What mans religion teaches about faith and repentance !

Brightfame52 · May 15, 2025

Are Faith and Repentance evangelical truths that must be preached ? The answer is absolutely yes, Jesus said Lk 24:47

And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

So its no doubt that sound Gospel preaching includes repentance. However where men go wrong is when they make repentance and or faith conditions for Justification before God ! They say that men and women for whom Christ died are not justified, made righteous before God without them ! They are in essence saying that everything Christ did for them in His Person and Work fell short in making them righteous/justified before God.

Confused-by-christianity · May 15, 2025

Brightfame52 said:
Are Faith and Repentance evangelical truths that must be preached ? The answer is absolutely yes, Jesus said Lk 24:47

And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

So its no doubt that sound Gospel preaching includes repentance. However where men go wrong is when they make repentance and or faith conditions for Justification before God ! They say that men and women for whom Christ died are not justified, made righteous before God without them ! They are in essence saying that everything Christ did for them in His Person and Work fell short in making them righteous/justified before God.

You could have concepts which are slightly different from each other??

1) Justification

You did the bad thing - but you had your reasons. The reasons were strong enough that we don't blame you. I'm not saying you're a good person though. You still did the bad thing.

2) Righteousness

This, to me, is to do with error. Right and wrong - you can mean well but be incorrect in your calculations. It's not a willful decision to be evil - you just dont know you're doing the bad thing. Or that it's bad.

3) Goodness

This is a whole other thing entirely. Goodness is like a spiritual substance that exists. Goodness is hard to describe and it seems to be experienced.

War may be justified and in a legal system permitted as right - but it's hardly experienced as good.

I'd chase goodness rather than try and piece together anomalies in theology.

Maria Billingsley · May 15, 2025

Brightfame52 said:
Are Faith and Repentance evangelical truths that must be preached ? The answer is absolutely yes, Jesus said Lk 24:47

And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

So its no doubt that sound Gospel preaching includes repentance. However where men go wrong is when they make repentance and or faith conditions for Justification before God ! They say that men and women for whom Christ died are not justified, made righteous before God without them ! They are in essence saying that everything Christ did for them in His Person and Work fell short in making them righteous/justified before God.

To repent is to " change one's mind". One must first change from unbelief to belief, then their sins are forgiven. From there we are immediately sanctified, set apart and made holy. We then grow in holiness through the power of His Holy Spirit who dwells in the believer. It is a lifelong journey where, through the power of His Holy Spirit, believers increasingly die to sin and live to righteousness. We know them by their fruits.
Blessings

Confused-by-christianity · May 15, 2025

Maria Billingsley said:
One must first change from unbelief to belief,

How do you believe something you dont believe??

Maria Billingsley · May 15, 2025

Confused-by-christianity said:
How do you believe something you dont believe??

Romans 10:17:
So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. (NKJV)

OR

Consequently, faith comes from hearing the message, and the message is heard through the word about Christ. (NIV)

This verse highlights the crucial role of hearing God's Word in the development of faith.

Brightfame52 · May 15, 2025

Confused-by-christianity said:
You could have concepts which are slightly different from each other??

1) Justification

You did the bad thing - but you had your reasons. The reasons were strong enough that we don't blame you. I'm not saying you're a good person though. You still did the bad thing.

2) Righteousness

This, to me, is to do with error. Right and wrong - you can mean well but be incorrect in your calculations. It's not a willful decision to be evil - you just dont know you're doing the bad thing. Or that it's bad.

3) Goodness

This is a whole other thing entirely. Goodness is like a spiritual substance that exists. Goodness is hard to describe and it seems to be experienced.

War may be justified and in a legal system permitted as right - but it's hardly experienced as good.

I'd chase goodness rather than try and piece together anomalies in theology.

Huh ? Did you comprehend my post ? I cant tell

Confused-by-christianity · May 15, 2025

Maria Billingsley said:
Romans 10:17:
So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. (NKJV)

OR

Consequently, faith comes from hearing the message, and the message is heard through the word about Christ. (NIV)

This verse highlights the crucial role of hearing God's Word in the development of faith.

I would suggest something else for thought.

Maybe the words “belief” and “faith” mean different things.

I can’t help what I believe - if I believe the egg is broken, I can’t simply decide to believe it’s not broken.

Maybe faith refers to something more of an attitude to life. ??

Maybe I believe the egg is broken because of my attitude to start with ??

