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John Kelly goes on the record to confirm several disturbing stories about Trump

FreeinChrist

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“What can I add that has not already been said?” Kelly said, when asked if he wanted to weigh in on his former boss in light of recent comments made by other former Trump officials. “A person that thinks those who defend their country in uniform, or are shot down or seriously wounded in combat, or spend years being tortured as POWs are all ‘suckers’ because ‘there is nothing in it for them.’ A person that did not want to be seen in the presence of military amputees because ‘it doesn’t look good for me.’ A person who demonstrated open contempt for a Gold Star family – for all Gold Star families – on TV during the 2016 campaign, and rants that our most precious heroes who gave their lives in America’s defense are ‘losers’ and wouldn’t visit their graves in France.​
“A person who is not truthful regarding his position on the protection of unborn life, on women, on minorities, on evangelical Christians, on Jews, on working men and women,” Kelly continued. “A person that has no idea what America stands for and has no idea what America is all about. A person who cavalierly suggests that a selfless warrior who has served his country for 40 years in peacetime and war should lose his life for treason – in expectation that someone will take action. A person who admires autocrats and murderous dictators. A person that has nothing but contempt for our democratic institutions, our Constitution, and the rule of law.​
“There is nothing more that can be said,” Kelly concluded. “God help us.”​
Wow. Wish he spoke up sooner.
 

Ana the Ist

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“What can I add that has not already been said?” Kelly said, when asked if he wanted to weigh in on his former boss in light of recent comments made by other former Trump officials. “A person that thinks those who defend their country in uniform, or are shot down or seriously wounded in combat, or spend years being tortured as POWs are all ‘suckers’ because ‘there is nothing in it for them.’ A person that did not want to be seen in the presence of military amputees because ‘it doesn’t look good for me.’ A person who demonstrated open contempt for a Gold Star family – for all Gold Star families – on TV during the 2016 campaign, and rants that our most precious heroes who gave their lives in America’s defense are ‘losers’ and wouldn’t visit their graves in France.​
“A person who is not truthful regarding his position on the protection of unborn life, on women, on minorities, on evangelical Christians, on Jews, on working men and women,” Kelly continued. “A person that has no idea what America stands for and has no idea what America is all about. A person who cavalierly suggests that a selfless warrior who has served his country for 40 years in peacetime and war should lose his life for treason – in expectation that someone will take action. A person who admires autocrats and murderous dictators. A person that has nothing but contempt for our democratic institutions, our Constitution, and the rule of law.​
“There is nothing more that can be said,” Kelly concluded. “God help us.”​
Wow. Wish he spoke up sooner.

Why? Was it important in some way to hear your opinions regurgitated back at you?
 
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Bradskii

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As it came from Trump's longest serving White House Chief of Staff, his words carry some weight.
Unfortunately they only carry that weight if they are read. There's a significant amount of people who would rather not read it.
 
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FireDragon76

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What I find really disturbing isn't that the vast majority of Evangelical Christians supported Trump and voted for him twice, but that over half of white Mainline Protestants also supported him as well.
 
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stevil

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“There is nothing more that can be said,” Kelly concluded. “God help us.”​
Wow. Wish he spoke up sooner.
It seems that what was reported on the various non right wing media shows (MSM) were true. Go figure.
 
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USincognito

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No. He gives opinions.
Literally nothing he said could be considered an "opinion". Stop trying to gaslight.

The options are basically:
The things he's asserting happened as he said.
The things he's asserting didn't happen at all.
The things he's asserting happened differently than he remembers.
 
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RestoreTheJoy

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Literally nothing he said could be considered an "opinion". Stop trying to gaslight.

The options are basically:
The things he's asserting happened as he said.
The things he's asserting didn't happen at all.
The things he's asserting happened differently than he remembers.
Literally nothing he said - to CNN, no doubt - is verified on the record. Everything CNN quotes him saying is opinion that Trump holds all these negative opinions of soldiers, gold star families, etc. The only assertion he makes is one statement, that apparently no one else heard. Maybe Trump said it. Maybe he meant it the way Kelly construes it. Maybe not. There is no corroboration so it is solely he said-he said.
It links to an article by Goldberg, who also makes no direct assertions but only "anonymous sources say" hearsay.

Critically read the article. This is not journalism. CNN is famous for hit pieces.
 
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Bradskii

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Literally nothing he said - to CNN, no doubt - is verified on the record. Everything CNN quotes him saying is opinion that Trump holds all these negative opinions of soldiers, gold star families, etc. The only assertion he makes is one statement, that apparently no one else heard. Maybe Trump said it. Maybe he meant it the way Kelly construes it. Maybe not. There is no corroboration so it is solely he said-he said.
It links to an article by Goldberg, who also makes no direct assertions but only "anonymous sources say" hearsay.

