Mass shooting ended by a legal gun owner.

Larnievc said:

‘Live Firefight Response Techniques for LEOs (2017)’, page 2, para 2:
“….shoot the black guy…”

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How many mass shooters are black?

"To conquer a nation, you must first disarm its citizens."

BPPLEE said:

When you don’t know what to do just do something? I don’t think that’s good advice

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It's not that it's not known what can be done: it's simple really. Change the 2nd Amendment. Get rid of gun culture. Stop worshiping guns as an idol of the same freedom other western democracies enjoy without the need for nearly unrestricted access to guns.

The people opposed to all that are stopping it from happening. And children die and people blow each other's brains out in double figures every day but that's the price of 2A so it'll carry on and there'll be thoughts and prayers but absolutely no significant action taken while money pours into the coffers of the NRA and weapon manufacturers.

America doesn't care: money is being made and people are too fearful of their fellow citizens who have literally been weaponized against each other. It's genius, really. Who needs to wars over seas when Americans can be manipulated to live in fear of their own neighbours BECAUSE these neighbours are armed to the teeth and will kill you soon as look at you if they get even slightly vexed because YOU being and American citizen are the dangerous thing THEY being American citizens can ever meet.

I sometimes think this was by design but I honestly don't think it is. It's a confluence of greed, entitlement, poor education, such disenfranchisement that death loses it's sting. But above all it's the FEAR that Americans seem to have of people even slightly not like themselves and their insistence that they have the ability to kill their fellow citizens at the drop of a hat.

Probably a Stetson.

Larnievc said:

It's not that it's not known what can be done: it's simple really. Change the 2nd Amendment. Get rid of gun culture. Stop worshiping guns as an idol of the same freedom other western democracies enjoy without the need for nearly unrestricted access to guns.

The people opposed to all that are stopping it from happening. And children die and people blow each other's brains out in double figures every day but that's the price of 2A so it'll carry on and there'll be thoughts and prayers but absolutely no significant action taken while money pours into the coffers of the NRA and weapon manufacturers.

America doesn't care: money is being made and people are too fearful of their fellow citizens who have literally been weaponized against each other. It's genius, really. Who needs to wars over seas when Americans can be manipulated to live in fear of their own neighbours BECAUSE these neighbours are armed to the teeth and will kill you soon as look at you if they get even slightly vexed because YOU being and American citizen are the dangerous thing THEY being American citizens can ever meet.

I sometimes think this was by design but I honestly don't think it is. It's a confluence of greed, entitlement, poor education, such disenfranchisement that death loses it's sting. But above all it's the FEAR that Americans seem to have of people even slightly not like themselves and their insistence that they have the ability to kill their fellow citizens at the drop of a hat.

Probably a Stetson.

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Okay let’s do it your way, repeat the 2nd amendment because of the actions of some people, because you say it will save lives. But don’t stop there since saving lives trumps freedom.
Every day, about 37 people in the United States die in drunk-driving crashes —
So ban motor vehicles. Think of how many lives it will save. That’s your approach
Not practical? Neither is doing away with the 2nd amendment

Wings like Eagles said:

"To conquer a nation, you must first disarm its citizens."

FACT CHECK: Adolf Hitler - To Conquer a Nation

Did Adolf Hitler once say that 'To conquer a nation, you must first disarm its citizens'?

www.snopes.com

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There are plenty of ways to conquer a nation that has absolutely nothing to do with disarming them.

Watching America from the outside right now, it's VERY clear that nobody is trying to disarm you (to your own detriment); nobody is even attacking you. But your avarice, corpulence, and hubris is slowing ripping you apart.

Your country is going to be conquered by itself while your enemies empower incompetent traitors who keep a certain section of the population skeptical of its government and institutions. So skeptical, in fact, that many are willing to throw away democracy just to make sure they can hold onto power (because they ALSO know that their platform does nothing to excite younger generations and so their tenuous hold on relevance is going to slip unless they keep that power).

