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Is this a trick question?

Don't you need to uphold the Constitution of the United States as President?

  • Yes

    Votes: 10 90.9%
  • No

    Votes: 1 9.1%

  • Total voters
    11

rambot

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I think most citizens of the United States know the answer to this question. I'm pretty sure that kinda thing probably gets taught sometimes around gr4,5, 6 down there?
Yes? Any teachers here who could confirm that?

Anyways, how does a sitting president not answer that question, EVEN IF THEY ARE LYING, by saying "Yes"....at least for appearances?
 

BCP1928

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Strictly speaking he is sworn to "preserve, protect and defend" the Constitution. I suppose he could do that by putting an armed guard around it. I doubt if he could uphold it--that glass case it's in is pretty heavy. But how about "obey?" I don't see that in the oath anywhere.
 
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RileyG

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I think most citizens of the United States know the answer to this question. I'm pretty sure that kinda thing probably gets taught sometimes around gr4,5, 6 down there?
Yes? Any teachers here who could confirm that?

Anyways, how does a sitting president not answer that question, EVEN IF THEY ARE LYING, by saying "Yes"....at least for appearances?
It’s Trump.

Again, not defending his answer.

I am a moderate conservative.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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I answered yes, but I know what this is in reference to :)


It's about a recent Trump comment surrounding immigration, correct?


Statements like
“The executive branch has an enforcement discretion,”

and

“this ruling is a mockery of our democracy and a mockery of our law.”

and

"the President has the authority to ignore this ruling.”

and

Having a cabinet member saying “Everything is on the table. The president said that way back when the decision came out. Every option is on the table,”


...certainly isn't a flattering look for our democracy, correct? And any party that would get behind those sentiments certainly don't care about upholding our institutions.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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rambot

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Oh shucks, I had the wrong article pulled up for my last post...those quotes are actually from here
Nice try. M. Pretty sure this would be considered goading by forum rules...heads-up.


In the meantime your president answered the question exactly as he did.

That's embarrassing.
 
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Aryeh Jay

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In the meantime your president answered the question exactly as he did.

That's embarrassing.

To be fair, they were both raised in the same era, so many years ago, they may share some of the same values. Trump was a Democrat for decades before he took the easy way to get elected.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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Nice try. M. Pretty sure this would be considered goading by forum rules...heads-up.


In the meantime your president answered the question exactly as he did.

That's embarrassing.

It's a loaded question within context the "Meet the Press" reporter was asking it.


He followed up with: “I have brilliant lawyers that work for me, and they are going to obviously follow what the Supreme Court said,” he said, appearing to downplay the oath of office that includes a commitment to “preserve, protect and defend the Constitution.”


House reps and senators also take an oath... per the article I linked before AOC wasn't the only one suggesting that a court ruling could/should be ignored.

Sen. Ron Wyden of Oregon said Friday he believes the Biden administration and the Food and Drug Administration have "the authority to ignore this ruling.”

“The FDA, doctors, and pharmacies can and must go about their jobs like nothing has changed"

Health and Human Services Secretary Xavier Becerra did not dismiss the possibility of ignoring the court’s ruling... said “Everything is on the table. The president said that way back when the Dobbs decision came out. Every option is on the table,” Becerra said on CNN’s “State of the Union,”.


The sentiment by all of these folks (From Trump to AOC to Wyden to Becerra) was one that was questioning the concept of:
"Why should 1 solitary judge out of 900+ federal judges be able to put the brakes on an entire presidential agenda"

And it also raises the bigger question I've touched on before which is "forum shopping". There are lots of districts and judges. Finding a way to get ones case/objections in front of a "friendly judge" as a way of blocking the executive branch has been a sneaky trick that savvy lawyers and advocacy groups have been leveraging for quite some time.



As a little background on Forum Shopping:

What is Forum Shopping?​

It’s when litigants (like advocacy groups, state attorneys general, or legal advocacy orgs) strategically file lawsuits in courts or judicial districts where they believe the judges are more likely to be sympathetic to their legal arguments or policy goals.

For example:

  • If a conservative group wants to challenge a Biden administration environmental regulation, they might file in the Northern District of Texas, where several judges appointed by Republican presidents preside and have issued rulings favorable to conservative causes.
  • Likewise, a progressive advocacy organization challenging a Trump-era immigration order might have preferred the Northern District of California, where courts have previously blocked federal immigration actions.

Why Does It Matter?​

Because the federal judiciary is divided into 94 districts, each with its own set of judges, and early rulings — especially injunctions or temporary restraining orders (TROs) — can have national implications. If you win in a favorable court, you might get a nationwide injunction halting the presidential order while the case proceeds.

