"The Straight Testimony" of Ellen White

Pavel Mosko · Mar 16, 2023

I was just listening to a video talk about this and realized this needed to be the source of a thread somewhere. Probably the best place from the "horses mouth" and looked for the first Pro Adventist site I could find based on a keyword search and found the below link as my top search.

Straight-testimony

I will however give a quote I transcribed from the video where a pastor that is a former Adventist that sparked my interest in the topic.

Pastor E-j Thunder Lauriston

"And by the way brothers and sisters as he talks about that (another former SDA who mentioned his need to earn his way into heaven)..It is not just abstinence from bacon, from coffee, and those kinds of stuff. When you read Ellen White's writings there is not enough hours in the day to do all she demands in order for you to be perfected and saved. We are talking about their devotional life which is reading her books and those she recommends. You know the Conflict of Ages series. Uriah's Smith's dying Revelation and Medical Missionary. We're talking about up to the types of food you can eat and when you can eat them. You know you mustn't eat and drink at the same time. The number of times you can chew. Dress Reform..... I mean it is just so many nit-picky and legalistic stuff and all of these brothers and sisters is what Ellen White calls "The Straight Testimony."

Der Alte · Mar 16, 2023

Pavel Mosko said:
I was just listening to a video talk about this and realized this needed to be the source of a thread somewhere. Probably the best place from the "horses mouth" and looked for the first Pro Adventist site I could find based on a keyword search and found the below link as my top search.

Straight-testimony

I will however give a quote I transcribed from the video where a pastor that is a former Adventist that sparked my interest in the topic.

Pastor E-j Thunder Lauriston

"And by the way brothers and sisters as he talks about that (another former SDA who mentioned his need to earn his way into heaven)..It is not just abstinence from bacon, from coffee, and those kinds of stuff. When you read Ellen White's writings there is not enough hours in the day to do all she demands in order for you to be perfected and saved. We are talking about their devotional life which is reading her books and those she recommends. You know the Conflict of Ages series. Uriah's Smith's dying Revelation and Medical Missionary. We're talking about up to the types of food you can eat and when you can eat them. You know you mustn't eat and drink at the same time. The number of times you can chew. Dress Reform..... I mean it is just so many nit-picky and legalistic stuff and all of these brothers and sisters is what Ellen White calls "The Straight Testimony."

When I was 14, 6+ decades ago I came home from school one day and found people from the county who took me and my step brother and step sister to foster homes. Both our parents were hospitalized. The foster parents were Adventists. One Sabbath after service the 18 YO son and I were taking some young ladies from church home. Something went wrong with the car so we went to the son's home to make some minor repair. The parents came home and the father went bananas about working on the Sabbath. So we took dad's car and took the young ladies home.

Pavel Mosko · Mar 16, 2023

Der Alte said:
When I was 14, 6+ decades ago I came home from school one day and found people from the county who took me and my step brother and step sister to foster homes. Both our parents were hospitalized. The foster parents were Adventists. One Sabbath after service the 18 YO son and I were taking some young ladies from church home. Something went wrong with the car so we went to the son's home to make some minor repair. The parents came home and the father went bananas about working on the Sabbath. So we took dad's car and took the young ladies home.

And that kind of thing you think would be a given that you should take it in stride even if you are a big believer in the sabbath rest like my Messianic rabbi friend. Kinda like some folks read White more than Gospels. But I wouldn't be surprised at that based on hearing about an official SDA reading list for the year, where you are infact reading much more Ellen than the straight Bible.

As far as the OP goes it and them fussing over things it reminds me a story of my former Coptic priest and his experience with the Mormon professors of Brigman Young University. Fr. Salib was a doctor of genetics and worked on the Human Genome Project, prior to retiring and then going into ministry as a Coptic presbyter. He had stories of his Latter-Day saint fellow professors doing silly things like drinking Coke but hiding in in a Seven Up can (because that was on the OK list). That sort of thing impressed him in a negative way. As he put it to our Coptic English-speaking Sunday school group during a fellowship potluck, "They are a very superficial people!"

eleos1954 · Mar 17, 2023

I was just listening to a video talk about this and realized this needed to be the source of a thread somewhere. Probably the best place from the "horses mouth" and looked for the first Pro Adventist site I could find based on a keyword search and found the below link as my top search.

