I like this thank you, this gets more into the content of the gospel, unpacking the death burial and resurrection of Jesus
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What was Paul's outline when he unpacked the Gospel for unbelievers?
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I like this thank you, this gets more into the content of the gospel, unpacking the death burial and resurrection of Jesus
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d taylor
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No, the gospel saves no one.
If a person wants to receive God's free gift of Eternal Life (to be saved). The only object that will give Eternal Life (salvation) is faith in The Messiah (Jesus).
You search the Scriptures, for in them you think you have eternal life; and these are they which testify of Me. But you are not willing to come to Me that you may have life.
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First off: Every individual is different and is at different stags in their spiritual life. Paul’s approach seems to be different and determined by where the individual is in their spiritual growth. He definitely approaches Gentiles differently then Jews.
One “outline” will not fit all. You can ask a person by you reading the Bible, “Do you understand what you are reading” and start there to take them to Christ.
You can certainly witness to people your own change and/or people who you know in their situation who made huge changes.
You can serve out of a Godly type Love and answer their question of “why”?
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I do at least seven per week Bible Studies with nonbelievers each week and have more waiting in the wings, if I can find the time. We just read the Bible and discuss (everyone is at a different spot). I try to take a “Lacking Committed Christian”, one of the 80% you mentioned, with me; I find it harder to get these Christians then nonbelievers to study with. I prepare questions for this Christian “partner” each week for him/her to come up with questions and scripture to answer the question the reader might ask (try to answer questions with questions). The partner needs to pray and if possibly fast a day each week over the non-Christian we are studying with.
It really is not what scripture we are reading, but how we read it (with Love, searching, study [not just read], questioning, listening to their ideas, taking scripture very seriously, how we apply the scripture to our own lives and so on). What I really want is for the nonbeliever to open up about their issues, problems, challenges, desires and choices, and then show them how to find their answer in scripture. They will want to know what scripture says in the future and if we have been honest with the word and have helped them find the solution in the past (not just answer them) they will both ask and listen.
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Ok then, so why then did Paul compare his Gospel message to the Gospel message with the Apostles in Jerusalem? I do believe there had to be common message points that they all agreed to, otherwise, why have that conference in the first place. Also, Paul in Galatians was very adamant (he mentioned it twice) that if there were those who were following a different gospel than what they had received from Paul, let him be eternally accursed.
The heart of my question stems from, What were those common message points? Can we know what those common message points were? Oh to have been an Aramaic, Hebrew, Greek speaking fly on the wall for that conference!
My thought is, this is so critical, these message points, they have to be found in the bible somewhere, just where is it and what is it?
So no, I think based on this evidence, there was clearly 'A Gospel Message'. I think it centered around the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ, unpacked but I am not sure exactly what that was at this point.
The heart of my question stems from, What were those common message points? Can we know what those common message points were? Oh to have been an Aramaic, Hebrew, Greek speaking fly on the wall for that conference!
My thought is, this is so critical, these message points, they have to be found in the bible somewhere, just where is it and what is it?
So no, I think based on this evidence, there was clearly 'A Gospel Message'. I think it centered around the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ, unpacked but I am not sure exactly what that was at this point.
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Excellent, excellent, excellent . . . I am reflecting on your post and will respond in greater deal. This is what I'm talking about!
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Ok, one outline may not fit all, but we do know what Paul did . . . he resolved to nothing but Jesus and he somehow must have unpacked the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus to his charge.
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The Gospel may not save someone per se (parsing words I think), but it is the power of salvation (Rom 1:16-17). Without the Gospel you can't be saved . . . but who is parsing literal here?
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Ok, i like your point 4 a great deal. Do you think the Apostle Paul unpacked the Death, Burial, and Resurrection in greater detail rather than just mentioning it? If so, what was that unpacking?
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Knowing Jesus and believing in Jesus are two completely different things. As I said in an earlier post, you can believe I own a red truck but not know it for sure. We have many people who believe in Jesus but do not know him to the point of loving him and obeying him - Luke 9:23.
Belief is easy . . . . following Jesus and imitating God is not as easy as belief. We need to know Jesus and love Jesus to give us the strength to obey him to the point of sanctification.
Back to my question. The four spiritual laws can produce belief . . . but in a shotgun wedding, do you really know the bride-groom? What was it that Paul shared that turned the world upside down in getting people to take up their crosses so willingly and seriously?