Recent notable examples:

  • Challenges to Trump’s travel bans in 2017 were filed in districts like Hawaii and Washington state.
  • Conservative groups challenging Biden’s student loan forgiveness filed in Texas and Missouri federal courts.
  • Cases involving abortion pill restrictions were steered toward districts in Texas known for appointing conservative judges.

Is It Controversial?​

Very. Critics argue it allows a single district judge to make decisions with nationwide effects, sometimes contrary to other courts. There’s been increasing debate — even among Supreme Court justices — about whether nationwide injunctions should be restricted





It should also be noted that several other developed nations have restrictions and structures in place to prevent that sneaky legal practice.

For example, Canada, France, Germany, UK, and Australia have court structures that make the practice of forum shopping (for federal matters) either impossible, or extremely rare.
 
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durangodawood

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It's a loaded question within context the "Meet the Press" reporter was asking it.
No it wasnt. It was just pulling back to a broad context, which anyone watching could follow. The right answer, which even barely educated people - let alone those whove taken the oath - know is that govt servants are bound by the constitution.

After that you can dial in to the minutia of the policy in question.

As for Trump, he knows perfectly well what hes supposed to say in theory. He just was too slow and dull to follow along and adapt to the change in focus in real time. Behind the scenes tho he seems to view the constitution as a problem to be circumvented.
 
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rambot

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It's a loaded question within context the "Meet the Press" reporter was asking it.


He followed up with: “I have brilliant lawyers that work for me, and they are going to obviously follow what the Supreme Court said,” he said, appearing to downplay the oath of office that includes a commitment to “preserve, protect and defend the Constitution.”


House reps and senators also take an oath... per the article I linked before AOC wasn't the only one suggesting that a court ruling could/should be ignored.

Sen. Ron Wyden of Oregon said Friday he believes the Biden administration and the Food and Drug Administration have "the authority to ignore this ruling.”

“The FDA, doctors, and pharmacies can and must go about their jobs like nothing has changed"

Health and Human Services Secretary Xavier Becerra did not dismiss the possibility of ignoring the court’s ruling... said “Everything is on the table. The president said that way back when the Dobbs decision came out. Every option is on the table,” Becerra said on CNN’s “State of the Union,”.


The sentiment by all of these folks (From Trump to AOC to Wyden to Becerra) was one that was questioning the concept of:
"Why should 1 solitary judge out of 900+ federal judges be able to put the brakes on an entire presidential agenda"

And it also raises the bigger question I've touched on before which is "forum shopping". There are lots of districts and judges. Finding a way to get ones case/objections in front of a "friendly judge" as a way of blocking the executive branch has been a sneaky trick that savvy lawyers and advocacy groups have been leveraging for quite some time.



As a little background on Forum Shopping:

What is Forum Shopping?​

It’s when litigants (like advocacy groups, state attorneys general, or legal advocacy orgs) strategically file lawsuits in courts or judicial districts where they believe the judges are more likely to be sympathetic to their legal arguments or policy goals.

For example:

  • If a conservative group wants to challenge a Biden administration environmental regulation, they might file in the Northern District of Texas, where several judges appointed by Republican presidents preside and have issued rulings favorable to conservative causes.
  • Likewise, a progressive advocacy organization challenging a Trump-era immigration order might have preferred the Northern District of California, where courts have previously blocked federal immigration actions.

Why Does It Matter?​

Because the federal judiciary is divided into 94 districts, each with its own set of judges, and early rulings — especially injunctions or temporary restraining orders (TROs) — can have national implications. If you win in a favorable court, you might get a nationwide injunction halting the presidential order while the case proceeds.

Recent notable examples:

  • Challenges to Trump’s travel bans in 2017 were filed in districts like Hawaii and Washington state.
  • Conservative groups challenging Biden’s student loan forgiveness filed in Texas and Missouri federal courts.
  • Cases involving abortion pill restrictions were steered toward districts in Texas known for appointing conservative judges.

Is It Controversial?​

Very. Critics argue it allows a single district judge to make decisions with nationwide effects, sometimes contrary to other courts. There’s been increasing debate — even among Supreme Court justices — about whether nationwide injunctions should be restricted





It should also be noted that several other developed nations have restrictions and structures in place to prevent that sneaky legal practice.

For example, Canada, France, Germany, UK, and Australia have court structures that make the practice of forum shopping (for federal matters) either impossible, or extremely rare.
I find it strange how you try to justify nonsense.

It's in the PRESIDENTIAL OATH. What kind of discussion needs to be had about this?

It's not up for debate. It's not up for exceptions or anything. The President is TASKED With doing that. And yes, other president may have contravened it as well. And I'm sure if the other partied cared for that contravention at the time, they would AND SHOULD have spoken up.


