Covenant theological concepts

ralliann

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When looking up covenant theology, I have come across two of the early Church fathers for foundational concepts of covenant theology among the reformers. Irenaeus, and Augustine.
However, I cannot seem to find any material concerning that specifically. Does anyone here know what those are, and where they can be found in their works?
I would much appreciate it.
 

msortwell

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When looking up covenant theology, I have come across two of the early Church fathers for foundational concepts of covenant theology among the reformers. Irenaeus, and Augustine.
However, I cannot seem to find any material concerning that specifically. Does anyone here know what those are, and where they can be found in their works?
I would much appreciate it.

When we speak of the Reformers, we are generally referring to the Protestant Reformation in the 1500’s. The two men you mentioned lived before 400 AD. So . . . I am confused.
 
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ralliann

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When we speak of the Reformers, we are generally referring to the Protestant Reformation in the 1500’s. The two men you mentioned lived before 400 AD. So . . . I am confused.
I know they are reformers. The question concerned the reformers seeing in certain Church fathers the "foundational principals" for THEIR covenant theologies (luther and Calvin) I am simply asking if you know what that is. They are the ones claiming this.
 
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Jonaitis

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When looking up covenant theology, I have come across two of the early Church fathers for foundational concepts of covenant theology among the reformers. Irenaeus, and Augustine.
However, I cannot seem to find any material concerning that specifically. Does anyone here know what those are, and where they can be found in their works?
I would much appreciate it.
I wish I could help you, but I am only familiar with seventeenth century covenant theologies. I will follow this thread for more information.
 
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disciple Clint

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BABerean2

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When looking up covenant theology, I have come across two of the early Church fathers for foundational concepts of covenant theology among the reformers. Irenaeus, and Augustine.
However, I cannot seem to find any material concerning that specifically. Does anyone here know what those are, and where they can be found in their works?
I would much appreciate it.

Many are not aware of the battle between the Old Covenant and the New Covenant which began in Acts chapter 15. That battle continues to the present time. During most of that time period the Judaisers have won the day.

New Covenant Whole Gospel:


Let us now share the Old Testament Gospel found below with the whole world. On the road to Emmaus He said the Old Testament is about Him.

He is the very Word of God in John 1:1, 14. Awaken Church to this truth.


Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

Jer 31:32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by

husband unto them, saith the LORD:

Jer 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

Jer 31:34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.


Is the most important genealogy in the Bible found in Matthew 1:1 (Gal. 3:16)? Is God's Son the ultimate fulfillment of Israel (John 1:49)? Why has the modern Church done a pitiful job of sharing the Gospel with modern Orthodox Jews? Why would someone tell them they are God's chosen people and then fail to share the Gospel with them? Who is the seed of the woman promised in Genesis 3:15? Who is the "son" in Psalm 2? Who is the "suffering servant" of Isaiah 53? Who would fulfill the New Covenant promised in Jeremiah 31:31-34? Who would fulfill the timeline of Daniel chapter 9 before the second temple was destroyed? Why have we not heard this simple Old Testament Gospel preached on Christian television in the United States on a regular basis?


Once a person comes to understand the New Covenant promised to Israel and Judah in Jeremiah 31:31-34, which is found fulfilled by Christ during the first century in Hebrews 8:6-13, and Hebrews 10:16-18, and specifically applied to the Church in 2 Corinthians 3:6-8, and Hebrews 12:22-24, man-made Bible doctrines fall apart.


Let us now learn to preach the whole Gospel until He comes back. The King of Israel is risen from the dead! (John 1:49, Acts 2:36)


Watch the YouTube videos “The New Covenant” by Bob George, and David H.J. Gay.

=========================

Which baptism is a part of the salvation process, based on what the Bible says?

What did Peter say below?


Acts 11:15 And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning.

Acts 11:16 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost.

Act 11:17 Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as he did unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God?


Based on Luke 3:16, and John 1:33, and Acts 11:15-16, the most important thing about the word "baptize" in the New Testament has nothing to do with water. The Holy Spirit is the master teacher promised to New Covenant believers in Jeremiah 31:34, and John 14:26, and is found fulfilled in Ephesians 1:13, and 1 John 2:27. Unfortunately, many modern Christians see water when they read the word "baptize" in the text. Based on the above, what is the one baptism of our faith found in the passage below? How many times is the word "Spirit" found in the passage, and how many times is the word "water" found in the passage?


Eph 4:1 I therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you that ye walk worthy of the vocation wherewith ye are called,

Eph 4:2 With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love;

Eph 4:3 Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.

Eph 4:4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;

Eph 4:5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,


“baptize” KJV



Mat_3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:



Mar_1:8 I indeed have baptized you with water: but he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost.



Luk_3:16 John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire:



Joh_1:26 John answered them, saying, I baptize with water: but there standeth one among you, whom ye know not;



Joh_1:33 And I knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, the same is he which baptizeth with the Holy Ghost.



1Co_1:17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.


.
 
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ralliann

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Many are not aware of the battle between the Old Covenant and the New Covenant which began in Acts chapter 15. That battle continues to the present time. During most of that time period the Judaisers have won the day.

New Covenant Whole Gospel:


Let us now share the Old Testament Gospel found below with the whole world. On the road to Emmaus He said the Old Testament is about Him.

He is the very Word of God in John 1:1, 14. Awaken Church to this truth.


Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

Jer 31:32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by

husband unto them, saith the LORD:

Jer 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

Jer 31:34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.