Eh???

Confused-by-christianity · May 15, 2025

Brightfame52 said:
Huh ? Did you comprehend my post ? I cant tell

Basically … youre saying …

You don’t need faith and repentance to be justified before god. You think they are truths and should be preached, however,

Christs work and his gift alone justifies you before god.

??? Have I understood correctly ???

d taylor · May 15, 2025

-

A person can only receive God's free gift of Eternal Life when they believe in Jesus.

Confused-by-christianity · May 15, 2025

d taylor said:
A person can only receive God's free gift of Eternal Life when they believe in Jesus.

What does “believe in Jesus” mean?

d taylor · May 15, 2025

Confused-by-christianity said:
What does “believe in Jesus” mean?

-

I will let The Bible/Jesus tell you.

But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
-------------------------
Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live. And whoever lives and believes in Me shall never die. Do you believe this?”
She said to Him, “Yes, Lord, I believe that You are the Christ, the Son of God, who is to come into the world.”
-------------------------------
And truly Jesus did many other signs in the presence of His disciples, which are not written in this book; but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name.

Confused-by-christianity · May 15, 2025

d taylor said:
-

I will let The Bible/Jesus tell you.

But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
-------------------------
Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live. And whoever lives and believes in Me shall never die. Do you believe this?”
She said to Him, “Yes, Lord, I believe that You are the Christ, the Son of God, who is to come into the world.”
-------------------------------
And truly Jesus did many other signs in the presence of His disciples, which are not written in this book; but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name.

I skip cut/pasting - sorry.

It’s not so bad if it comes with an explanation of what the person thinks is being said - but without that, I’m as clueless as before.

If the answer is “I don’t know what it means to believe in him”, that’s understandable (that’s where I’m at).

d taylor · May 15, 2025

Confused-by-christianity said:
I skip cut/pasting - sorry.

It’s not so bad if it comes with an explanation of what the person thinks is being said - but without that, I’m as clueless as before.

If the answer is “I don’t know what it means to believe in him”, that’s understandable (that’s where I’m at).

-

Did you not read the verses, they plainly state that to believe in Jesus, is to believe that Jesus is who He says He is. Which is The Son of God/The Messiah, the resurrection and the life.

Here is a written article on what it mean to believe in Jesus.

What Does It Mean to Believe in Jesus? – Grace Evangelical Society
What Did the Lord Jesus Mean When He Said, “He Who Believes in Me”? – Grace Evangelical Society

Also
Is faith a Decision

Confused-by-christianity · May 15, 2025

d taylor said:
Did you not read the verses, they plainly state that to believe in Jesus, is to believe that Jesus is who He says He is.

I almost never read unexplained cut/pasting - it’s nearly a rule of mine.

The person needs to explain what they think the verse means and how they interpret it.

d taylor said:
Which is The Son of God/The Messiah, the resurrection and the life.

Here is a written article on what it mean to believe in Jesus.

What Does It Mean to Believe in Jesus? – Grace Evangelical Society

Also
Is faith a Decision

Above - I can read the article and I know that when you say “believe in Jesus” and paste the verses - you agree with the article.

Maybe there is a whole body of knowledge out there that a group of Christian’s take for granted and think everyone knows what they mean when they say stuff.

For example
Believe in Jesus?? Believe in what about Jesus?? That he is the son of god? What does that mean? What is gods son?? What do they mean by messiah? What’s their concept of a messiah? What does it mean when you say someone is “the resurrection”?

What’s more - is I don’t know the prior assumptions the quoter has made about the bible before they cut/paste.

Personal note here - I’ve been cut/pasted so many times by someone trying to win an argument that I think it’s easier that I say I’m not a “bible believing Christian”. There’s probably my own stuff in there too.

Clare73 · May 15, 2025

Confused-by-christianity said:
You could have concepts which are slightly different from each other??

Christianity does not leave you wondering about the meaning of its words.
The language of Scripture (Greek) defines Christian concepts.

Confused-by-christianity said:
1) Justification

You did the bad thing - but you had your reasons. The reasons were strong enough that we don't blame you. I'm not saying you're a good person though. You still did the bad thing

That is one meaning of justification used in Scripture. There is also another meaning used in Scripture.
Justification (dikaiosis) is a pronouncement of acquittal of sin, of righteousness, because of saving faith in Jesus Christ and his atoning work for your sin.