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OK. I always either start with an issue the nonbeliever is having and address that issue with scripture, but we always get back to one of the Gospels, usually Luke to begin with. It is Jesus Christ and Him crucified, so it is not just the death, burial and resurrection. I want the nonbeliever to meet, know, and at least get to like Jesus, whom I Love and Love to discuss. If I can just show them Christ living in and through me, then it is not just words, but Christ Himself they fall in Love with. I have to Love on them, really allow Christ to Love on them, like Christ Loved on his disciples. Listen to them, mentor them, teach them, correct them in Love, be with them, be an example of a helper before them and help them (even wash their feet [dishes] when they are tired). The “message” is not only words, it is the person, Christ. I am not trying to make “converts” to Christianity, but make disciples (learners, students and mentors themselves of others). Many times, I witnessed a student becoming a disciple rapidly growing right past me, they want me to go with them teaching their friends and family, but I have to pair them with one of my “Old Christian” helpers, but they always seem to take the lead.
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klutedavid
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The common message was very simple.
Galatians 3:1-5
You foolish Galatians, who has bewitched you, before whose eyes Jesus Christ was publicly portrayed as crucified? This is the only thing I want to find out from you: did you receive the Spirit by the works of the Law, or by hearing with faith? Are you so foolish? Having begun by the Spirit, are you now being perfected by the flesh? Did you suffer so many things in vain—if indeed it was in vain? So then, does He who provides you with the Spirit and works miracles among you, do it by the works of the Law, or by hearing with faith?
Hearing what with faith?
How does a person receive the Holy Spirit?
The Gentiles began believing, living their Christian lives after hearing what?
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Precisely . . . hearing what? The Gospel. What was the exact Gospel that they heard from Paul . . . or can we only get a close approximation thereof from the scriptures. Does the Holy Spirit want us to know what that Gospel was precisely (hence the conference in Jerusalem?) or a close approximation thereof?
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klutedavid
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The gospel is very simple and always has been.
1 Corinthians 2:1-2
And when I came to you, brethren, I did not come with superiority of speech or of wisdom, proclaiming to you the testimony of God. For I determined to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ, and Him crucified.
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Nobody can believe in Christ by seeing Christ in somebody.
The darkness does not comprehend the light.....
John 1:5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
John 3:19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
In fact, everything anyone says here on the forum, every single word from anyone, is either light or darkness, and the blind leaders of the blind both fall into the ditch....
Luke 6:39 And he spake a parable unto them, Can the blind lead the blind? shall they not both fall into the ditch?
40 The disciple is not above his master: but every one that is perfect shall be as his master.
Matthew 15:14 Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.
Your house is all you want to be lit up, it does not matter that all outside and everywhere around you is darkness, as that is normal, as long as your house is lit up to see everywhere you need to go, and in the day time, all is lit up for you and for everybody, but again, darkness ( those in darkness) does not perceive that....
John 11:9 Jesus answered, Are there not twelve hours in the day? If any man walk in the day, he stumbleth not, because he seeth the light of this world.
10 But if a man walk in the night, he stumbleth, because there is no light in him.
2 Corinthians 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
The meek inherit the earth, if we look around in this world right now for example ( as I look around for understanding) we see how many wars and fighting are going on, how they continue on for many years, how world wars not too far ago, show mankind is not meek, mankind kills one another, hates one another.
What occured was development, prosperity, and another focus on hurting others, by gaining and extracting all one can in this world for themselves, and because of that, less wars occured in the developed/developing world, but man that is greedy for gain, is not meek, meek is as Christ, on the donkey, that kind of a King, lowly and with nowhere to lay His head.
Pay close attention ( I wont be telling this testimony again I think)
The devil has all the worlds prosperity delivered to Him ( from God) and gives to who he chooses ( the devil chooses the opposite to the meek and chooses the most prideful and vain and most greedy to give the wealth to)
The love of the money the devil gives this worlds most corrupt, is them coveting the root of all evil ( that the devil gives them to covet after) which is the erring from the faith and is the sorrows to come by receiving the consolation prize. The perverse disputings of men that have erred from the faith, suppose that their gain was godliness, they are corrupt and are destitute of the truth that blessed are the poor ( the poor and meek)....
Luke 4:6 And the devil said unto him, All this power will I give thee, and the glory of them: for that is delivered unto me; and to whomsoever I will I give it.
Luke 6:20 And he lifted up his eyes on his disciples, and said, Blessed be ye poor: for yours is the kingdom of God.