Is the most important genealogy in the Bible found in Matthew 1:1 (Gal. 3:16)? Is God's Son the ultimate fulfillment of Israel (John 1:49)? Why has the modern Church done a pitiful job of sharing the Gospel with modern Orthodox Jews? Why would someone tell them they are God's chosen people and then fail to share the Gospel with them? Who is the seed of the woman promised in Genesis 3:15? Who is the "son" in Psalm 2? Who is the "suffering servant" of Isaiah 53? Who would fulfill the New Covenant promised in Jeremiah 31:31-34? Who would fulfill the timeline of Daniel chapter 9 before the second temple was destroyed? Why have we not heard this simple Old Testament Gospel preached on Christian television in the United States on a regular basis?


Once a person comes to understand the New Covenant promised to Israel and Judah in Jeremiah 31:31-34, which is found fulfilled by Christ during the first century in Hebrews 8:6-13, and Hebrews 10:16-18, and specifically applied to the Church in 2 Corinthians 3:6-8, and Hebrews 12:22-24, man-made Bible doctrines fall apart.


Let us now learn to preach the whole Gospel until He comes back. The King of Israel is risen from the dead! (John 1:49, Acts 2:36)


Watch the YouTube videos “The New Covenant” by Bob George, and David H.J. Gay.

=========================

Which baptism is a part of the salvation process, based on what the Bible says?

What did Peter say below?


Acts 11:15 And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning.

Acts 11:16 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost.

Act 11:17 Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as he did unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God?


Based on Luke 3:16, and John 1:33, and Acts 11:15-16, the most important thing about the word "baptize" in the New Testament has nothing to do with water. The Holy Spirit is the master teacher promised to New Covenant believers in Jeremiah 31:34, and John 14:26, and is found fulfilled in Ephesians 1:13, and 1 John 2:27. Unfortunately, many modern Christians see water when they read the word "baptize" in the text. Based on the above, what is the one baptism of our faith found in the passage below? How many times is the word "Spirit" found in the passage, and how many times is the word "water" found in the passage?


Eph 4:1 I therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you that ye walk worthy of the vocation wherewith ye are called,

Eph 4:2 With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love;

Eph 4:3 Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.

Eph 4:4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;

Eph 4:5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,


“baptize” KJV



Mat_3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:



Mar_1:8 I indeed have baptized you with water: but he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost.



Luk_3:16 John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire:



Joh_1:26 John answered them, saying, I baptize with water: but there standeth one among you, whom ye know not;



Joh_1:33 And I knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, the same is he which baptizeth with the Holy Ghost.



1Co_1:17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.


.
There is more to the law than just the Sinai covenant. I am interested in looking at covenant theology from the covenants we find in the law. Noachide, Abraham (2 covenants ) etc.
 
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ralliann

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msortwell

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There is more to the law than just the Sinai covenant. I am interested in looking at covenant theology from the covenants we find in the law. Noachide, Abraham (2 covenants ) etc.

Although the OT is referred to in the NT as "the Law and the Prophets," you won't find "law" within the scope of either the Noahic or the Abrahamic covenant. You MAY find a sense of law within the Davidic covenant since it only promises an eternal reign to the RIGHTEOUS son of David. Of course, that righteous Son was the sinless Son of God - the One obedient to all that God the Father required of Him.
 
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ralliann

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Although the OT is referred to in the NT as "the Law and the Prophets," you won't find "law" within the scope of either the Noahic or the Abrahamic covenant. You MAY find a sense of law within the Davidic covenant since it only promises an eternal reign to the RIGHTEOUS son of David. Of course, that righteous Son was the sinless Son of God - the One obedient to all that God the Father required of Him.
I am not sure what you mean?
Abe kept law....
Gen 26:5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

Paul spoke of the law as including Genesis...

Gal 4:21 Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law?
22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.
23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.
 
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msortwell

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I am not sure what you mean?
Abe kept law....
Gen 26:5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

Why is it that you cannot see that obedience to law was never mentioned within the context of God’s declaration/description of His promises to (covenant with) Abraham. This fact is unrelated to another fact - Abraham was obedient to God.
 
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ralliann

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Why is it that you cannot see that obedience to law was never mentioned within the context of God’s declaration/description of His promises to (covenant with) Abraham. This fact is unrelated to another fact - Abraham was obedient to God.
Why do you think it impossible Abe kept the law of faith in his obedience?

 
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msortwell

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Why is it that you cannot see that obedience to law was never mentioned within the context of God’s declaration/description of His promises to (covenant with) Abraham. This fact is unrelated to another fact - Abraham was obedient to God.

Why do you think it impossible Abe kept the law of faith in his obedience?

You are deflecting. Your every assertion regarding the relationship between savings faith and the obedience of the redeemed has neither Scriptural justification or logical necessity. They are either produced in your imagination, or in the imagination of a false teacher whose poison you have decided to share.
 
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ralliann

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Although the OT is referred to in the NT as "the Law and the Prophets," you won't find "law" within the scope of either the Noahic or the Abrahamic covenant. You MAY find a sense of law within the Davidic covenant since it only promises an eternal reign to the RIGHTEOUS son of David. Of course, that righteous Son was the sinless Son of God - the One obedient to all that God the Father required of Him.
When I spoke of law I spoke of it as the 5 books of Moses.
Like Paul here..
Obviously speaking of the covenants made with Abraham
Gal 4:21 Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law?
22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.
 
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