines.
I would say Paul is expecting each should at least strive to operate in the gifts. Unless you interpreted "each one" to mean only those selected.
Although not everyone has ambition to be Christ like it is the Christian mandate upon us. Can the same be said of the Spirit as we are called to walk in the Spirit should we also expect an outflowing of the gifts as it's product to at least those with the ambition to take it seriously.
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ARBITER01
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It's only a byproduct of those filled with The Holy Spirit, and even then only a few will really rise up to the standard that Jesus walked in.
Look around. How many Smith Wigglesworth type folks do we have in the body of Christ nowadays?
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"Now after Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judea in the days of Herod the king, behold, wise men from the east came to Jerusalem, saying, 'Where is he who has been born king of the Jews? For we saw his star when it rose and have come to worship him.' When Herod the king heard this, he was troubled, and all Jerusalem with him." -- Matthew 2.
Was all Jerusalem troubled with Herod?
Simeon? Anna?
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ViaCrucis
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When the debate is always presented as a dichotomy between Cessationism on the one hand, and Charismaticism on the other then what gets ignored are views which don't fit into the Cessationist-Charismaticist dichotomy.
Arguably, the historic Christian position has been neither Cessationist nor Charismaticist; the historic Christian position is that God continues to operate within His Church through a diversity of gifts and callings and vocations; the prophetic and apostolic operation within the Church is not exercised by "special" ministers called "prophets" and "apostles" but in the ordinary and mundane ecclesiological activity of Word and Sacrament, in the operation and exercising the ministry of the Keys, and in the ordinary Liturgy and life of the Church. This isn't to say that there aren't men and women who have incredible stories and who have said and done things of great value--the gifts, stories, and lives of God's saints are many; but rather it is to say that those who draw attention to themselves, rather than to the word of God, are probably not voices worth listening to. Someone who stylizes themselves prophet or apostle is almost certainly at best, deluded and at worst a self-aggrandizing monster. I can be confident of the ongoing apostolic gifts not because modern people decide to call themselves apostles; but because since the days of the Apostles in God's Church the Word is preached, the Sacraments are administered, forgiveness of sins is proclaimed, and the name of Jesus is exalted.
-CryptoLutheran
Arguably, the historic Christian position has been neither Cessationist nor Charismaticist; the historic Christian position is that God continues to operate within His Church through a diversity of gifts and callings and vocations; the prophetic and apostolic operation within the Church is not exercised by "special" ministers called "prophets" and "apostles" but in the ordinary and mundane ecclesiological activity of Word and Sacrament, in the operation and exercising the ministry of the Keys, and in the ordinary Liturgy and life of the Church. This isn't to say that there aren't men and women who have incredible stories and who have said and done things of great value--the gifts, stories, and lives of God's saints are many; but rather it is to say that those who draw attention to themselves, rather than to the word of God, are probably not voices worth listening to. Someone who stylizes themselves prophet or apostle is almost certainly at best, deluded and at worst a self-aggrandizing monster. I can be confident of the ongoing apostolic gifts not because modern people decide to call themselves apostles; but because since the days of the Apostles in God's Church the Word is preached, the Sacraments are administered, forgiveness of sins is proclaimed, and the name of Jesus is exalted.
-CryptoLutheran
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