Straight-testimony

I will however give a quote I transcribed from the video where a pastor that is a former Adventist that sparked my interest in the topic.

Pastor E-j Thunder Lauriston

"And by the way brothers and sisters as he talks about that (another former SDA who mentioned his need to earn his way into heaven)..It is not just abstinence from bacon, from coffee, and those kinds of stuff. When you read Ellen White's writings there is not enough hours in the day to do all she demands in order for you to be perfected and saved. We are talking about their devotional life which is reading her books and those she recommends. You know the Conflict of Ages series. Uriah's Smith's dying Revelation and Medical Missionary. We're talking about up to the types of food you can eat and when you can eat them. You know you mustn't eat and drink at the same time. The number of times you can chew. Dress Reform..... I mean it is just so many nit-picky and legalistic stuff and all of these brothers and sisters is what Ellen White calls "The Straight Testimony."

This is the "horses mouth"

Home

Seventh-day Adventists are devoted to helping people understand the Bible to find freedom, healing, and hope in Jesus.

www.adventist.org

BobRyan · Mar 21, 2023

Der Alte said:
When I was 14, 6+ decades ago I came home from school one day and found people from the county who took me and my step brother and step sister to foster homes. Both our parents were hospitalized. The foster parents were Adventists. One Sabbath after service the 18 YO son and I were taking some young ladies from church home. Something went wrong with the car so we went to the son's home to make some minor repair. The parents came home and the father went bananas about working on the Sabbath.

And the solution?

Der Alte said:
So we took dad's car and took the young ladies home.

Sounds reasonable - am I missing something?

BobRyan · Mar 21, 2023

Pavel Mosko said:
I was just listening to a video talk about this and realized this needed to be the source of a thread somewhere. Probably the best place from the "horses mouth" and looked for the first Pro Adventist site I could find based on a keyword search and found the below link as my top search.

Straight-testimony

Interesting non-SDA-Denomination selection for "the horses mouth" in that web site above that you picked as "the horses mouth" --www.thestraighttestimony.com/Straight-testimony.htm

why not go to the denomination's actual web site?

Something more like this --

https://gc.adventist.org/

What do Seventh-day Adventists Believe?

The official description of Seventh-day Adventists’ interpretation and practice of the major themes in Scripture, organized into 28 Fundamental Beliefs.

www.adventist.org

Does that present a problem for what you are intending?

Pavel Mosko said:
I will however give a quote I transcribed from the video where a pastor that is a former Adventist that sparked my interest in the topic.

Pastor E-j Thunder Lauriston

"And by the way brothers and sisters as he talks about that (another former SDA who mentioned his need to earn his way into heaven)

I have met a few "former Adventists" that do not know what Adventists actually believe in certain cases - and are glad to turn a given belief to fit their present bias.

But they seldom quote an actual teaching or explain how the Bible texts that are aligned with that teaching - should be changed.

So while we do not actually have a "earn your way to heaven we do have
1 Cor 7:19 "what matters is keeping the commandments of God" (something the former SDAs never quote in certain examples as noted above.)

And we have Romans 2:4-16 (something the former SDAs never quote in certain examples as noted above.)

And we have Rev 14:12 informing us that 'the saints KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus" (something the former SDAs never quote in certain examples as noted above.)

And we have "actual" NEW Covenant mentioned in scripture Jer 31:31-34 (and also in Heb 8:6-12) where the NEW Covenant writes "God's LAW on the heart and mind" -- (something the former SDAs never quote in certain examples as noted above.)

And we do have 1 John 5:3 "This IS the LOVE of God that we KEEP His commandments" -- (something the former SDAs never quote in certain examples as noted above.)