Critically read the article. This is not journalism. CNN is famous for hit pieces.
Let's have a look:

'Kelly set the record straight with on-the-record confirmation of a number of damning stories about statements Trump made behind closed doors attacking US service members and veterans, listing a number of objectionable comments Kelly witnessed Trump make firsthand.'

So note that bolded part. Kelly is on the record confirming things that Trump actually said. Things that he witnessed first hand. These are NOT opinions.

' “What can I add that has not already been said?” Kelly said, when asked if he wanted to weigh in on his former boss in light of recent comments made by other former Trump officials. “A person that thinks those who defend their country in uniform, or are shot down or seriously wounded in combat, or spend years being tortured as POWs are all ‘suckers’ because ‘there is nothing in it for them.’ A person that did not want to be seen in the presence of military amputees because ‘it doesn’t look good for me.’ A person who demonstrated open contempt for a Gold Star family – for all Gold Star families – on TV during the 2016 campaign, and rants that our most precious heroes who gave their lives in America’s defense are ‘losers’ and wouldn’t visit their graves in France.'

Note the quotes around the bolded parts. Kelly is quoting Trump directly. Not insinuating that he said something. Not suggesting he might have said something. Not offering an opinion on what someone else might have said. He is quoting Trump.

Your only option is to say that he is lying. Together with everyone else who has reported on this. Versus claiming that Trump never said these things. Despite our knowledge of his character. Despite what we have heard him say on record. Despite the despicable things he said about McCain.

That's your call.
 
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RestoreTheJoy

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Let's have a look:

'Kelly set the record straight with on-the-record confirmation of a number of damning stories about statements Trump made behind closed doors attacking US service members and veterans, listing a number of objectionable comments Kelly witnessed Trump make firsthand.'

So note that bolded part. Kelly is on the record confirming things that Trump actually said. Things that he witnessed first hand. These are NOT opinions.

' “What can I add that has not already been said?” Kelly said, when asked if he wanted to weigh in on his former boss in light of recent comments made by other former Trump officials. “A person that thinks those who defend their country in uniform, or are shot down or seriously wounded in combat, or spend years being tortured as POWs are all ‘suckers’ because ‘there is nothing in it for them.’ A person that did not want to be seen in the presence of military amputees because ‘it doesn’t look good for me.’ A person who demonstrated open contempt for a Gold Star family – for all Gold Star families – on TV during the 2016 campaign, and rants that our most precious heroes who gave their lives in America’s defense are ‘losers’ and wouldn’t visit their graves in France.'

Note the quotes around the bolded parts. Kelly is quoting Trump directly. Not insinuating that he said something. Not suggesting he might have said something. Not offering an opinion on what someone else might have said. He is quoting Trump.

Your only option is to say that he is lying. Together with everyone else who has reported on this. Versus claiming that Trump never said these things. Despite our knowledge of his character. Despite what we have heard him say on record. Despite the despicable things he said about McCain.

That's your call.
Again, CNN spin, based entirely on anonymous sources. Link to the article linked and read it, by Goldberg. Then each statement he makes is opinion, (that you cut/paste again here) precisely as I stated. No, these are NOT direct quotes, they are summarizations, and they are corroborated by no one at this point.
 
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RestoreTheJoy

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Staff Edit
I don't know what you are trying to say here, but you quoted a tiny snippet out of context here, so I'm reposting my entire comment, to which i MIRRORED the language of the person speaking to me, so that's your "goader" if one exists. YOU

USIncognito:
Literally nothing he said could be considered an "opinion". Stop trying to gaslight.
The options are basically:
The things he's asserting happened as he said.
The things he's asserting didn't happen at all.
The things he's asserting happened differently than he remembers.

Here is what I said in response to this response:
"Literally nothing he said (speaking of Kelly, by the way) - to CNN, no doubt - is verified on the record. Everything CNN quotes him saying is opinion that Trump holds all these negative opinions of soldiers, gold star families, etc. The only assertion he makes is one statement, that apparently no one else heard. Maybe Trump said it. Maybe he meant it the way Kelly construes it. Maybe not. There is no corroboration so it is solely he said-he said.
It links to an article by Goldberg, who also makes no direct assertions but only "anonymous sources say" hearsay.
Critically read the article. This is not journalism. CNN is famous for hit pieces."
 
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USincognito

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FreeinChrist

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In a statement to CNN, Mr. Kelly corroborated reporting from 2020 that he declined to confirm at the time despite pressure from friends and associates to do so.​
ohn F. Kelly, the onetime chief of staff to former President Donald J. Trump, confirmed on Monday some of Mr. Trump’s most startling comments about service members and veterans, reeling them off in a statement in which he said his onetime boss had “contempt for our democratic institutions, our Constitution and the rule of law.”​
“A person that thinks those who defend their country in uniform, or are shot down or seriously wounded in combat, or spend years being tortured as P.O.W.s are all ‘suckers’ because ‘there is nothing in it for them,’” he told CNN.​


John Kelly is a primary source, however there are plenty of sources including others who were simply watching TV. Trump said what he said in interviews.


