Why does God make life complicated?

Unofficial Reverand Alex · Oct 14, 2020

"This is how the birth of Jesus the Messiah came about: His mother Mary was pledged to be married to Joseph, but before they came together, she was found to be pregnant through the Holy Spirit. Because Joseph her husband was faithful to the law, and yet did not want to expose her to public disgrace, he had in mind to divorce her quietly.

But after he had considered this, an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream and said, “Joseph son of David, do not be afraid to take Mary home as your wife, because what is conceived in her is from the Holy Spirit. She will give birth to a son, and you are to give him the name Jesus, because he will save his people from their sins.” --Matthew 1

This is the beginning of the narrative of the Gospel of Matthew, and a section that many of us are used to hearing every year around Christmas time. Yet as I keep looking back at this, as my Bible for some reason keeps showing me the section when I just open it randomly, more and more of it frustrates me. Why couldn't the Spirit tell Joseph what was going on ahead of time? Why not wait until after they're married? I imagine there was a lot of gossip among the neighbors about this "illegitimate child", gossip that could've been kept at bay if God had waited a bit longer before becoming incarnate in the womb. Starting off their marriage with suspicions of adultery doesn't sound very nice. Why would God bring about His Son in such a messy way?

This is only 1 of countless examples of things being more complicated than they have to be. I'm sure you can imagine several off the top of your head that God could've made so much simpler, but didn't, without giving an explanation. Why?

I put this in the for for any religions, and I would appreciate this just being people who believe in a god, or at least are willing to entertain the idea for sake of this discussion. I'm wanting to approach this from a theistic standpoint, believing that there is a good God behind all this. From this context is where I want this discussed. Thank you & may God bless this conversation & everyone here! :pray:

Basil the Great · Oct 14, 2020

As to your question, I am reminded of a tv story a few years about a retired cop who became a Catholic priest. His view was that life is a test for all of us. It is a test to determine where we will go after death. I essentially agree with his analysis. God apparently wants us all to experience a variety of difficulties in this life, to see how we will respond.

bèlla · Oct 14, 2020

I thought along similar lines about the Garden of Eden and the trees. Then I decided to cut to the chase. What I really want to know is why he's here? He's wreaked havoc and caused all sorts of calamity. I don't think it's a bad question.

Life would be profoundly easier if Satan was gone. And his minions. Let us live in peace.

Yours in His Service,

~Bella

Aabbie James · Oct 14, 2020

Unofficial Reverand Alex said:
"This is how the birth of Jesus the Messiah came about: His mother Mary was pledged to be married to Joseph, but before they came together, she was found to be pregnant through the Holy Spirit. Because Joseph her husband was faithful to the law, and yet did not want to expose her to public disgrace, he had in mind to divorce her quietly.

But after he had considered this, an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream and said, “Joseph son of David, do not be afraid to take Mary home as your wife, because what is conceived in her is from the Holy Spirit. She will give birth to a son, and you are to give him the name Jesus, because he will save his people from their sins.” --Matthew 1

This is the beginning of the narrative of the Gospel of Matthew, and a section that many of us are used to hearing every year around Christmas time. Yet as I keep looking back at this, as my Bible for some reason keeps showing me the section when I just open it randomly, more and more of it frustrates me. Why couldn't the Spirit tell Joseph what was going on ahead of time? Why not wait until after they're married? I imagine there was a lot of gossip among the neighbors about this "illegitimate child", gossip that could've been kept at bay if God had waited a bit longer before becoming incarnate in the womb. Starting off their marriage with suspicions of adultery doesn't sound very nice. Why would God bring about His Son in such a messy way?

This is only 1 of countless examples of things being more complicated than they have to be. I'm sure you can imagine several off the top of your head that God could've made so much simpler, but didn't, without giving an explanation. Why?

I put this in the for for any religions, and I would appreciate this just being people who believe in a god, or at least are willing to entertain the idea for sake of this discussion. I'm wanting to approach this from a theistic standpoint, believing that there is a good God behind all this. From this context is where I want this discussed. Thank you & may God bless this conversation & everyone here!

In perfect wisdom and might, the LORD moves all creatures and events to accomplish His sovereign purpose.

Satan, on the other hand, is always looking for new ways to attack the virgin birth.

SeventyOne · Oct 14, 2020

Unofficial Reverand Alex said:
"This is how the birth of Jesus the Messiah came about: His mother Mary was pledged to be married to Joseph, but before they came together, she was found to be pregnant through the Holy Spirit. Because Joseph her husband was faithful to the law, and yet did not want to expose her to public disgrace, he had in mind to divorce her quietly.

