What if I just don’t buy it?

Christians do not believe in Christ because they read the Bible. Christians read the Bible because they believe in Christ.

Christians existed decades before the New Testament. Most of Christians did not own any Old Testament Scriptures either, and those who did, had various versions, various "canons" etc. Until the invention of the printing press, any personal ownership/reading of the Bible was rare.

Therefore, its not a big deal, actually. Bible was used "only" to support already existing Christianity. If it does not speak to you at the moment, save it for later and use what speaks to you now.

chrisRDBA said:

Greetings. I’ve been struggling w the whole Christ/ church/ Bible thing for over a decade.
I wish I could believe whatever I read in the Bible, or at least most of it, but I just can’t.…. But here’s the catch — I believe in Christ and the resurrection. Resurrection itself would be supernatural, so I have no problem believing Jesus is the son of God. I believe God created the universe and everything in it. I’ve also seen things happen with no earthly explanation available, and have no problem calling it a miracle.
However, I dont believe in any of these things because the Bible says so. I believe in all of them because there’s enough scientific and/ or historical evidence to prove them. I’ve read a lot of articles and watched countless YouTube videos of really smart guys on these topics that have convinced me.
Unfortunately, there’s no such evidence to prove a guy was in a fishes belly for 3 days then barfed out and survived. Nothing to prove staffs turned into snakes then back to staffs gain. Definitely nothing to prove the contents of Revelations is more of a real prophecy than what Joseph Smith saw in a corn field. Note these are examples off the top of my head, I could probably have dozens more if I wanted to type it all out. I simply don’t believe everything in the Bible just because the Bible says so.
I want to believe all of it. I’ve prayed about this stuff countless times. I’ve dove more into the Bible, talked to pastors, had people pray for me, etc. but nothing seems to convince me. My wife is tired of my up and down nature on this stuff. So am I quite frankly, it’s exhausting.

Where I’m at currently with all of this is I’m going to pretend I’m a real Christian for 90 days and see what happens. I’ll be in church, read the Bible, pray earnestly, worship throughout the day, maybe even hang w some Christians. At the end of that time Ill either be in or out, but I cannot keep beating my head on this wall any longer.

Any other advice on what I can do in that time? Again, I really want to be convinced of it all. Before anyone says “you believe in the important stuff, don’t worry about the rest”— I assure you I’ve been told that at least a dozen times. If I could I would.

Note that I’m no highly educated/ scholarly/ scientific kind of guy. Just a regular guy that cannot believe in a book because the book says I should.

Thanks!

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There is no belief of the Bible which is not given by the Holy Spirit.

I likewise wanted to believe it, but could not. I couldn't make myself believe what I did not believe.
The way in for me was a sincere commitment, "I'll believe it until I can't." And then, not knowing what else to do, I started at Ge 1:1.
And wonder of wonders, I never reached the point where I couldn't believe it and had to stop.
Rather, with each chapter it grew more and more in power and glory, until the deal was closed in the book of Leviticus, which has remained my favorite book, it being the foretelling of Christ.
I have been a student of Scripture for decades ever since.

I read the Bible in a basic sense and apply things that seem confusing in a spiritual sense. Especially in light of the Lord’s commandments ( Matthew 22:36-40), I will read say Joshua 6:1-27 ( destruction of Jericho) & remember what St. Paul tells us in Ephesians 6:12-18 to be strengthened to live by faith.

Relax, you don't need to take all of the Bible literally to be a Christian, in fact most don't. It's perfectly O.K. not to think a whale actually "barfed up a guy" and still be a follower of Christ. Don't force yourself. As other pointed out as you grow in Christ you might find your beliefs about certain passages changing, but you may never think all of the Bible is literal. BTW HERE is an article that points out how really no one does.

chrisRDBA said:

Unfortunately, there’s no such evidence to prove a guy was in a fishes belly for 3 days then barfed out and survived.

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There is some fine print that often gets overlooked...

Jonah 1:17
"Now the LORD had prepared a great fish to swallow up Jonah. And Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights."

The 'fish' was not ordinary. It was something that God created just for the purpose of teaching a lesson. To compare the fish with any species that currently exist, or existed in the past, is not being true to the text.

chrisRDBA said:

Nothing to prove staffs turned into snakes then back to staffs gain.

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Just an FYI...

