I will scientifically prove the existence of God to you

Tinker Grey · May 9, 2025

Hans Blaster said:
I don't even read his posts, but the "pi=3" argument is a bad one. The text only gives one digit of precision (ten, thirty), to which pi is 3. It makes no claim that there is more precision.

In "floating point" notation (the one used by computers to write large numbers,

d = 1.e01 ( or 1. x 10^1)
c = 3.e01 ( or 3. x10^1)
pi = 3.e00 ( or 3. x10^0)

This notation, with no more digits written after the decimal point, indicates that all we know is the "3" or "1" part. We know nothing else. This is a general problem with proper measurements that fall on round numbers, which is why this somewhat awkward form is useful for expressing what precision is available. If we knew that 30 was not 29 or 31, then we would write it as:

d = 1.0e01
c = 3.0e01
inferring pi = 3.0e00, which is clearly wrong as pi=3.1e00

Part of the problem with 1 Kings 7:23 (KJV) is that it says a line of 30 cubits "did compass it about". It did not. It could not. If it just said it was 30 around without the line bit, the single digit thing would apply.

Hence my suggested wording above.

The fundamental point is that the text is not perfect communication.

AV1611VET · May 9, 2025

Tinker Grey said:
The fundamental point is that the text is not perfect communication.

I recently made these notes in my Bible software:

1 Kings 7:23 And he made a molten sea, ten cubits from the one brim to the other: it was round all about, and his height was five cubits: and a line of thirty cubits did compass it round about.

From AI Overview:

Written drafts are generally considered "not to scale." Scale drawings, like those in architecture or engineering, use specific ratios to represent real-world objects in a reduced or enlarged form. Written drafts, on the other hand, are typically sketches or preliminary versions and are not meant to represent precise measurements.

This isn't saying Pi=3.0

Darwin was 73 years 2 months 9 days old when he died; it's okay to say he died at 73.

Thus it's okay to truncate Pi.

It is 2982 miles from Boston to Los Angeles; it's okay to say it is 3000 miles.

Thus it's okay to round up the diameter, which in that passage, would be 9.549 cubits.

Either way you look at it, Pi or circumference or diameter, it is correct as narrated.

Warden_of_the_Storm · May 9, 2025

AV1611VET said:
I don't think he does either.

He thinks I am a YEC, and this causes him to see my posts as "nonsense," which they would seem nonsensical to a YEC.

But viewed as Embedded Age, my posts should make sense.

Unless their devotion to science is so strong they have mental blocks.

In short, I can understand why my posts make no sense to him.

If you say God created the world 6,000 years ago, no amount of embedded age hides the fact that it makes you a Young Earth Creationist. And you do say that God created the world 6,000 years ago.

dlamberth · May 9, 2025

AV1611VET said:
I don't think he does either.

He thinks I am a YEC, and this causes him to see my posts as "nonsense," which they would seem nonsensical to a YEC.

But viewed as Embedded Age, my posts should make sense.

Unless their devotion to science is so strong they have mental blocks.

In short, I can understand why my posts make no sense to him.

In my years of experience with you, (and yes I'm well versed with the Embedded Age nonsense) you are absolutely a YEC.

Hans Blaster · May 9, 2025

Tinker Grey said:
Part of the problem with 1 Kings 7:23 (KJV) is that it says a line of 30 cubits "did compass it about". It did not. It could not. If it just said it was 30 around without the line bit, the single digit thing would apply.

Hence my suggested wording above.

The fundamental point is that the text is not perfect communication.

It's still fuzzy and low precision. If it said 30 cubits and not one more, then we could assign a second digit, but it doesn't. The OT is full of bad math and numerical exaggeration.

AV1611VET · May 9, 2025

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
If you say God created the world 6,000 years ago, no amount of embedded age hides the fact that it makes you a Young Earth Creationist. And you do say that God created the world 6,000 years ago.

dlamberth said:
In my years of experience with you, (and yes I'm well versed with the Embedded Age nonsense) you are absolutely a YEC.

Can God create a dress tomorrow so old it falls apart with age?

dlamberth · May 9, 2025

AV1611VET said:
Can God create a dress tomorrow so old it falls apart with age?

Nope!

Warden_of_the_Storm · May 9, 2025

AV1611VET said:
Can God create a dress tomorrow so old it falls apart with age?

He can, obviously.

And you're still a YEC.

AV1611VET · May 9, 2025

Hans Blaster said:
It's still fuzzy and low precision.

What's fuzzy about it?

Hans Blaster said:
If it said 30 cubits and not one more, then we could assign a second digit, but it doesn't.

This sentence doesn't even make sense.

If it said "30 cubits and not one more," why would you assign a second digit?

Hans Blaster said:
The OT is full of bad math and numerical exaggeration.

Or not.

AV1611VET · May 9, 2025

dlamberth said:
Nope!

If He could, would it help you understand the difference between Embedded Age and YEC?

AV1611VET · May 9, 2025

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
He can, obviously.

And you're still a YEC.

Warden_of_the_Storm · May 9, 2025

AV1611VET said:

Do you, or do you not, believe and say that the Earth was created 6000 years ago?

Ophiolite · May 9, 2025

dlamberth said:
In my years of experience with you, (and yes I'm well versed with the Embedded Age nonsense) you are absolutely a YEC.

Actually, he is getting on a bit now; an Old YEC.

AV1611VET · May 9, 2025

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
Do you, or do you not, believe and say that the Earth was created 6000 years ago?

I do.

AV1611VET · May 9, 2025

Ophiolite said:
Actually, he is getting on a bit now; an Old YEC.

How about "Embedded Age"?

Warden_of_the_Storm · May 9, 2025

AV1611VET said:
I do.

You're a Young Earth Creationist.

AV1611VET · May 9, 2025

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
You're a Young Earth Creationist.

You've never seen me debate one, have you?

Warden_of_the_Storm · May 9, 2025

AV1611VET said:
You've never seen me debate one, have you?

Doesn't matter. You're still a Young Earth Creationist. You believe and claim the Earth was created 6000 years ago. That makes you a YEC.

AV1611VET · May 9, 2025

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
Doesn't matter. You're still a Young Earth Creationist. You believe and claim the Earth was created 6000 years ago. That makes you a YEC.

You'll really love this post:

YECs Respond Please

Made in a thread where I challenge YECs to convince me to be one.

And in the aforementioned link, I say:

So "good bye" to Embedded Age --- "hello" to YEC.

dlamberth · May 9, 2025

AV1611VET said:
If He could, would it help you understand the difference between Embedded Age and YEC?

The bottom line is that your a true believer that Creation was created 6000 years ago. In every sense of the word that makes you a YEC. Bringing God in to the picture as a deceiver with the Embedded Age nonsense does not erase your basic bottom line belief of a 6000 year old Creation. All of your arguments are based on that 6000 year time frame. Your YEC thru and thru.

I will scientifically prove the existence of God to you

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