But after he had considered this, an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream and said, “Joseph son of David, do not be afraid to take Mary home as your wife, because what is conceived in her is from the Holy Spirit. She will give birth to a son, and you are to give him the name Jesus, because he will save his people from their sins.” --Matthew 1

This is the beginning of the narrative of the Gospel of Matthew, and a section that many of us are used to hearing every year around Christmas time. Yet as I keep looking back at this, as my Bible for some reason keeps showing me the section when I just open it randomly, more and more of it frustrates me. Why couldn't the Spirit tell Joseph what was going on ahead of time? Why not wait until after they're married? I imagine there was a lot of gossip among the neighbors about this "illegitimate child", gossip that could've been kept at bay if God had waited a bit longer before becoming incarnate in the womb. Starting off their marriage with suspicions of adultery doesn't sound very nice. Why would God bring about His Son in such a messy way?

This is only 1 of countless examples of things being more complicated than they have to be. I'm sure you can imagine several off the top of your head that God could've made so much simpler, but didn't, without giving an explanation. Why?

I put this in the for for any religions, and I would appreciate this just being people who believe in a god, or at least are willing to entertain the idea for sake of this discussion. I'm wanting to approach this from a theistic standpoint, believing that there is a good God behind all this. From this context is where I want this discussed. Thank you & may God bless this conversation & everyone here!

If God had waited until after the marriage, Mary would have no longer been a virgin. And I'm also sure there was a lot of gossip since the Pharisee's accused Jesus of being illigitimate in John 8:41. He was the 'man of sorrows' after all. Don't worry, His next coming won't be quite as messy (from a certain point of view).

jacks · Oct 14, 2020

Complicated things teach us all kinds of lessons and make life interesting. If everything was simple and just handed to us I don't think we would appreciate things as much and wouldn't grow through the experience. We are like children and have many lessons to learn.

Robban · Oct 14, 2020

Unofficial Reverand Alex said:
"This is how the birth of Jesus the Messiah came about: His mother Mary was pledged to be married to Joseph, but before they came together, she was found to be pregnant through the Holy Spirit. Because Joseph her husband was faithful to the law, and yet did not want to expose her to public disgrace, he had in mind to divorce her quietly.

But after he had considered this, an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream and said, “Joseph son of David, do not be afraid to take Mary home as your wife, because what is conceived in her is from the Holy Spirit. She will give birth to a son, and you are to give him the name Jesus, because he will save his people from their sins.” --Matthew 1

This is the beginning of the narrative of the Gospel of Matthew, and a section that many of us are used to hearing every year around Christmas time. Yet as I keep looking back at this, as my Bible for some reason keeps showing me the section when I just open it randomly, more and more of it frustrates me. Why couldn't the Spirit tell Joseph what was going on ahead of time? Why not wait until after they're married? I imagine there was a lot of gossip among the neighbors about this "illegitimate child", gossip that could've been kept at bay if God had waited a bit longer before becoming incarnate in the womb. Starting off their marriage with suspicions of adultery doesn't sound very nice. Why would God bring about His Son in such a messy way?

This is only 1 of countless examples of things being more complicated than they have to be. I'm sure you can imagine several off the top of your head that God could've made so much simpler, but didn't, without giving an explanation. Why?

I put this in the for for any religions, and I would appreciate this just being people who believe in a god, or at least are willing to entertain the idea for sake of this discussion. I'm wanting to approach this from a theistic standpoint, believing that there is a good God behind all this. From this context is where I want this discussed. Thank you & may God bless this conversation & everyone here!

Could well be there is more to it than meets the eye.
A lot more.

The first 28 years of Davids life he was treated as a bastard an outcast, in his own family until his mother broke the silence when the Prophet Samuel came to annoint him as King.

Broke the silence with,
the stone the builders rejected.

God does not do things identically the same.

Mary told no one for a few months until she went to visit Elizabeth.

If the barren Sarah can give birth at the age of ninety.

What is impossible for the Master of the universe?

Robban · Oct 14, 2020

Robban said:
Could well be there is more to it than meets the eye.
A lot more.

The first 28 years of Davids life he was treated as a bastard an outcast, in his own family until his mother broke the silence when the Prophet Samuel came to annoint him as King.

Broke the silence with,
the stone the builders rejected.

God does not do things identically the same.

Mary told no one for a few months until she went to visit Elizabeth.

If the barren Sarah can give birth at the age of ninety.

What is impossible for the Master of the universe?

One Psalm tells,

"I shall not cause dissapointment to David."

And the following song tells,

"the son of Yishai exists forever"

Rajni · Oct 14, 2020

jacks said:
Complicated things teach us all kinds of lessons and make life interesting. If everything was simple and just handed to us I don't think we would appreciate things as much and wouldn't grow through the experience. We are like children and have many lessons to learn.

This is how I see it, now.

Going to the fitness-center would be so much easier if there weren't any treadmills or weightlifting equipment to deal with. But that's not what fitness-centers are for. This world is similar to a fitness-center, in my view. And I believe I voluntarily signed up to be a member (God didn't just throw me in here without my consent like a strawberry into a blender). The only downside to my view is that I never have the luxury of shaking my fist at God and feeling like a victim when challenges arise. Woe is me.

