What is the gift of Righteousness?

Clare73 · Sep 14, 2024

hislegacy said:
yes, as noted in the OP - I am directly quoting Romans 5.

what does the imputation of Christ's Righteousness mean to Clare73 personally?

It means that God does not hold me liable for my debt of sin because my debt has been paid by Jesus Christ.

hislegacy said:
How does it effect your life?

By the removal of my sin through the faith of the rebirth, I have the indwelling Holy Spirit with all his ministrations to me personally.

Offline4Better. · Sep 14, 2024

Clare73 said:
It means that God does not hold me liable for my debt of sin because my debt has been paid by Jesus Christ.

By the removal of my sin through the faith of the rebirth, I have the indwelling Holy Spirit with all his ministries to me personally.

Which sins were removed, if I may ask? You do not have to state, if you do not want to. For myself, the sin of lust has been on a slow decline over the past few months. The sin of judging others is still my biggest struggle, but that may slowly be on the decline as well.

Clare73 · Sep 14, 2024

hislegacy said:
Please note: Donald Trump has repeatedly disavowed himself and his campaign from Project 2025. The connection has been made a talking point and campaign slogan. Every time you read or hear someone connect Project 2025 with the Trump campaign, please note: This is factually incorrect - it is not based in reality, nor facts. Knowledge is power - be powerful.

So what is wrong with Project 2025?

Clare73 · Sep 14, 2024

AlexB23 said:
Which sins were removed, if I may ask? You do not have to state, if you do not want to. For myself, the sin of lust has been on a slow decline over the past few months. The sin of judging others is still my biggest struggle, but that may slowly be on the decline as well.

You are a delight. . .

Let's start with the sin guilt of Adam which was imputed to me (Ro 5:12-14) and condemned me (Ro 5:18).
Then the sin of lack of belief of the word of God written.
Then there was being my own governor of my life and destiny, it was all in my hands.
Everything else was window dressing. . .

Offline4Better. · Sep 14, 2024

Clare73 said:
You are a delight. . .

Let's start with the sin guilt of Adam which was imputed to me (Ro 5:12-14) and condemned me (Ro 5:18).
Then there was being my own governor of my life and destiny.
Everything else is window dressing. . .

Thank you. In the past, I used to not discuss my sins as much, cos I did not want people to know that I am broken. Hey, a lot of people struggle with your past sins as well, such as wanting to control our own lives and destinies. For instance, Paul (before he became Christian) wanted to follow his own worldly desires and destroy the church as stated in Galatians 1:13-14. Finally, a literal "come to Jesus" moment happened with Paul, where he gave his life to Jesus as stated in 1 Corinthians 15. Then, Paul began to follow Jesus, and he began spreading the church far and wide.

While we may all still struggle with sins, Jesus has taken the burdens of sin off of us, just as he did with you, Paul and anyone else who is Christian.

Mark Quayle · Sep 14, 2024

Clare73 said:
So what is wrong with Project 2025?

Probably nothing, except (I expect) that Trump does not want anyone to think that the Heritage Foundation writes his policy.

Offline4Better. · Sep 14, 2024

My brethren, @Mark Quayle and @Clare73, the quote about Project 2025 is actually part of @hislegacy 's signature, and is not part of his posts about righteousness. Whether one supports Project 2025 to the fullest, is against Project 2025, or supports parts, but not all, of Project 2025 does not matter (I'm a political centrist, not in support of either candidate, but see strengths and weaknesses in both). This thread is a theology discussion that has little to no connection to politics.

For instance, part of Mark Quayle's signature states: "I never met Calvin but the more I hear about him the better I like him. Specially when he draws such visceral condemnation from people bent on self-determination."

That does not mean that Mark is discussing about Calvinism, it only means that this quote is part of his signature. You can add a custom signature for your own profiles by clicking here: https://www.christianforums.com/account/signature

ViaCrucis · Sep 15, 2024

hislegacy said:
What is the gift of righteousness?

It's Jesus' righteousness. Jesus is righteous, we are not. His righteousness is imputed to us. "Abraham had faith, and it was imputed to him as righteousness"; through faith God imputes to us the righteousness of His Son. This is the righteousness of faith, the imputed righteousness of the Son of God.

-CryptoLutheran

Gregory Thompson · Sep 15, 2024

hislegacy said:
What is the gift of righteousness?

Thanks be to God for his indescribable gift! (2 Corinthians 9:15)

Offline4Better. · Sep 15, 2024

Gregory Thompson said:
Thanks be to God for his indescribable gift! (2 Corinthians 9:15)

Amen, brother.

Clare73 · Sep 15, 2024

ViaCrucis said:
It's Jesus' righteousness. Jesus is righteous, we are not. His righteousness is imputed to us. "Abraham had faith, and it was imputed to him as righteousness"; through faith God imputes to us the righteousness of His Son. This is the righteousness of faith, the imputed righteousness of the Son of God.

