Samson's death pointing to Christ's death?

Aaron112 · Jan 3, 2023

Fervent said:
his function as a type is as a failure to live up to the promise that he held, but good news is where even the best of us fail Christ succeeds. Samson didn't live up to the promises about him because he was all too human and no ordinary human could shoulder that weight.

This is apparently not correct. Speculation based on something faulty, something other than what God Himself Says.

Jonaitis · Jan 3, 2023

Fervent said:
Certainly, and I am persuaded that there is a typology to it. But there's more than just the typology, as the particulars of the story are also essential to a complete understanding. Judges, as a whole, functions as an apology for Israel's failure to conquer the land God gave it explaining that it is not a failure of God but their own. So while we can see parallels in Christ's story from Samson's story his function as a type is as a failure to live up to the promise that he held, but good news is where even the best of us fail Christ succeeds. Samson didn't live up to the promises about him because he was all too human and no ordinary human could shoulder that weight.

Great insight, but no one in this thread has stating that its typology is the exclusive understanding of the story, which you apparently seem to assume. This thread is focusing on the type/antitype presented in the Scriptures.

Fervent · Jan 3, 2023

Aaron112 said:
Probably not a good perspective.
===================
Going instead with only what God's Word shows,

"Without doubt Samson made mistakes when it came to choosing women and revealing information to them that he shouldn't have. However, he did" eventually yield to God's great purpose for his life and finished his life praying for God's help to accomplish it. We can learn from both his mistakes and from what he did right."

Samson: Accomplishing God's Purpose the Hard Way

Some find it perplexing that this man with all his faults is among the faithful of Hebrews 11 who are awaiting God's Kingdom. What did he do to deserve this distinction? What can we learn from his life?

www.ucg.org

"As we consider Samson's life, it is important for us to understand from the outset that God is not calling men today to imitate Samson's conduct. As a physical, carnal nation, ancient Israel waged war with other nations. New Testament Christians, however, look to future citizenship in God's Kingdom, which is not of this world, and do not fight in physical warfare, being ministers of life, not death (see Matthew 5:38-39, 43-44; John 18:36; 2 Corinthians 3:6).

"God gave Samson the unique job of weakening the Philistine nation during the time of Israel's judges—a job He is not giving to people today. Furthermore, like everyone, Samson did some things right and he also made mistakes.

"Today, God has a purpose for each of our lives as well. He wants us to become children in His family (John 1:12). Will you accept the purpose for your life and live accordingly

God's purposes with Samson were accomplished in spite of Samson, not because of him. Especially considering Samson's resistance to the Philistine's is essentially all a result of his attempts to intermingle with them and then throwing tantrums when they don't accept him.

Aaron112 · Jan 3, 2023

Fervent said:
God's purposes with Samson were accomplished in spite of Samson, not because of him. Especially considering Samson's resistance to the Philistine's is essentially all a result of his attempts to intermingle with them and then throwing tantrums when they don't accept him.

That statement seems heavy on personal opinion not revealed anywhere in God's Word, and possibly contradictory.

Fervent · Jan 3, 2023

Jonaitis said:
Great insight, but no one in this thread has stating that its typology is the exclusive understanding of the story, which you apparently seem to assume. This thread is focusing on the type/antitype presented in the Scriptures.

No, I don't assume as much. I'm simply trying to clarify that it seems to me that Samson only works as a type if we understand his story as a stand in for Israel as a whole, as the antitype understanding of Jesus that fits is His role as the true Israel of God.

Fervent · Jan 3, 2023

Aaron112 said:
That statement seems heavy on personal opinion not revealed anywhere in God's Word, and possibly contradictory.

As does your commentary in post 39, but that's what happens when we study the Bible.

Aaron112 · Jan 3, 2023

Fervent said:
As does your commentary in post 39, but that's what happens when we study the Bible.

No, not with me or those who remain faithful and true and trusting in the heavenly Father to reveal His Word and HIs Plan.

Fervent · Jan 3, 2023

Aaron112 said:
No, not with me or those who remain faithful and true and trusting in the heavenly Father to reveal His Word and HIs Plan.

Uh huh...I'm sure you've got the inside track and are impeccable in all of your understandings of a text you are 3000 years removed from that was written in a language that you don't speak.

YeshuaFollower · Jan 3, 2023

Jonaitis said:
David was violent, committed adultery, and did many other sinful acts, yet we tend to see his life and words in reflection to Jesus. I could say the same for Abraham, Joseph, Adam, et al. I believe we can safely say that Jesus's atonement was foreshadowed in the death of Samson. He conquered his enemies through his sacrifice, even though Samson was the imperfect reflection in it of the true and perfect.