Confused-by-christianity said:
2) Righteousness

This, to me, is to do with error. Right and wrong - you can mean well but be incorrect in your calculations. It's not a willful decision to be evil - you just dont know you're doing the bad thing. Or that it's bad.

Righteousness (dikaiosune) is the character or quality of right conduct, judged by the Divine standard (which takes your personal notions out of the equation).

Confused-by-christianity said:
3) Goodness

This is a whole other thing entirely. Goodness is like a spiritual substance that exists. Goodness is hard to describe and it seems to be experienced.

Goodness (agathos) is that which in its character or constitution is beneficial in its effect.

Confused-by-christianity said:
War may be justified and in a legal system permitted as right - but it's hardly experienced as good.
I'd chase goodness rather than try and piece together anomalies in theology.

Anomalies in theology are the same as the anomalies in reality.

Brightfame52 · May 15, 2025

Confused-by-christianity said:
Basically … youre saying …

You don’t need faith and repentance to be justified before god. You think they are truths and should be preached, however,

Christs work and his gift alone justifies you before god.

??? Have I understood correctly ???

Okay seems like you did understand !

Clare73 · May 15, 2025

Confused-by-christianity said:
Basically … youre saying …

You don’t need faith and repentance to be justified before god.

Contraire. . .

We are justified by faith (Ro 3:28).

Confused-by-christianity said:
You think they are truths and should be preached, however,

Christs work and his gift alone justifies you before god.

??? Have I understood correctly ???

Yes and no. . .

Yes, Christ's work and his gift alone justifies before God.

No. . . you do need faith to access that justification (Ro 3:28, 22-24, 5:1, Gal 2:16, 3:11).

Maria Billingsley · May 15, 2025

Confused-by-christianity said:
I would suggest something else for thought.

Maybe the words “belief” and “faith” mean different things.

I can’t help what I believe - if I believe the egg is broken, I can’t simply decide to believe it’s not broken.

Maybe faith refers to something more of an attitude to life. ??

Maybe I believe the egg is broken because of my attitude to start with ??

Eh???

Confusion over a simple realty could cause doubt for its mere simplicity.
Thanks for sharing!

d taylor · May 15, 2025

Confused-by-christianity said:
I almost never read unexplained cut/pasting - it’s nearly a rule of mine.

The person needs to explain what they think the verse means and how they interpret it.

Above - I can read the article and I know that when you say “believe in Jesus” and paste the verses - you agree with the article.

Maybe there is a whole body of knowledge out there that a group of Christian’s take for granted and think everyone knows what they mean when they say stuff.

For example
Believe in Jesus?? Believe in what about Jesus?? That he is the son of god? What does that mean? What is gods son?? What do they mean by messiah? What’s their concept of a messiah? What does it mean when you say someone is “the resurrection”?

What’s more - is I don’t know the prior assumptions the quoter has made about the bible before they cut/paste.

Personal note here - I’ve been cut/pasted so many times by someone trying to win an argument that I think it’s easier that I say I’m not a “bible believing Christian”. There’s probably my own stuff in there too.

-

What would you have rather me write out the verses, if so what is the difference.

The verses i posted clearly explain what belief in Jesus is. they plainly state that to believe in Jesus, is to believe that Jesus is who He says He is. Which is The Son of God/The Messiah, the resurrection and the life.

Are you just purposely being obtuse or are you actually looking for answers when you ask a question, when quoting a person post.

You ask me What does “believe in Jesus” mean? and i posted verse stating what belief in Jesus is. But you reply was simply accusing me of copying and pasting and no thought on what the verses stated.

Confused-by-christianity · May 15, 2025

Clare73 said:
Clare73 said:

Christianity does hot leave you wondering about the meaning of its words.
The language of Scripture (Greek) defines Christian concepts.

That is one meaning of justification used in Scripture. There is also another meaning used in Scripture.
Justification (dikaiosis) is a pronouncement of acquittal of sin, of righteousness, because of saving faith in Jesus Christ and his atoning work for your sin.

Righteousness (dikaiosune) is the character or quality of right conduct, judged by the Divine standard (which takes your personal notions out of the equation).

Goodness (agathos) is that which in its character or constitution is beneficial in its effect.

Anomalies in theology are the same as the anomalies in reality.

Click to expand...

You have misunderstood what i was saying (which is ironic) - and so consequently gone off on defining what ancient greek words mean.

I cannot believe the irony !!!

What mans religion teaches about faith and repentance !

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