And so while we all can agree that we are "saved by grace through faith" Eph 2:8 -- a few of also also agree that we cannot simply delete/ignore the inconvenient texts such as those above.

BobRyan · Mar 21, 2023

Pavel Mosko said:
But I wouldn't be surprised at that based on hearing about an official SDA reading list for the year,

I heard about... someone said...possibly someone came up with a reading list one time. ... Maybe a few members use this-or-that reading list.

Meanwhile the actual Bible texts on these topics - get totally dismissed.

Der Alte · Mar 21, 2023

BobRyan said:
And the solution?

Sounds reasonable - am I missing something?

Just sharing my first personal encounter with a Seventh Day Adventist when I was an unaware teenager. Until that incident I was not aware how strict they were about the Sabbath. I recently went to the funeral of a Korean SDA man; I was acquainted with. They served lunch. There were dishes which appeared to be meat but without me asking one of the ladies informed me it was not meat. Didn't bother me I like BK's Impossible burger.

BobRyan · Mar 21, 2023

Der Alte said:
Just sharing my first personal encounter with a Seventh Day Adventist when I was an unaware teenager. Until that incident I was not aware how strict they were about the Sabbath. I recently went to the funeral of a Korean SDA man; I was acquainted with. They served lunch. There were dishes which appeared to be meat but without me asking one of the ladies informed me it was not meat. Didn't bother me I like BK's Impossible burger.

Thanks for sharing that.

I too like impossible burger and patties.

The SDA denomination has one belief statement on "Christian behavior" and it includes these two teachings related to food.
1. Following the Lev 11 rule of meat that is for food as opposed to the kind of meat that is " not for food". (In Gen 8 and 9 they are also given as examples of what was a valid burnt offering vs what was not accepted as a valid burnt offering before the LORD)

2. Living as healthy as possible -

See our fundamental belief - #22.
22. Christian Behavior:
We are called to be a godly people who think, feel, and act in harmony with the principles of heaven. For the Spirit to recreate in us the character of our Lord we involve ourselves only in those things which will produce Christlike purity, health, and joy in our lives. This means that our amusement and entertainment should meet the highest standards of Christian taste and beauty. While recognizing cultural differences, our dress is to be simple, modest, and neat, befitting those whose true beauty does not consist of outward adornment but in the imperishable ornament of a gentle and quiet spirit. It also means that because our bodies are the temples of the Holy Spirit, we are to care for them intelligently. Along with adequate exercise and rest, we are to adopt the most healthful diet possible and abstain from the unclean foods identified in the Scriptures. Since alcoholic beverages, tobacco, and the irresponsible use of drugs and narcotics are harmful to our bodies, we are to abstain from them as well. Instead, we are to engage in whatever brings our thoughts and bodies into the discipline of Christ, who desires our wholesomeness, joy, and goodness. (Rom. 12:1, 2; 1 John 2:6; Eph. 5:1-21; Phil. 4:8; 2 Cor. 10:5; 6:14-7:1; 1 Peter 3:1-4; 1 Cor. 6:19, 20; 10:31; Lev. 11:1-47; 3 John 2.)

http://www.adventist.org/fileadmin/...rticles/official-statements/28Beliefs-Web.pdf

So we don't have a doctrinal statement that man must be vegetarian - but we do recognize the vegetarian/vegan diet to be the most healthy

LW97Nils · Mar 21, 2023

BobRyan said:
Thanks for sharing that.

I too like impossible burger and patties.

The SDA denomination has one belief statement on "Christian behavior" and it includes these two teachings related to food.
1. Following the Lev 11 rule of meat that is for food as opposed to the kind of meat that is " not for food". (In Gen 8 and 9 they are also given as examples of what was a valid burnt offering vs what was not accepted as a valid burnt offering before the LORD)

And there is where is disagree with on SDA church (just as I disagree with their teaching of annihilation). Correct, only clean animals were acceptable as offerings. As food, all were, see Genesis 9:3.

