A good heart does good deeds. Do good deeds give you a good heart?

zoidar · Jul 7, 2023

We say from a good heart comes good deeds. Is it then the case good deeds give you a good heart? Thoughts?

But the things that proceed out of the mouth come from the heart, and those defile the man. For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, slanders. These are the things which defile the man ...
— Matthew 15:18-20

The good man out of the good treasure of his heart brings forth what is good; and the evil man out of the evil treasure brings forth what is evil; for his mouth speaks from that which fills his heart.
— Luke 6:45

But the Lord said to him, “Now you Pharisees clean the outside of the cup and of the platter; but inside of you, you are full of robbery and wickedness. You foolish ones, did not He who made the outside make the inside also? But give that which is within as charity, and then all things are clean for you.
— Luke 11:39-41

Friedrich Rubinstein · Jul 7, 2023

If it was the case that good deeds give you a good heart then the Pharisees who gave alms only in order to be applauded by the people (Matthew 23:5) - which is a good deed but a bad motive - should've gotten a humble heart by it. But the Bible doesn't indicate that, as far as I can tell. When you don't have a humble heart to begin with then doing good deeds will most likely just fuel your hubris.

atpollard · Jul 7, 2023

[Rom 14:23 NKJV] 23 But he who doubts is condemned if he eats, because [he does] not [eat] from faith; for whatever [is] not from faith is sin.

[Eph 2:8-10 NKJV] 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; [it is] the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.

[Eze 18:31 NKJV] 31 "Cast away from you all the transgressions which you have committed, and get yourselves a new heart and a new spirit. For why should you die, O house of Israel?

[Eze 36:26 NKJV] 26 "I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; I will take the heart of stone out of your flesh and give you a heart of flesh.

Good heart comes from God
Good deeds come from good heart.

Maria Billingsley · Jul 7, 2023

zoidar said:
We say from a good heart comes good deeds. Is it then the case good deeds give you a good heart? Thoughts?

But the things that proceed out of the mouth come from the heart, and those defile the man. For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, slanders. These are the things which defile the man ...
— Matthew 15:18-20

The good man out of the good treasure of his heart brings forth what is good; and the evil man out of the evil treasure brings forth what is evil; for his mouth speaks from that which fills his heart.
— Luke 6:45

But the Lord said to him, “Now you Pharisees clean the outside of the cup and of the platter; but inside of you, you are full of robbery and wickedness. You foolish ones, did not He who made the outside make the inside also? But give that which is within as charity, and then all things are clean for you.
— Luke 11:39-41

How does one attain a "good heart"?

zoidar · Jul 7, 2023

Maria Billingsley said:
How does one attain a "good heart"?

Repentance?

zoidar · Jul 7, 2023

Friedrich Rubinstein said:
If it was the case that good deeds give you a good heart then the Pharisees who gave alms only in order to be applauded by the people (Matthew 23:5) - which is a good deed but a bad motive - should've gotten a humble heart by it. But the Bible doesn't indicate that, as far as I can tell. When you don't have a humble heart to begin with then doing good deeds will most likely just fuel your hubris.

Assuming your motive is right, will good deeds give you a good heart?

Sketcher · Jul 7, 2023

Good deeds cannot balance out the sin that dwells within the heart, we need to be born again of the Holy Spirit.

That being said, once we have become Christians, doing good deeds has a sanctifying effect on the heart. We can resist sanctification by continuing to sin and be selfish, or we can cooperate with the process by obeying the Lord. The more we cooperate rather than resist, the more we are changed for the better.

zoidar · Jul 7, 2023

Sketcher said:
Good deeds cannot balance out the sin that dwells within the heart, we need to be born again of the Holy Spirit.

That being said, once we have become Christians, doing good deeds has a sanctifying effect on the heart. We can resist sanctification by continuing to sin and be selfish, or we can cooperate with the process by obeying the Lord. The more we cooperate rather than resist, the more we are changed for the better.

This was pretty much what I was wondering. But are you sure obeying the Lord in deeds purifies the heart? Is this your experience or more of something you just hold to be true?

Friedrich Rubinstein · Jul 7, 2023

zoidar said:
Assuming your motive is right, will good deeds give you a good heart?

If you are doing good deeds and have the right motive for them, does that not mean that you already have a good heart? I would think so.

Maria Billingsley · Jul 7, 2023

zoidar said:
Repentance?

Only if it is from unbelief to belief. From there ,He makes His Home in the believer then the true bond takes place where real goodness comes to fruition. Blessings

zoidar · Jul 7, 2023

Maria Billingsley said:
Only if it is from unbelief to belief. From there ,He makes His Home in the believer then the true bond takes place where real goodness comes to fruition. Blessings

I agree, but if a believer who has been cleaned inside, sins severely and muds up his heart, then what? Isn't it again through repentance the heart is cleaned up?

zoidar · Jul 7, 2023

Friedrich Rubinstein said:
If you are doing good deeds and have the right motive for them, does that not mean that you already have a good heart? I would think so.