The symbolic language is teaching that the Serpent, as well as the Rod, are synonymous with what we now call RNA. The symbols are even used in the medical industry today as the Rod of Asclepius (Serpent on a Pole).

Whether you wish to believe it was literal or not is your choice. I would suggest that you at least try and understand the deeper meanings.

chrisRDBA said:

I simply don’t believe everything in the Bible just because the Bible says so.

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Are you saying that you have no faith?

trophy33 said:

Christians do not believe in Christ because they read the Bible. Christians read the Bible because they believe in Christ.

Christians existed decades before the New Testament. Most of Christians did not own any Old Testament Scriptures either, and those who did, had various versions, various "canons" etc. Until the invention of the printing press, any personal ownership/reading of the Bible was rare.

Therefore, its not a big deal, actually. Bible was used "only" to support already existing Christianity. If it does not speak to you at the moment, save it for later and use what speaks to you now.

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What a absolutely wrong statement. Not a single person alive today would know anything about Jesus with out The Bible.

The Gospel of John states the book was written for the very purpose and list signs showing Jesus is The Christ, The Son of God so that people may believe in Jesus (believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God,) for life (Eternal Life).

Really like The Bible needs scientific approval, if that is the case maybe a science book would be more helpful.

d taylor said:

What a absolutely wrong statement. Not a single person alive today would know anything about Jesus with out The Bible.

The Gospel of John states the book was written for the very purpose and list signs showing Jesus is The Christ, The Son of God so that people may believe in Jesus (believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God,) for life (Eternal Life).

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This is not a debate section.

chrisRDBA said:

Greetings. I’ve been struggling w the whole Christ/ church/ Bible thing for over a decade.

I wish I could believe whatever I read in the Bible, or at least most of it, but I just can’t.…. But here’s the catch — I believe in Christ and the resurrection. Resurrection itself would be supernatural, so I have no problem believing Jesus is the son of God. I believe God created the universe and everything in it. I’ve also seen things happen with no earthly explanation available, and have no problem calling it a miracle.

However, I dont believe in any of these things because the Bible says so. I believe in all of them because there’s enough scientific and/ or historical evidence to prove them. I’ve read a lot of articles and watched countless YouTube videos of really smart guys on these topics that have convinced me.
Unfortunately, there’s no such evidence to prove a guy was in a fishes belly for 3 days then barfed out and survived. Nothing to prove staffs turned into snakes then back to staffs gain. Definitely nothing to prove the contents of Revelations is more of a real prophecy than what Joseph Smith saw in a corn field. Note these are examples off the top of my head, I could probably have dozens more if I wanted to type it all out. I simply don’t believe everything in the Bible just because the Bible says so.

I want to believe all of it. I’ve prayed about this stuff countless times. I’ve dove more into the Bible, talked to pastors, had people pray for me, etc. but nothing seems to convince me. My wife is tired of my up and down nature on this stuff. So am I quite frankly, it’s exhausting.

Where I’m at currently with all of this is I’m going to pretend I’m a real Christian for 90 days and see what happens. I’ll be in church, read the Bible, pray earnestly, worship throughout the day, maybe even hang w some Christians. At the end of that time Ill either be in or out, but I cannot keep beating my head on this wall any longer.

Any other advice on what I can do in that time? Again, I really want to be convinced of it all. Before anyone says “you believe in the important stuff, don’t worry about the rest”— I assure you I’ve been told that at least a dozen times. If I could I would.

Note that I’m no highly educated/ scholarly/ scientific kind of guy. Just a regular guy that cannot believe in a book because the book says I should.

Thanks!

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You're not the first to think thusly, and you certainly won't be the last.
God never asks you to suspend questions or critical thinking: it is the people that feel threatened by questions that resort to the 'just believe it!' approach.

The Bible is a collection compiled over many Centuries and it has been edited and revised many times before reaching your eyes. It's true in the sense that God has a specific and definitive teaching/message that He wants to convey to humanity. The authors may use all the literary tools available to them but the essence of God's message is the important aspect.
The Bible is not an historical account but a 'story' of God choosing His people and Him being faithful to them.

Hope I didn't ramble too much.

chrisRDBA said:

Greetings. I’ve been struggling w the whole Christ/ church/ Bible thing for over a decade.

I wish I could believe whatever I read in the Bible, or at least most of it, but I just can’t.…. But here’s the catch — I believe in Christ and the resurrection. Resurrection itself would be supernatural, so I have no problem believing Jesus is the son of God.