AV1611VET · Oct 15, 2020

Unofficial Reverand Alex said:
Why couldn't the Spirit tell Joseph what was going on ahead of time? Why not wait until after they're married?

Which is it?

Did you want the angel to tell Joseph ahead of time? or did you want the angel to wait until after they were married?

Unofficial Reverand Alex · Oct 15, 2020

AV1611VET said:
Which is it?

Did you want the angel to tell Joseph ahead of time? or did you want the angel to wait until after they were married?

Why do these seem contradictory? "Joseph, this is going to happen after you're married. Don't worry, God has a plan."

AV1611VET · Oct 15, 2020

Unofficial Reverand Alex said:
Why do these seem contradictory? "Joseph, this is going to happen after you're married. Don't worry, God has a plan."

No offense, Alex, I don't know what it is you're complaining about.

BNR32FAN · Oct 15, 2020

Unofficial Reverand Alex said:
"This is how the birth of Jesus the Messiah came about: His mother Mary was pledged to be married to Joseph, but before they came together, she was found to be pregnant through the Holy Spirit. Because Joseph her husband was faithful to the law, and yet did not want to expose her to public disgrace, he had in mind to divorce her quietly.

But after he had considered this, an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream and said, “Joseph son of David, do not be afraid to take Mary home as your wife, because what is conceived in her is from the Holy Spirit. She will give birth to a son, and you are to give him the name Jesus, because he will save his people from their sins.” --Matthew 1

This is the beginning of the narrative of the Gospel of Matthew, and a section that many of us are used to hearing every year around Christmas time. Yet as I keep looking back at this, as my Bible for some reason keeps showing me the section when I just open it randomly, more and more of it frustrates me. Why couldn't the Spirit tell Joseph what was going on ahead of time? Why not wait until after they're married? I imagine there was a lot of gossip among the neighbors about this "illegitimate child", gossip that could've been kept at bay if God had waited a bit longer before becoming incarnate in the womb. Starting off their marriage with suspicions of adultery doesn't sound very nice. Why would God bring about His Son in such a messy way?

This is only 1 of countless examples of things being more complicated than they have to be. I'm sure you can imagine several off the top of your head that God could've made so much simpler, but didn't, without giving an explanation. Why?

I put this in the for for any religions, and I would appreciate this just being people who believe in a god, or at least are willing to entertain the idea for sake of this discussion. I'm wanting to approach this from a theistic standpoint, believing that there is a good God behind all this. From this context is where I want this discussed. Thank you & may God bless this conversation & everyone here!

Because the prophecy was that Jesus would be born from a virgin. When a Jew gets married the woman has to testify as to whether or not she is a virgin before they get married. If Mary had said she was a virgin and yet she was pregnant at the time of her marriage she would’ve been stoned to death. If Jesus was born after their marriage no one would’ve believed that He fulfilled the prophecy.

Robban · Oct 15, 2020

Someone came up with a quote, do not know who but it is probably well known.

"Truth is stranger than fiction,

fiction has to make sense."

Maybe something in that.

Unofficial Reverand Alex · Oct 15, 2020

AV1611VET said:
No offense, Alex, I don't know what it is you're complaining about.

That's alright, none taken. Even if we just step aside from this specific example, I'm sure you can think of times in your life when God could've made something much simpler, easier, less stressful, etc. Why didn't He? That's really the idea I'm trying to get at.

Thank you for your responses, by the way. I know things don't always land as I intend; communication is trickier than we make it out to be.

AV1611VET · Oct 15, 2020

Unofficial Reverand Alex said:
That's alright, none taken. Even if we just step aside from this specific example, I'm sure you can think of times in your life when God could've made something much simpler, easier, less stressful, etc. Why didn't He? That's really the idea I'm trying to get at.

Thank you for your responses, by the way. I know things don't always land as I intend; communication is trickier than we make it out to be.

Not a problem, my friend! I pray you find the answers to your questions!

Unofficial Reverand Alex · Oct 15, 2020

AV1611VET said:
Not a problem, my friend! I pray you find the answers to your questions!

Me too!

chunkofcoal · Oct 19, 2020

Unofficial Reverand Alex said:
This is only 1 of countless examples of things being more complicated than they have to be. I'm sure you can imagine several off the top of your head that God could've made so much simpler, but didn't, without giving an explanation. Why?

Yesterday I was reading another discussion on another section of the forum and wondered why it had to be so complicated. Then I found this thread, too!

But, this morning I'm up thinking about this:
Pro 25:2 It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter.

How that idea sets with people probably varies from person to person, but for me I'm letting it simmer in my mind and heart and doing a little studying.

Why does God make life complicated?

Pray in silence...God speaks softly

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