AP FACT CHECK: Trump on McCain​

President Donald Trump said he never called John McCain a loser — he did — and denigrated the record of the late Republican senator on veterans affairs despite routinely appropriating one of McCain’s crowning achievements on that front as his own.​
Trump distorted events in Kenosha, Wisconsin, over the past week and his own hand in them before a furor over his reported comments on fallen soldiers diverted his rhetoric......​
TRUMP: “I was never a big fan of John McCain, disagreed with him on many things including ridiculous endless wars and the lack of success he had in dealing with the VA and our great Vets.” — part of a series of tweets Thursday.​
THE FACTS: He’s ignoring McCain’s singular successes on behalf of fellow veterans.​
McCain was a leading force in the Senate behind the law that gave veterans an option to go outside the Department of Veterans Affairs’ health care system and get private care at public expense under certain conditions. President Barack Obama signed the VA Choice legislation into law. Ignoring that reality, Trump persistently claims that he brought Choice into law when no one else could.​
Trump signed a law in 2018 that expanded the options for using the Choice program established by Obama, McCain and other lawmakers.....​
TRUMP: “Also, I never called John a loser and swear on whatever, or whoever, I was asked to swear on, that I never called our great fallen soldiers anything other than HEROES.” — tweet Thursday.​
THE FACTS: He called McCain a loser.​
In addition, The Associated Press has confirmed many of the comments Trump was reported by The Atlantic to have made disparaging fallen or captured U.S. service members, such as his description of the American dead in a military graveyard as “losers.”​
As for McCain, Trump told a conservative forum in Iowa in 2015 that his view of McCain changed when McCain lost the 2008 presidential election to Obama. “He lost, so I never liked him as much after that, ‘cause I don’t like losers,” he said. Trump went on to dismiss McCain’s war service: “He’s not a war hero. He’s a war hero because he was captured. I like people that weren’t captured.”​
Trump in 2015 also tweeted a news article on Twitter calling McCain a “loser.”​


This refers to an article in the Atlantic which has a paywall.

Goldberg described an event that was held soon after Milley became chairman of the Joint Chiefs, when he gained an insight into Donald Trump’s perspective.​

Milley had chosen a severely wounded Army captain, Luis Avila, to sing “God Bless America.” Avila, who had completed five combat tours, had lost a leg in an IED attack in Afghanistan, and had suffered two heart attacks, two strokes, and brain damage as a result of his injuries. To Milley, and to four-star generals across the Army, Avila and his wife, Claudia, represented the heroism, sacrifice, and dignity of wounded soldiers.
As the report in The Atlantic, which has not been independently verified by MSNBC or NBC News, went on to explain, it had rained that day, softening the ground. As a result, Avila’s wheelchair nearly toppled, at which point Milley’s wife and then-Vice President Mike Pence rushed to his aid.​
Soon after, Trump said to Milley, within earshot of several witnesses, “Why do you bring people like that here? No one wants to see that, the wounded.” The then-president reportedly told the general that he didn’t want Avila to appear in public again.​


In the statement, Kelly is confirming, on the record, a number of details in a 2020 story in The Atlantic by editor-in-chief Jeffrey Goldberg, including Trump turning to Kelly on Memorial Day 2017, as they stood among those killed in Afghanistan and Iraq in Section 60 at Arlington National Cemetery, and saying, “I don’t get it. What was in it for them?​
 
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St. Helens

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ADMIN HAT ON
full

This thread has undergone some cleanup.
Please submit replies that are relevant to the opening post.

ADMIN HAT OFF
 
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Bradskii

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Again, CNN spin, based entirely on anonymous sources.
Anonymous sources? The source is Kelly. They interviewed Kelly. He was Trump's longest serving Chief of Staff. He says that he was with Trump when he heard him saying these things. He directly quoted what Trump said.

Again, your only option right now is to say that Kelly is lying and that Trump would never have said such things. And we have it on record the type of things that Trump says. We know the type of man Trump is. But hey, it's your call who you believe.
 
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RestoreTheJoy

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JOHN KELLY IS NOT AN ANONYMOUS SOURCE. HE'S LITERALLY A PRIMARY SOURCE.
Stop yelling. You didn't read what I said. I didn't say HE was an anonymous source. I did say that he didn't say anything directly except the one unverified comment. CNN article relies on anonymous sources.
Again, since you didn't follow it the first time:
Literally nothing he said - to CNN, no doubt - is verified on the record. Everything CNN quotes him saying is opinion that Trump holds all these negative opinions of soldiers, gold star families, etc. The only assertion he makes is one statement, that apparently no one else heard. Maybe Trump said it. Maybe he meant it the way Kelly construes it. Maybe not. There is no corroboration so it is solely he said-he said.
It links to an article by Goldberg, who also makes no direct assertions but only "anonymous sources say" hearsay.

Critically read the article. This is not journalism. CNN is famous for hit pieces.
 
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