Hamas Makes War on Israelis and Palestinians

Hank77 · Oct 10, 2023

Hamas Makes War on Israelis and Palestinians

Hamas Makes War on Israelis and Palestinians

The 10/7 war shatters our clichés.

plus.thebulwark.com

This article is written by Mona Charen who is Jewish, pro-Isreal, and conservative, old GOP. I think her view this one that should be considered by everyone who cares.

FireDragon76 · Oct 10, 2023

I don't think the importance of those divisions should be minimized. Israel is even more divided internally than the United States. Internal divisions in Israeli society might also account for the intelligence failures. While Hamas might not recognize Israel's right to exist, Likud more or less reciprocates the sentiments on Palestinians, and it also has certain intellectual strains that reject democratic norms of its own.

Vambram · Oct 10, 2023

https://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/white-house-repugnant-lawmakers/2023/10/10/id/1137789/

Vambram · Oct 10, 2023

Vambram said:
https://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/white-house-repugnant-lawmakers/2023/10/10/id/1137789/

I apologize if this is the wrong thread for this article from Newsmax about the White House response concerning Israeli "apartheid"

Hank77 · Oct 10, 2023

Vambram said:
I apologize if this is the wrong thread for this article from Newsmax about the White House response concerning Israeli "apartheid"

your link isn't working

wing2000 · Oct 10, 2023

Hank77 said:
Hamas Makes War on Israelis and Palestinians

Hamas Makes War on Israelis and Palestinians

The 10/7 war shatters our clichés.

plus.thebulwark.com

This article is written by Mona Charen who is Jewish, pro-Isreal, and conservative, old GOP. I think her view this one that should be considered by everyone who cares.

She captures the depravity of Hamas....they know Israel will react forcefully, creating images of human suffering for their political purposes. I really have no words to describe such "people"...

FireDragon76 · Oct 12, 2023

wing2000 said:
She captures the depravity of Hamas....they know Israel will react forcefully, creating images of human suffering for their political purposes. I really have no words to describe such "people"...

Hamas rose to power because the Israeli military-intelligence complex determined that the secular PLO was a greater long-term threat and supporting a fanatical religious group would lead to infighting among Palestinians (something that proved to be true). Even in recent times, they've chosen to focus on oppressing Palestinians in the West Bank, where the Fatah, the military wing of the Palestinian Authority, not Hamas, is the dominant military group, and leave Gaza to be periodically "mowed down" with air strikes.

What is being overlooked in American media is the severe power imbalance that exists between Israel and the Palestinians. Slave revolts in the American south and in Haiti often resulted in extreme bloodshed and slaughter of whole families of whites by slaves. But I don't think anybody would use that logic to rally around a slaveholder social order today. Palestinians in Gaza are a nearly conquered and vanquished people essentially living in an open-air prison, where the average yearly income is over 50 times less than the average Israeli's, and 80 percent of the population is unemployed.

DaisyDay · Oct 12, 2023

Vambram said:
https://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/white-house-repugnant-lawmakers/2023/10/10/id/1137789/

Should be: https://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/white-house-repugnant-lawmakers/2023/10/10/id/1137789/

Israel is an apartheid state. The population of the Gaza Strip is more than half children. They will suffer greatly for the sins of Hamas.

DaisyDay · Oct 12, 2023

FireDragon76 said:
Hamas rose to power because the Israeli military-intelligence complex determined that the secular PLO was a greater long-term threat and supporting a fanatical religious group would lead to infighting among Palestinians (something that proved to be true). Even in recent times, they've chosen to focus on oppressing Palestinians in the West Bank, where the Fatah, the military wing of the Palestinian Authority, not Hamas, is the dominant military group, and leave Gaza to be periodically "mowed down" with air strikes.