I don't think it's necessarily so. A good hearted man may make a terrible choice, have the wrong motives and sin severely. Though I don't know if an evil hearted man can make a really good deed with the right motive. I think maybe in a situation where he no longer has anything to win from being evil, maybe at the time of dying he wants to do something good in the end.

Friedrich Rubinstein · Jul 7, 2023

zoidar said:
I don't think it's necessarily so. A good hearted man may make a terrible choice, have the wrong motives and sin severely. Though I don't know if an evil hearted man can make a really good deed with the right motive. I think maybe in a situation where he no longer has anything to win from being evil, maybe at the time dying he wants to do something good in the end.

I agree that a person with a good heart can do evil things. I cannot imagine a realistic situation in which an evil hearted man makes a good deed with the right motive though because the right motive requires both humbleness and kindness, if not benevolence even. These attributes are defining a good heart though in my humble opinion. Maybe we differ here?

You are giving the example of an evil man wanting to do something good on his deathbed. But what are his motives? Does he want someone to miss him, does he want to be remembered; and he knows that only good things are missed? Then it's a selfish motive, he wouldn't do the good deed for the sake of helping but for himself.

Maria Billingsley · Jul 7, 2023

zoidar said:
I agree, but if a believer who has been cleaned inside, sins severely and muds up his heart, then what? Isn't it again through repentance the heart is cleaned up?

Repentance is the changing of the mind, one sin at a time,meaning we dont go back to it. This is true repentance. Obedience to our Father and doing His will can only come through the power of His Holy Spirit. So for now we walk in His Spirit daily and do not quench His work in us. Do not doubt and trust that He will not abandon us during our times of need.
Blessings.

Sketcher · Jul 7, 2023

zoidar said:
This was pretty much what I was wondering. But are you sure obeying the Lord in deeds purifies the heart? Is this your experience or more of something you just hold to be true?

Yes, I have found that to be helpful in my own life. Those more consistent than me have more fruit to bear.

bling · Jul 7, 2023

zoidar said:
We say from a good heart comes good deeds. Is it then the case good deeds give you a good heart? Thoughts?

But the things that proceed out of the mouth come from the heart, and those defile the man. For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, slanders. These are the things which defile the man ...
— Matthew 15:18-20

The good man out of the good treasure of his heart brings forth what is good; and the evil man out of the evil treasure brings forth what is evil; for his mouth speaks from that which fills his heart.
— Luke 6:45

But the Lord said to him, “Now you Pharisees clean the outside of the cup and of the platter; but inside of you, you are full of robbery and wickedness. You foolish ones, did not He who made the outside make the inside also? But give that which is within as charity, and then all things are clean for you.
— Luke 11:39-41

Love and faith grow with use.

zoidar · Jul 8, 2023

Friedrich Rubinstein said:
I agree that a person with a good heart can do evil things. I cannot imagine a realistic situation in which an evil hearted man makes a good deed with the right motive though because the right motive requires both humbleness and kindness, if not benevolence even. These attributes are defining a good heart though in my humble opinion. Maybe we differ here?

You are giving the example of an evil man wanting to do something good on his deathbed. But what are his motives? Does he want someone to miss him, does he want to be remembered; and he knows that only good things are missed? Then it's a selfish motive, he wouldn't do the good deed for the sake of helping but for himself.

Hm, the evil man you describe sounds more like having the heart of a psychopath than the "normal" evil heart of unbelievers. But I don't know. You might be right.

zoidar · Jul 8, 2023

Maria Billingsley said:
Repentance is the changing of the mind, one sin at a time,meaning we dont go back to it. This is true repentance. Obedience to our Father and doing His will can only come through the power of His Holy Spirit. So for now we walk in His Spirit daily and do not quench His work in us. Do not doubt and trust that He will not abandon us during our times of need.
Blessings.

I was set free from sins being born again that later crept back into my life. It's a shame, but true. I don't know what that means.

Friedrich Rubinstein · Jul 8, 2023

zoidar said:
Hm, the evil man you describe sounds more like having the heart of a psychopath than the "normal" evil heart of unbelievers. But I don't know. You might be right.

I have met atheists who had more love and kindness in their heart than many professing Christians. So I didn't exclude unbelievers from having a good heart. Perhaps we would need to define these terms better to understand each other's perspective

Edit: I'd also like to add that if we're talking about believers specifically, then we need to add the Holy Spirit to the equation. With the help of the Holy Spirit good deeds can influence your heart to the better, but that is after God already replaced your "heart of stone" with a "heart of flesh". The Holy Spirit can work wonders here, literally. My previous response was including unbelievers though, who do not have the Holy Spirit nor a changed heart. The question in the OP didn't seem to specify believers.

Sabertooth · Jul 9, 2023

Evil people can do good deeds...

Jesus said,
"If a son asks for bread from any father among you, will he give him a stone?

Or if he asks for a fish, will he give him a serpent instead of a fish?

Or if he asks for an egg, will he offer him a scorpion?

If you then, being evil, know how to give good gifts to your children,
how much more will your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to those who ask Him!” Luke 11:11-13 NKJV

A good heart does good deeds. Do good deeds give you a good heart?

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