IT's the president's job to maintain the constitution and it seems weird you'd spend 300-400 words trying to justify Trump's answer instead of a simple "Probably not the best answer".
 
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ThatRobGuy

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No it wasnt. It was just pulling back to a broad context, which anyone watching could follow. The right answer, which even barely educated people - let alone those whove taken the oath - know is that govt servants are bound by the constitution.

After that you can dial in to the minutia of the policy in question.

As for Trump, he knows perfectly well what hes supposed to say in theory. He just was to slow and dull to follow along and adapt to the change in focus in real time. Behind the scenes tho he seems to view the constitution as a problem to be circumvented.


Per The Hill:

When Welker asked whether he must uphold the Constitution regarding deportations, the president replied, “I don’t know.”

“I have to respond by saying, again, I have brilliant lawyers that work for me, and they are going to obviously follow what the Supreme Court said,” Trump replied. “What you said is not what I heard the Supreme Court said. They have a different interpretation.”


Were, or were they not, making "go along with this single federal judge's ruling on deportations" synonymous with "uphold the constitution" with regards to the context of their inquiry?


If a conservative pundit stuck a democratic politician on the hot seat to grill them on their gun control proposals and said:
"The constitution specifically mentions that people have the right to bear arms... don't you have a duty to uphold the constitution?"

What would their response be to that? That'd be considered a loaded question in the context with which is was posed, would it not?
 
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ThatRobGuy

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I find it strange how you try to justify nonsense.

It's the the PRESIDENTIAL OATH.

It's not up for debate. It's not up for exceptions or anything. The President is TASKED With doing that. And yes, other president may have contravened it as well. And I'm sure if the other partied cared for that contravention at the time, they would AND SHOULD have spoken up.


IT's the president's job to maintain the constitution and it seems weird you'd spend 300-400 words trying to justify Trump's answer instead of a simple "He could know better".

Because it wasn't asked as a purely stand-alone question.

It was asked within the context of a broader conversation about judicial powers with regards to blocking a president's initiatives

It wasn't just a generic "Does the president have a duty to uphold the constitution?" question in passing.


It was more of a "Well, the constitution says that the president has to listen to the judicial branch, and it seems you don't want to do that, don't you have a duty to uphold the constitution???"


Hence, the examples I provided before... Members of the legislature also take an oath to uphold the constitution. Therefore saying "I think this solitary federal judge's ruling should be ignored, that single judge shouldn't be able to dictate something that has nationwide effects" would fly in the face of that if the standard is going to applied equally.

Otherwise, it's merely saying "It's okay to question the legitimacy of a court's check on the executive branch for matters of abortion pills, but not immigration"


When AOC was questioned about the constitutional implications of her comments, her response was that it was "an extreme abuse of power" and that the court "lacked legitimacy". Shouldn't she just have said "yeah, my bad, the executive branch just has to ride this thing out and go along with the court until the legal process plays out"?
 
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rambot

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Per The Hill:

When Welker asked whether he must uphold the Constitution regarding deportations, the president replied, “I don’t know.”

“I have to respond by saying, again, I have brilliant lawyers that work for me, and they are going to obviously follow what the Supreme Court said,” Trump replied. “What you said is not what I heard the Supreme Court said. They have a different interpretation.”


Were, or were they not, making "go along with this single federal judge's ruling on deportations" synonymous with "uphold the constitution" with regards to the context of their inquiry?


If a conservative pundit stuck a democratic politician on the hot seat to grill them on their gun control proposals and said:
"The constitution specifically mentions that people have the right to bear arms... don't you have a duty to uphold the constitution?"

What would their response be to that? That'd be considered a loaded question in the context with which is was posed, would it not?
An intelligent well spoken president who was sharp could have answered with a simple "yes, but..." structure of answer to that question.

I mean seriously, I have a VERY VERY hard time believing no democrat has EVER been asked a question like that before.
 
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durangodawood

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....If a conservative pundit stuck a democratic politician on the hot seat to grill them on their gun control proposals and said:
"The constitution specifically mentions that people have the right to bear arms... don't you have a duty to uphold the constitution?"

What would their response be to that? That'd be considered a loaded question in the context with which is was posed, would it not?
That question is loaded with nothing more than basic constitutional reality. If you cant handle it as a politician, youre in the wrong game.
 
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rambot

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That question is loaded with nothing more than basic constitutional reality. If you cant handle it as a politician, youre in the wrong game.
MAybe you haven't seen all of the things that Trump is good at!
Bimonthly reminder of why we should remember to trust Trump.


Also, since Trump is a successful businessman, certainly we remember that he can OBVIOUSLY be a politician and run the country.
 
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