It's actually really pathetic to see how transparent the grift is. And then for it to keep happening again and again. Should be seen as shameful.

Larnievc said:

This is short for ‘random person who just happens to be present’. It’s not an insult.

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Just wondered.
Whose slang is that?

rambot said:

There are plenty of ways to conquer a nation that has absolutely nothing to do with disarming them.

Watching America from the outside right now, it's VERY clear that nobody is trying to disarm you (to your own detriment); nobody is even attacking you. But your avarice, corpulence, and hubris is slowing ripping you apart.

Your country is going to be conquered by itself while your enemies empower incompetent traitors who keep a certain section of the population skeptical of its government and institutions. So skeptical, in fact, that many are willing to throw away democracy just to make sure they can hold onto power (because they ALSO know that their platform does nothing to excite younger generations and so their tenuous hold on relevance is going to slip unless they keep that power).

It's actually really pathetic to see how transparent the grift is. And then for it to keep happening again and again. Should be seen as shameful.

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Actually, America is and always has been a Christian Nation. But thank you for your thoughts where ever you are from.

Wings like Eagles said:

Actually, America is and always has been a Christian Nation. But thank you for your thoughts where ever you are from.

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No you haven't. You've just been a nation with quite a few Christians in it. But no. You have no been a Christian nation. At no point in your history, and certainly not now.

hislegacy said:

How about mandatory sentences for criminal offenses where guns are involved.

Armed robbery. 20 year mandatory

Illegal possession. 5 year mandatory

A felon in possession of a gun. 10 year mandatory.

Drive by shooting 10 Year mandatory.

No deals, no please, no early release. Do the crime, do the time. Period.

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It's interesting. Of the crimes you list here only 2 have a direct victim and usually only 1 or at most a handful. Armed robbery can also be covered by insurance if loses occur.

I don't have any problem with your list, to be clear. IT just seems so weird how hard we focus on crimes where only one victim is affected. While I can imagine that the impact of an armed robbery can certainly be traumatizing, Wage Theft can end up having a far FAR greater impact on a person's wealth and well being.

We never talk about the impact of white collar crime.


How about;
10 years for embezzlements.

20 years for Wage Theft

20+ Insider Trading

Jail time for EVERY PERSON in the chain of command for "Negligence causing death on a job site".

The above listed crimes often/always affect hundreds if not thousands of people but these people get off with barely a slap on the wrist. Tens of BILLIONS of dollars get stolen as wage theft and we see no calls for that.

I suppose that ultimately, I disagree only very mildly with what you say above. I think there is a BIG difference between someone making a mistake and being unwilling and incapable of being empathetic and cause others' harm.

For example, my brother in law is a very sweet and kind person. He wasn't always this nice and he'd made some bad choices in his youth for sure. He had some addictions and ended up trying to rob a store with a handgun. He got thrown in jail (Where he said he had MORE access to drugs than when he was at home) and was there for 2 years. When he came out he started to deal with his childhood stuff but that was an incredibly long and humbling and hard road. And when he was starting to heal from that, a person started stalking him around his work and then one day started beating him up bad and stomping on him. This guy is like a bad luck magnet. Considerably mental health issues haunted him and his marriage (to an ill person who was very unkind) came to an end. He will never be able to work again.

And to be both clear AND fair, the most terrible things happened to this man when he was a child by mother's boyfriendS. And he also shielded my wife from it...and tried to take matters into his own, very small hands.

To think I wouldn't have met this dude for the first 17 years of my relationship with his sister because of one stupid mistake at a bank after his entire context, makes me sad. I recognize the trauma he likely has caused other people though too.

So I agree in theory that these long harsh sentences seem like a perfect solution, in the end, I think they are a blunt instrument that will UTTERLY ruin more people than save. The recitivism rate is 37.1%.
But that means 62.9% are contributing to society, or at least not harming it. Do we want to ruin this 63% of people as well?