BobRyan · Mar 21, 2023

LW97Nils said:
And there is where is disagree with on SDA church (just as I disagree with their teaching of annihilation). Correct, only clean animals were acceptable as offerings. As food, all were, see Genesis 9:3.

Up until Genesis 9 - only plants were given to mankind as food.

In Gen 9 God gives the animals - but in Gen 9 the distinction for clean vs unclean is already established as we see in Gen 7,8,9.

The only definition that the readers of Genesis 7,8,9 had for referencing "what is a clean animal" was in Lev 11. No other text exists to tell the reader what it is -- and in Lev 11 it has specific reference to 'what is food'.

It is "just like the rule for plants" in that some plants are poison and some are not.

In any case I am not camped out on making this point - just giving an example for how this appears to work best in my POV.

Bottom line "eating rat sandwiches is not a good idea - and I think this detail matters with God" given that our bodies are the temple of the Holy Spirit according to Paul's letter to the church at Corinth.

But each one should be convinced in his own mind on this point.

LW97Nils · Mar 21, 2023

BobRyan said:
Up until Genesis 9 - only plants were given to mankind as food.

Amen

BobRyan said:
In Gen 9 God gives the animals - but in Gen 9 the distinction for clean vs unclean is already established as we see in Gen 7,8,9.

Which prior to that had been for sacrifice, not food. Otherwise we had a contradiction.

BobRyan said:
It is "just like the rule for plants" in that some plants are poison and some are not.

Yes, but it was not always poison. Prior to Adam's sin, all had been good.

And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat. Genesis 1:29

And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life; thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field Genesis 3:17-18

So yes, it changed, but in Genesis 9:3, the anology to the former exists:
Every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you; even as the green herb have I given you all things. Genesis 9:3

I requoted the verse to make it clear

Note that unlike in Genesis 1:29, it no longer says "every green herb", but it shows how originally it was all clean without exception.

BobRyan said:
Bottom line "eating rat sandwiches is not a good idea - and I think this detail matters with God" given that our bodies are the temple of the Holy Spirit according to Paul's letter to the church at Corinth.

Yeah, rats absolutely not, but even there I see distinction between different types of unclean animals. Rats have poison in them... do pigs also? I have eaten pigs so many times, it never harmed me. I also could adress the case of the puffer fish. It can be eaten and not lead to (physical) death if it is cooked a particular way, but all other ways will kill the person who eats it.

BobRyan said:
But each one should be convinced in his own mind on this point.

Indeed

BobRyan · Mar 21, 2023

LW97Nils said:
Yeah, rats absolutely not, but even there I see distinction between different types of unclean animals. Rats have poison in them... do pigs also?

Pigs have " Trichinella is the genus of parasitic roundworms of the phylum Nematoda that cause trichinosis (also known as trichinellosis)."

shell fish are filter feeders that filter toxins/poisons/impurities from the water and have 10x to 1000x the poison/impurity concentration in their flesh as compared to the surrounding water.

But whether or not we live in an age where mankind has the science to know some of the reasons God has for sparing us the problems they cause - the Word of God still forbids the eating of rats, cats, dogs , bats etc, etc. based on a very simple rule of divided hoof and also chews the cud in Lev 11.

It blocks off everything else on land - for land animals by that one simple rule. But does not say "this part of that rule is wise , but this other part is just for show"

BobRyan · Mar 21, 2023

LW97Nils said:
Amen

Which prior to that had been for sacrifice, not food. Otherwise we had a contradiction.

Yes, but it was not always poison. Prior to Adam's sin, all had been good.

In the Bible - before the fall of man -- the only thing they were allowed to eat was fruit

29 Then God said, “Behold, I have given you every plant yielding seed that is on the surface of all the earth, and every tree which has fruit yielding seed; it shall be food for you;

But that does not mean they could eat trees without getting sick, just fruit.