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You realize of course that you only have the Bible for that sort of belief. It is not "scientific" to argue that God the Son was incarnate in human flesh, died for the sins of mankind, resurrected Himself on the 3rd day and then ascended bodily into heaven.

All of that is purely - "because the Bible says so".

I am fine with that - but your position is somewhat self-conflicted if you are going to claim that "because the Bible says so" is insufficient reason.

chrisRDBA said:

I believe God created the universe and everything in it. I’ve also seen things happen with no earthly explanation available, and have no problem calling it a miracle.

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First two pages of the Bible says God created everything. So also does John 1.

chrisRDBA said:

However, I dont believe in any of these things because the Bible says so.

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As I said - that is a bit of a self-conflicted position just then.

chrisRDBA said:

I believe in all of them because there’s enough scientific and/ or historical evidence to prove them

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The Bible states facts about historic events that you can find some historic evidence 'that people believed it" going back a certain distance in time.

What you don't find is historic evidence that the first century Christians did not think the Bible was true or to be trusted. And you can find a lot of evidence that they were willing to die for their decision to believe and follow the Bible "no matter what" even at the cost of their lives.

You are trying to divorce the historic evidence of the early first century church - that claimed to see miracles , be convinced that Jesus was God the Son in human flesh -- from the fact that such a "bet my life on it" position that they took - -- meant that they did not take the "Bible not convincing" position you are taking.

chrisRDBA said:

I’ve read a lot of articles and watched countless YouTube videos of really smart guys on these topics that have convinced me.
Unfortunately, there’s no such evidence to prove a guy was in a fishes belly for 3 days

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So the Bible says Jesus resurrected Himself after three days. That same Jesus affirms the Bible statements about Jonah - in the Gospels. But you find it much harder to believe someone could with God's help survive in the belly of a whale over 3 days.



James Bartley
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

James Bartley (1870–1909) is the central figure in a late nineteenth-century story according to which he was swallowed whole by a sperm whale. He was found still living days later in the stomach of the whale, which was dead from harpooning.
The story originated of an anonymous form, began to appear in American newspapers. The anonymous article appeared in the St. Louis Globe Democrat of Saint Louis, Missouri, then the note appeared in other newspapers with the title "A Modern Jonah" or something similar in multiple newspapers.[1]
The news spread beyond the ocean in articles as "Man in a Whale's Stomach. "Rescue of a Modern Jonah" in page 8 of the August 22, 1891, issue of the Yarmouth Mercury newspaper of Great Yarmouth in England.[2][3]

==============================

The idea that a man could be, flogged almost to death - then crucified - then speared in the side, buried and then raise Himself from the dead - chase off a number of armed Roman soldiers and then ascend up into heaven in front of 500 witnesses - seems to you to be less unusual - than someone getting swallowed then surviving with the help of God.

Interesting proposal on your part - just then.

===============================================

I have a suggestion - try it the other way around.

Start with accepting the idea that the Word of God is completely true and the guesswork of sinful man is at times "suspect". Fully pursue the eternal life possibility of the One whom you say you believe to be the Son of God -- as the start point. Really dig through exploring that full experience.

That's "the Jesus" that says the Bible is the Word of God in Mark 7:7-13 going all the way back to Moses..

Then later -- pick up the other idea which is "at the end all you get is a hole-in-ground grave".

BTW, a guy was swallowed by a whale- this time the large fish was identified. Reported in Cape Cod Times

One of the most enjoyable Biblical studies I've done was researched some of God's names, titles, and attributions. Only used the online lists that included Scripture so they could be checked out.

chrisRDBA said:

Greetings. I’ve been struggling w the whole Christ/ church/ Bible thing for over a decade.

I wish I could believe whatever I read in the Bible, or at least most of it, but I just can’t.…. But here’s the catch — I believe in Christ and the resurrection. Resurrection itself would be supernatural, so I have no problem believing Jesus is the son of God. I believe God created the universe and everything in it. I’ve also seen things happen with no earthly explanation available, and have no problem calling it a miracle.