You seem convinced you are correct, maybe I missed something and will examine again in more detail, thank you for the post.
Cheers

Jonaitis · Jan 3, 2023

Jesusfollowerforever said:
You seem convinced you are correct, maybe I missed something and will examine again in more detail, thank you for the post.
Cheers

I may seem convinced, but it may also seem like I am seeking confirmation bias. Feel free to come back when you want. Cheers!

YeshuaFollower · Jan 3, 2023

Jonaitis said:
I may seem convinced, but it may also seem like I am seeking confirmation bias. Feel free to come back when you want. Cheers!

I will examine closely and get back to you on this thread, i will check all cross references and commentary and will give you my opinion. it is an interesting topic.

Be blessed.

JFF

Paul4JC · Jan 3, 2023

Jonaitis said:
Why not?

As others may have already said, Samson didn't live the life Christ lived. He didn't have much to live for when he died, but God did answer his prayer.

Clare73 · Jan 4, 2023

2PhiloVoid said:
You're definitely right to say that we need to be cautious. But we can't be so cautious that we just throw the hermeneutical and exegetical possibilities to the wind simply because we find some notion or story within the Old Testament distasteful to our modern moral inclinations.

Before comparing notes and sources, I'd say that the main point here in typological comparisons is to realize that some Old Testament events are only typological in some minor form, thematically speaking, but not in substance.

The instance of Samson, then, is that his story is only typological in the sense where he was used by God and defeated the "enemies of God," and when doing so, he stretched out his arms to bring down one powercenter in the spiritual misdirections of paganism and to "free" Israel. Robert Hampshire describes some additional nuances that MIGHT BE (and I say "might be") at play in the typological meaning of Samson.

How Does the Story of Samson Point to Jesus?

That is why we needed Jesus Christ to come and save us: Because we could not save ourselves. We also see in Samson’s story the crucial lesson that God will ultimately be glorified, even if it is through our mistakes and blunders.

www.christianity.com

Scott McKnight says otherwise:

Samson - A Hero of the Faith?

Samson is mentioned in two places in Scripture. The first is the story of Samson in Judges 13-16. The only other mention is in Hebrews 12 among a list of other Old Testament characters.And what more shall ...

www.christianitytoday.com

The caveat in this is that I'm very, very aware of the violence aspect which is prominently embedded in the Samson narrative in the book of Judges, so this issue in and of itself needs to be assessed and addressed as a part of any typological or allegorical analysis that might be made of Samson (or of any other figure or event in the Old Testament). In such case, I'd bring in a number of additional sources--but not end with those--in order to better think through these "types."

Is not David, "the man after God's own heart," the key?

2PhiloVoid · Jan 4, 2023

Clare73 said:
Is not David, "the man after God's own heart," the key?

He's definitely one of the keys. But don't tell that to the Liberal Posse. They'll just make sport of it since Kind David was, like everyone, a sinner.

The Liturgist · Jan 5, 2023

Jonaitis said:
Is Samson's death a typology of Christ's death? He defeated his enemies at the cost of his life, thus saving the people of Israel.

I think so, yes, this is a valid Alexandrian typological parallel, similar to how Noah, Moses, Esther, King David and even Jonah would act in a manner which helped to save and secure the people, and there are different typological parallels which can be drawn from each of these cases to our Lord, God and Savior Jesus Christ.

The Liturgist · Jan 5, 2023

Fervent said:
I'm not opposed to typological evaluation, but its utility is often overextended such that nearly anything can be said to be typological.

Well that’s because everything is typological, or rather, I should say, Christological. Typological hermeneutics are useful because they help us to understand how the Scriptures which our Lord opened at the end of the Gospel According to Luke were all about Him, as He demonstrated to the disciples. These scriptures were of course the Old Testament, because at the time of the Ascension, which chronologically I think occurred very soon after the opening of the books in Luke, there was not yet a New Testament.

Therefore it is a matter of Biblical doctrine that the Old Testament is first and foremost a Christological prophecy, a text about our savior, as He demonstrated to the Apostles.

Typological exegesis in the manner taught by the Catechtical School of Alexandria is particularly useful in finding these Christological meanings, although I would note that the most accomplished Patristic figures used both an Alexandrian typological-allegorical hermeneutic and an Antiochene literal-historical hermeneutic, whereas those who specialized in one or the other have become more controversial (Origen on the Alexandrian side and Theodore of Mopsuestia on the Antiochene side).

Samson's death pointing to Christ's death?

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