So it was all good to be used as intended

toxins in plants affect herbivores, and deter them from consuming the plants.

So a lot of flowering plants have portions of them that smell bad to animals and that allows the plant to live , to continue to produce fruit without also being destroyed and no longer able to produce fruit. The idea that it would be "a bad thing" for plants to have that feature is interesting but it is an inference.

"Plants cannot move to escape their predators, so they must have other means of protecting themselves from herbivorous animals. Some plants have physical defenses .... but by far the most common type of protection is chemical"

LW97Nils · Mar 22, 2023

BobRyan said:
In the Bible - before the fall of man -- the only thing they were allowed to eat was fruit

I think we're going in circles... we already had been talkin about that.

Jesus is YHWH · Mar 22, 2023

Der Alte said:
When I was 14, 6+ decades ago I came home from school one day and found people from the county who took me and my step brother and step sister to foster homes. Both our parents were hospitalized. The foster parents were Adventists. One Sabbath after service the 18 YO son and I were taking some young ladies from church home. Something went wrong with the car so we went to the son's home to make some minor repair. The parents came home and the father went bananas about working on the Sabbath. So we took dad's car and took the young ladies home.

Reminds me of Jesus being condemned for healing a man on the sabbath.

Der Alte · Mar 22, 2023

Jesus is YHWH said:
Reminds me of Jesus being condemned for healing a man on the sabbath.

Either that or pulling an ox out of a ditch on the Sabbath. But I was not that knowledgeable at that time. Except for the few months I was in a foster home I didn't even go to church.

Jesus is YHWH · Mar 22, 2023

Der Alte said:
Either that or pulling an ox out of a ditch on the Sabbath. But I was not that knowledgeable at that time. Except for the few months I was in a foster home I didn't even go to church.

I love your testimony brother " oldshepherd". You should write a book. You and I (civic) go back 20 years on the forum that permanently banned me when I started challenging calvinism lol.

Der Alte · Mar 22, 2023

Jesus is YHWH said:
I love your testimony brother " oldshepherd". You should write a book. You and I (civic) go back 20 years on the forum that permanently banned me when I started challenging calvinism lol.

If I did you would probably be the only one to read it. I got involved in the other forum for the same reason.

Jipsah · Mar 24, 2023

BobRyan said:
Pigs have " Trichinella is the genus of parasitic roundworms of the phylum Nematoda that cause trichinosis (also known as trichinellosis)."

Ever known anyone who got trichinosis? Neither have I.

BobRyan said:
shell fish are filter feeders that filter toxins/poisons/impurities from the water and have 10x to 1000x the poison/impurity concentration in their flesh as compared to the surrounding water.

I got sick on raw oysters once.

BobRyan said:
But whether or not we live in an age where mankind has the science to know some of the reasons God has for sparing us the problems they cause - the Word of God still forbids the eating of rats, cats, dogs , bats etc, etc. based on a very simple rule of divided hoof and also chews the cud in Lev 11.

13 And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and eat.
14 But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean.
15 And the voice spake unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.

St Peter was not being shown pictures of unclean Gentiles.

25Whatsoever is sold in the shambles, that eat, asking no question for conscience sake:
26For the earth is the Lord's, and the fulness thereof.
27If any of them that believe not bid you to a feast, and ye be disposed to go; whatsoever is set before you, eat, asking no question for conscience sake.

'Nuff said.

"The Straight Testimony" of Ellen White

Arch-Dude of the Apostolic

This is me about 1 yr. old. when FDR was president

Arch-Dude of the Apostolic

God is Love

Junior Member

Junior Member

Junior Member

This is me about 1 yr. old. when FDR was president

Junior Member

Well-Known Member

Junior Member

Well-Known Member

Junior Member

Junior Member

Well-Known Member

my Lord and my God !

This is me about 1 yr. old. when FDR was president

my Lord and my God !

This is me about 1 yr. old. when FDR was president

Blood Drinker

Similar threads