However, I dont believe in any of these things because the Bible says so. I believe in all of them because there’s enough scientific and/ or historical evidence to prove them. I’ve read a lot of articles and watched countless YouTube videos of really smart guys on these topics that have convinced me.
Unfortunately, there’s no such evidence to prove a guy was in a fishes belly for 3 days then barfed out and survived. Nothing to prove staffs turned into snakes then back to staffs gain. Definitely nothing to prove the contents of Revelations is more of a real prophecy than what Joseph Smith saw in a corn field. Note these are examples off the top of my head, I could probably have dozens more if I wanted to type it all out. I simply don’t believe everything in the Bible just because the Bible says so.

I want to believe all of it. I’ve prayed about this stuff countless times. I’ve dove more into the Bible, talked to pastors, had people pray for me, etc. but nothing seems to convince me. My wife is tired of my up and down nature on this stuff. So am I quite frankly, it’s exhausting.

Where I’m at currently with all of this is I’m going to pretend I’m a real Christian for 90 days and see what happens. I’ll be in church, read the Bible, pray earnestly, worship throughout the day, maybe even hang w some Christians. At the end of that time Ill either be in or out, but I cannot keep beating my head on this wall any longer.

Any other advice on what I can do in that time? Again, I really want to be convinced of it all. Before anyone says “you believe in the important stuff, don’t worry about the rest”— I assure you I’ve been told that at least a dozen times. If I could I would.

Note that I’m no highly educated/ scholarly/ scientific kind of guy. Just a regular guy that cannot believe in a book because the book says I should.

Thanks!

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Ask Him to fill you with His Holy Spirit. But there is a catch...one must have unwavering faith and Love for Him. Be blessed.

chrisRDBA said:

I appreciate everyones input. I also have no desire to debate anyone here. For those that suggest I just think differently (paraphrasing), know that if I could I would have long ago.

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Hi . . . yes, this is our advice section. One thing I think of is enjoy your wife and share with her and be there for her.

And just listen. But also offer what can help and encourage her. But this is your marriage, not for me to tell you two how to relate and share. Enjoy and appreciate all that you do have.

And with God "be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath" > in James 1:19-20.

God knows what is true, and this with His perspective. I would say first is His love meaning, and His love purpose; God is not only or mainly about being powerful and controlling; but yes there is about what He is able to do.

If He could change Jesus Christ's body into an immortal and incorruptible and glorious state, then easily He can do all that the Bible says is miraculous . . . easier than it is for us to think and argue about it.

But most of all is the love meaning which I now understand we can get with any scripture.

And so, then, we can consider why people's attention could be sidetracked to struggling with if God had the power and control to do things and arrange things that the Bible says He did. Our worldly focus can be mainly with having power and control; and so we can in different ways struggle with issues of power and control. But we need to feed on how love is and has us relating with God and one another while caring about ones who do not know how to love.

"God is love" (in 1 John 4:8&16), and as love God is almighty and all-loving and generously forgiving . . . so great and not at all conceited but the definition of what He means by humble, how to be humble. So, we should expect to live in love which makes us so humble like Jesus so loving and kind and generously forgiving but also so powerful and in control and creative for how to love and speak to and do good to love any person, at all.

So, do you see the possible trick to get our attention away to worrying about if certain things really happened or not?

Trust God to personally share with you, and see what becomes of you. God bless you however He pleases.

His word is meant for how He uses it in His hands with you >

"'So shall My word be that goes forth from My mouth;
It shall not return to Me void,
But it shall accomplish what I please,
And it shall prosper in the thing for which I sent it.'"
(Isaiah 55:11)

chrisRDBA said:

That first link is really eye opening, thanks!

Edit — for a long time I’ve felt like a total oddball that doesn’t believe everything in the Bible but does try to follow Christ. It’s like a weight off my shoulders

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Hey Chris! Don't get too disheartened over all of this. There are some here, like myself, who feel similarly to you about how it is we can believe and have faith. You're not an oddball.

chrisRDBA said:

For anyone else struggling w this stuff, I just found this article really helpful. I’m sure some will disagree w it, and that’s OK.

Taking the Bible “Literally” | Bible.org

This article takes a close and careful examination of what it means to take the Bible literally.

bible.org

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Yes, Greg Koukl is right in saying that the study of Biblical Exegesis (and Hermeneutics) is very important in how we attempt to assess the meaning(S) of the Bible. That's always a good thing to consider, for sure!

We can find people to agree with us, but this is not evidence that we are right.

God knows what is true, in comparison with reality as He knows it. And plenty of things in His word are about what is better than humans can know and have experienced; so we need to trust Him, then, to share His meaning with us.