However, the righteousness imputed to us is not actual, it is not a matter of character,
it is forensic (dikaiosis--a declaration of "not guilty," a sentence of acquittal, a pronouncement of right standing with God; i.e. sin free); legal.

Actual righteousness (hagiamos--of character, holiness) is not imputed to us, but rather is something we grow in through obedience in the Holy Spirit.

Christ is our righteousness in that his atoning work removes our sin, making us sin free; i.e. forensically righteous.

ViaCrucis · Sep 15, 2024

Clare73 said:
However, the righteousness imputed to us is not actual, it is not a matter of character,
it is forensic (dikaiosis--a declaration of "not guilty," a sentence of acquittal, a pronouncement of right standing with God; i.e. sin free); legal.

Actual righteousness (hagiamos--of character, holiness) is not imputed to us, but rather is something we grow in through obedience in the Holy Spirit.

Christ is our righteousness in that his atoning work removes our sin, making us sin free; i.e. forensically righteous.

That's there in the language of imputation. Christ's righteousness is imputed, or accredited, to the one who has faith. The one who has faith has no righteousness in their own possession, Christ's righteousness is imputed. I am declared righteous, not because I am righteous, but because Christ is righteous and I am united to Christ, I am in Christ. Therefore God credits me, reckons me, as righteous because of Christ.

-CryptoLutheran

Clare73 · Sep 15, 2024

ViaCrucis said:
That's there in the language of imputation. Christ's righteousness is imputed, or accredited, to the one who has faith.

Actually, that is not the meaning of the righteousness of justification (dikaiosis).
The meaning of justification is righteousness (sinlessness) imputed to you because of faith in Christ's atonement for you, which remits your sin making you sinless.

ViaCrucis said:
The one who has faith has no righteousness in their own possession, Christ's righteousness is imputed to him.
Therefore God credits me, reckons me, as righteous because of Christ.

Yes, God declares you righteous, sinless (justification, dikaiosis) because of Christ's atoning work on the cross applied to you through faith, which remits your sin.
You are declared sinless by God (i.e., justified) through faith in Christ's atonement, but
you do not have Christ's righteousness reckoned to you,
rather you have Christ's atonement applied to you, making you sinless (forensically righteous, not actually righteous).

Actual righteousness of sanctification (holiness) is through obedience in the Holy Spirit (Ro 6:16,19).

Imputed righteousness of justification (sinlessness) is through faith (Ro 3:22, 28).

Sanctification = actual righteousness/holiness, acquired by you through obedience in the Holy Spirit.

Justification = forensic righteousness/sinlessness, reckoned/imputed to you through faith.

ViaCrucis · Sep 15, 2024

Clare73 said:
Actually, that is not the meaning of the righteousness of justification (dikaiosis).
The meaning of justification is righteousness (sinlessness) imputed to you because of faith in Christ's atonement for you, which remits your sin making you sinless.

Well. No. Justification does not make me sinless. My sins are forgiven, I am held as guiltless before God, but I'm still a sinner that sins--God be merciful to me.

"If we say we have no sin, then we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us." - 1 John 1:8

Clare73 said:
Yes, God reckons you righteous, sinless (justification, dikaiosis) because of Christ's atoning work on the cross applied to you through faith, which remits your sin.
You are declared sinless by God (i.e., justified) through faith in Christ's atonement, but
you do not have Christ's righteousness reckoned to you,
rather you have Christ's atonement applied to you, making you sinless (forensically righteous, not actually righteous).

Actual righteousness of sanctification (holiness) is through obedience in the Holy Spirit (Ro 6:16,19).

Imputed righteousness of justification (sinlessness) is through faith (Ro 3:22, 28).

Sanctification = actual righteousness/holiness, acquired by you through obedience in the Holy Spirit.

Justification = forensic righteousness/sinlessness, reckoned/imputed to you through faith.

Based on previous exchanges, I know that this is basically you wanting to argue for the sake of argument. So I'm going to end our interaction here.

-CryptoLutheran

Soyeong · Sep 17, 2024

hislegacy said:
Romans 5:17

For if by the one man’s offense death reigned through the one, much more those who receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.)

How are you personally reigning in life?

To have a character trait means to be a doer of that trait, such as for God to be righteous means that He is a doer of righteous works, so the gift of righteousness is the gift of becoming a doer of righteous works in obedience to God's law. Obedience to God's law has nothing to do with trying to earn our righteousness as the result, but rather the only way to become righteous is through faith and what we are becoming when we become righteous is a doer of righteous works.

Always in His Presence · Sep 26, 2024

If it is truly a gift -

Rom 5:17 For if by the one man’s offense death reigned through the one, much more those who receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.)

Then in reality - there is nothing we can do to earn it.

Clare73 · Sep 26, 2024

hislegacy said:
If it is truly a gift -

Rom 5:17 For if by the one man’s offense death reigned through the one, much more those who receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.)

Then in reality - there is nothing we can do to earn it.

That refers to justification, a legal (forensic) righteousness of standing (sinless) with God.
That does not refer to holiness.

What is the gift of Righteousness?

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