Luke 6:24 But woe unto you that are rich! for ye have received your consolation.
1 Timothy 6:10 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.
1 Timothy 6:5 Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself.
Just as the devil had all delivered to him to corrupt mankind with ( to err from the faith and to be disputers thinking their gains are godliness) so to the Son ( of God) all things are delivered to Him of His Father, who no man knows, but the Son, and then to whosoever the Son will reveal Him ( to save them from that corruption, of lies and deception, of exaltation and of the pride of the devil who is the father and king to all children of pride, and Jesus Christ is King to all children of meekness and the poor of Spirit)...
Matthew 11:27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.
Job 41:34 He beholdeth all high things: he is a king over all the children of pride.
That by the way is the Gospel, that nobody ever discusses on this forum, on any forum, in any Christian discussion in this entire world, which is how the poor have the Gospel preached to them ( this is to the meek, who are the poor) and they hear the message, as the message is to them, and they join Jesus their Lord and Shepherd, where He was and is, sitting the lowest, being made the last, and the least, to know what and who, the greatest is, ( Jesus shall show who is the blessed and only ruler, the King of kings and Lord of lords)...
Luke 14:10 But when thou art bidden, go and sit down in the lowest room; that when he that bade thee cometh, he may say unto thee, Friend, go up higher: then shalt thou have worship in the presence of them that sit at meat with thee.
Matthew 13:32 Which indeed is the least of all seeds: but when it is grown, it is the greatest among herbs, and becometh a tree, so that the birds of the air come and lodge in the branches thereof.
Luke 9:48 And said unto them, Whosoever shall receive this child in my name receiveth me: and whosoever shall receive me receiveth him that sent me: for he that is least among you all, the same shall be great.
1 Timothy 6:15 Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords;
Imagine again like lighting your house, and you choose the least, the lights that use the least amount of electricity, to be the energy saving, conserving choice, to then light up that house with wisdom and care. This is how God chooses His little ones too, to shine as lights, being the least esteemed, but to God the ones who shine the truest. Jesus Christ was the rejected one, the light of life that this world hated and snuffed out. But being anointed of God He was to be the very opposite to the Pharisees, who all highly esteemed before men, were abomination in the sight of God, and the Son of God had to be the one they did not want, and a murderer instead was the choice of man, who is that darkness and not the poor of the flock....
Luke 7:22 Then Jesus answering said unto them, Go your way, and tell John what things ye have seen and heard; how that the blind see, the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, to the poor the gospel is preached.
Isaiah 29:19 The meek also shall increase their joy in the Lord, and the poor among men shall rejoice in the Holy One of Israel.
Zechariah 11:11 And it was broken in that day: and so the poor of the flock that waited upon me knew that it was the word of the Lord.
Philippians 2:15 That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;
16 Holding forth the word of life; that I may rejoice in the day of Christ, that I have not run in vain, neither laboured in vain.
Hebrews 7:26 For such an high priest became us, who is holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners, and made higher than the heavens;
Does anyone here, hear what is said here, to begin to learn of the meekness of Christ, or is that only to the meek....
Matthew 11:29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
Matthew 21:5 Tell ye the daughter of Sion, Behold, thy King cometh unto thee, meek, and sitting upon an ass, and a colt the foal of an ass.
The darkness does not comprehend the light.....
John 1:5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
John 3:19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
In fact, everything anyone says here on the forum, every single word from anyone, is either light or darkness, and the blind leaders of the blind both fall into the ditch....
Luke 6:39 And he spake a parable unto them, Can the blind lead the blind? shall they not both fall into the ditch?
40 The disciple is not above his master: but every one that is perfect shall be as his master.
Matthew 15:14 Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.
Your house is all you want to be lit up, it does not matter that all outside and everywhere around you is darkness, as that is normal, as long as your house is lit up to see everywhere you need to go, and in the day time, all is lit up for you and for everybody, but again, darkness ( those in darkness) does not perceive that....
John 11:9 Jesus answered, Are there not twelve hours in the day? If any man walk in the day, he stumbleth not, because he seeth the light of this world.
10 But if a man walk in the night, he stumbleth, because there is no light in him.
2 Corinthians 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
The meek inherit the earth, if we look around in this world right now for example ( as I look around for understanding) we see how many wars and fighting are going on, how they continue on for many years, how world wars not too far ago, show mankind is not meek, mankind kills one another, hates one another.