What is being overlooked in American media is the severe power imbalance that exists between Israel and the Palestinians. Slave revolts in the American south and in Haiti often resulted in extreme bloodshed and slaughter of whole families of whites by slaves. But I don't think anybody would use that logic to rally around a slaveholder social order today. Palestinians in Gaza are a nearly conquered and vanquished people essentially living in an open-air prison, where the average yearly income is over 50 times less than the average Israeli's, and 80 percent of the population is unemployed.

Israel - The World Factbook

www.cia.gov

versus

Gaza Strip - The World Factbook

www.cia.gov

jacks · Oct 12, 2023

HERE is a nice, easy to understand summary of the Palestine/Israeli history.
In my mind none of it justifies the recent attacks by Hamas.

ChurchBuilder · Oct 15, 2023

jacks said:
HERE is a nice, easy to understand summary of the Palestine/Israeli history.
In my mind none of it justifies the recent attacks by Hamas.

I think one has to objectively analyze a situation and look at the causal factors of a situation. Do you think Hamas would even exist if Zionists had not forced them out of their homes?

mark46 · Oct 15, 2023

ChurchBuilder said:
I think one has to objectively analyze a situation and look at the causal factors of a situation. Do you think Hamas would even exist if Zionists had not forced them out of their homes?

In 1987?

As part of the infadah in 1987, Hamas was formed by the terrorist Shia branch of the Muslim Brotherhood. This was in opposition to the others who led the uprising.

I'm fine with folks being anti-Israel or Pro-Palestinian, but we should be clear about the nature of Hamas and their beliefs. They want to kill all Jews, and all Muslims who disagree with thier extremists views.

If one wants to be anti-Israel and pro-Palestinian, then perhaps one might support those who have sought political freedom through the years. And that is NOT Hamas.

BTW, I restrict my comments to Gaza and the West Bank. I would note that Palestinians have come to other countries and have been rendered powerless in response to their almost constant moves toward civil wars.
=========
LET'S BE CLEAR
We have a solution. Turn the West Bank over to Jordan and Gaza to Egypt. Let them deal with the Palestinian and their various factions. We forget that Israel gains nothing from occupying Gaza or from controlling the West Bank. They would be more than happy to give up these responsibilities.
Of course, the Arab Sunni allies would need to guarantors of security.

mark46 · Oct 16, 2023

Egypt has decided to provide humanitarian aid to Southern Gaza. This is a major step forward.

Fantine · Oct 17, 2023

President Biden is traveling to Israel tomorrow and said they were working on a joint plan to get humanitarian aid to Gaza.

Twice as many Palestinians as Israelis have been killed--as of yesterday.

If compassion doesn't motivate Netanyahu perhaps the knowledge that his hawkish brutality is creating the terrorists of the future will.

nightmares · Oct 17, 2023

Yes and the ancient Israelites should have had compassion for the Amalekites instead of putting up a fight

nightmares · Oct 17, 2023

Really? Someone uses the tired old lie about Israel being an apartheid state?

"Why yes, we will respond to you killing us by inviting you to live among us and why do you have a knife at my throat?"

FireDragon76 · Oct 17, 2023

nightmares said:
Yes and the ancient Israelites should have had compassion for the Amalekites instead of putting up a fight

Because legendary nationalist histories are so much better moral guides, than Jesus' own ethics, which said "Blessed are the peacemakers"...

Vambram · Oct 17, 2023

Why aren't there Arab nations willing to receive Palestinian refugee?
Why does Hamas fire and/or store thier rockets within and from civilian buildings?

Vambram · Oct 17, 2023

FireDragon76 said:
Because legendary nationalist histories are so much better moral guides, than Jesus' own ethics, which said "Blessed are the peacemakers"...

Legendary nationalist histories?
Is that what we're calling the historical books of the Old Testament now?

nightmares · Oct 17, 2023

FireDragon76 said:
Because legendary nationalist histories are so much better moral guides, than Jesus' own ethics, which said "Blessed are the peacemakers"...

"We want to wipe out the Jews" - various groups throughout history including Hamas

Why won't you Jews give peace a chance - those who fail to learn from history

Hamas Makes War on Israelis and Palestinians

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