And remember, after these people leave how are they going to find work? Whose going to hire a 46 yr old day labourer who was the driver on a bank robbery? Will the state support them again?

Is the goal with this stuff to try to deter crime, to punish, a mix or something else?

rambot said:

No you haven't. You've just been a nation with quite a few Christians in it. But no. You have no been a Christian nation. At no point in your history, and certainly not now.

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You are wrong .......... but it is interesting how some people think they just say something and that makes it true.
If you want to educate yourself about America (and you should if you are going to talk about it), you might start with the leading experts at Wall Builders, they have tons of factual information to get you to the truth.

Over and over again:​

Compiling Cases where concealed handgun permit holders have stopped likely mass public shootings​

Really like reading what Amy's reports, and the Heritage Foundation as a whole, this is a little older report, but she does this every few months:

According to a 2013 report by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, almost every major study on the issue has found that Americans use their firearms in self-defense between 500,000 and 3 million times a year. There’s good reason to believe that many of these defensive gun uses aren’t reported to police, much less make the local or national news.

Wings like Eagles said:

Actually, America is and always has been a Christian Nation. But thank you for your thoughts where ever you are from.

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Which has nothing to do with what @rambot posted.

To make things better/safer, we need to get to the real issue of why crime is getting worse.

One reason is - Refusing to Prosecute and Punish Violent Offenders

Four Reasons for the Crime Increase​

Wings like Eagles said:

You are wrong .......... but it is interesting how some people think they just say something and that makes it true.
If you want to educate yourself about America (and you should if you are going to talk about it), you might start with the leading experts at Wall Builders, they have tons of factual information to get you to the truth.

Is America a Christian Nation?

Is America a Christian Nation? by David Barton Modern claims that America is not a Christian nation are rarely noticed or refuted today because of the nation’s widespread lack of knowledge about America’s history and foundation. To help provide the missing historical knowledge necessary to...

wallbuilders.com

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That source is almost literally bonkos.

The first quote says " we're not a christian nation because w. X. Y. Or z. But we keep CALLING ourselves a Christian nation so we must be one".
And he said that nonsense in 1910.

In fact it's surprising how often the quotes argue for calling the us a chrisitian nation due to the basis of their tort law and the first pioneers as the best justification for doing so.
Not strong arguments. I mean which part of the genocide of the first nations people is Christian?

But listen, I'm not going to read more from a source you don't care enough to even quote. Can't be that compelling I'd tou don't even stand behind it.

Beside, its coming from a source I have e 0 respect for. I mean even the site's name goes against some very basic teachings of rhe Bible.

Wings like Eagles said:

To make things better/safer, we need to get to the real issue of why crime is getting worse.

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Is crime getting worse? All crime?

One reason is - Refusing to Prosecute and Punish Violent Offenders

Four Reasons for the Crime Increase​

Four Reasons for the Crime Increase

The entirety of the American system of government rests on two very simple yet profound premises—that every human being is endowed by our Creator with natural and unalienable rights, and that the only just end of government is to secure these rights for its citizens. Unfortunately, far too...

www.heritage.org

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Why does Amy not link to any of the studies she mentions?

Wings like Eagles said:

You are wrong .......... but it is interesting how some people think they just say something and that makes it true.
If you want to educate yourself about America (and you should if you are going to talk about it), you might start with the leading experts at Wall Builders, they have tons of factual information to get you to the truth.

Is America a Christian Nation?

Is America a Christian Nation? by David Barton Modern claims that America is not a Christian nation are rarely noticed or refuted today because of the nation’s widespread lack of knowledge about America’s history and foundation. To help provide the missing historical knowledge necessary to...

wallbuilders.com

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David Barton passes off myths (some of his own making) as fact. America is not a Christian nation, but a secular nation whose citizens are predominately Christian.

BPPLEE said:

How many mass shooters are black?

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The more appropriate question would be, out of all the people that the USA police shoot, how many of them are black?