What occured was development, prosperity, and another focus on hurting others, by gaining and extracting all one can in this world for themselves, and because of that, less wars occured in the developed/developing world, but man that is greedy for gain, is not meek, meek is as Christ, on the donkey, that kind of a King, lowly and with nowhere to lay His head.
Pay close attention ( I wont be telling this testimony again I think)
The devil has all the worlds prosperity delivered to Him ( from God) and gives to who he chooses ( the devil chooses the opposite to the meek and chooses the most prideful and vain and most greedy to give the wealth to)
The love of the money the devil gives this worlds most corrupt, is them coveting the root of all evil ( that the devil gives them to covet after) which is the erring from the faith and is the sorrows to come by receiving the consolation prize. The perverse disputings of men that have erred from the faith, suppose that their gain was godliness, they are corrupt and are destitute of the truth that blessed are the poor ( the poor and meek)....
Luke 4:6 And the devil said unto him, All this power will I give thee, and the glory of them: for that is delivered unto me; and to whomsoever I will I give it.
Luke 6:20 And he lifted up his eyes on his disciples, and said, Blessed be ye poor: for yours is the kingdom of God.
Luke 6:24 But woe unto you that are rich! for ye have received your consolation.
1 Timothy 6:10 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.
1 Timothy 6:5 Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself.
Just as the devil had all delivered to him to corrupt mankind with ( to err from the faith and to be disputers thinking their gains are godliness) so to the Son ( of God) all things are delivered to Him of His Father, who no man knows, but the Son, and then to whosoever the Son will reveal Him ( to save them from that corruption, of lies and deception, of exaltation and of the pride of the devil who is the father and king to all children of pride, and Jesus Christ is King to all children of meekness and the poor of Spirit)...
Matthew 11:27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.
Job 41:34 He beholdeth all high things: he is a king over all the children of pride.
That by the way is the Gospel, that nobody ever discusses on this forum, on any forum, in any Christian discussion in this entire world, which is how the poor have the Gospel preached to them ( this is to the meek, who are the poor) and they hear the message, as the message is to them, and they join Jesus their Lord and Shepherd, where He was and is, sitting the lowest, being made the last, and the least, to know what and who, the greatest is, ( Jesus shall show who is the blessed and only ruler, the King of kings and Lord of lords)...
Luke 14:10 But when thou art bidden, go and sit down in the lowest room; that when he that bade thee cometh, he may say unto thee, Friend, go up higher: then shalt thou have worship in the presence of them that sit at meat with thee.
Matthew 13:32 Which indeed is the least of all seeds: but when it is grown, it is the greatest among herbs, and becometh a tree, so that the birds of the air come and lodge in the branches thereof.
Luke 9:48 And said unto them, Whosoever shall receive this child in my name receiveth me: and whosoever shall receive me receiveth him that sent me: for he that is least among you all, the same shall be great.
1 Timothy 6:15 Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords;
Imagine again like lighting your house, and you choose the least, the lights that use the least amount of electricity, to be the energy saving, conserving choice, to then light up that house with wisdom and care. This is how God chooses His little ones too, to shine as lights, being the least esteemed, but to God the ones who shine the truest. Jesus Christ was the rejected one, the light of life that this world hated and snuffed out. But being anointed of God He was to be the very opposite to the Pharisees, who all highly esteemed before men, were abomination in the sight of God, and the Son of God had to be the one they did not want, and a murderer instead was the choice of man, who is that darkness and not the poor of the flock....
Luke 7:22 Then Jesus answering said unto them, Go your way, and tell John what things ye have seen and heard; how that the blind see, the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, to the poor the gospel is preached.
Isaiah 29:19 The meek also shall increase their joy in the Lord, and the poor among men shall rejoice in the Holy One of Israel.
Zechariah 11:11 And it was broken in that day: and so the poor of the flock that waited upon me knew that it was the word of the Lord.
Philippians 2:15 That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;
16 Holding forth the word of life; that I may rejoice in the day of Christ, that I have not run in vain, neither laboured in vain.
Hebrews 7:26 For such an high priest became us, who is holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners, and made higher than the heavens;
Does anyone here, hear what is said here, to begin to learn of the meekness of Christ, or is that only to the meek....
Matthew 11:29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
Matthew 21:5 Tell ye the daughter of Sion, Behold, thy King cometh unto thee, meek, and sitting upon an ass, and a colt the foal of an ass.
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Why did God choose you to be saved and not your neighbor? Are you saying it is totally arbitrary?
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