Down under the law

Soyeong said:

1.) To be under the law means to be obligated to obey it.

2.) In Galatians 4:5, it does not say what those under the law needed to be redeemed from, only that Jesus was sent to redeem those under the law. God's law is holy, righteous, and good, and was graciously given as a precious gift for our own good in order to bless us and teach us about who God is, how to walk in His ways, and how to grow in a relationship with Him, so those under the law have no need to be redeemed from the law, but rather we had the need to be redeemed from our lawlessness. In Titus 2:14, it does not say that Jesus gave himself to redeem us from the law, but in order to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own possession who are zealous for doing good work, so if we believe in what he accomplished on the cross, then we will become zealous for doing good works in obedience to God's law (Acts 21:20) and will not return to the lawlessness that Jesus gave himself to redeem us from.

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Galatians 3:12
However, the Law is not of faith...

Word and Spirit said:

The Ten Commandments are passing away. The Law of the Spirit is much more glorious.

2 Corinthians 3:7-11
7 But if the ministry of death, written and engraved on stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of the glory of his countenance, which glory was passing away, 8 how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious? 9 For if the ministry of condemnation had glory, the ministry of righteousness exceeds much more in glory. 10 For even what was made glorious had no glory in this respect, because of the glory that excels. 11 For if what is passing away was glorious, what remains is much more glorious.

The Ten Commandments had to be kept by sinful flesh, thus are represented by Ishmael - Abraham's son of the flesh. Jesus is the promised Seed of Abraham, and His commandments of loving one another and believing in Him is represented by Abrahams promised son, Isaac. Galatians 4:22-31

21 Tell me, you who desire to be under the law, do you not hear the law? 22 For it is written that Abraham had two sons: the one by a bondwoman, the other by a freewoman. 23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born according to the flesh, and he of the freewoman through promise, 24 which things are symbolic. For these are the two covenants: the one from Mount Sinai which gives birth to bondage, which is Hagar— 25 for this Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia, and corresponds to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children— 26 but the Jerusalem above is free, which is the mother of us all. 27 For it is written:

“Rejoice, O barren,
You who do not bear!
Break forth and shout,
You who are not in labor!
For the desolate has many more children
Than she who has a husband.”

28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are children of promise. 29 But, as he who was born according to the flesh then persecuted him who was born according to the Spirit, even so it is now. 30 Nevertheless what does the Scripture say? “Cast out the bondwoman and her son, for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.” 31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman but of the free.

The true "commandments of God" are to LOVE God with all your strength, mind and body and to LOVE your neighbor as yourself. Do this and you won't have to be taught what NOT TO DO. Love and you are not under the law.

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You need to be a little more precise.

1 John 3:23-24
This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us. The one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him.

1 John 4:21
And this commandment we have from Him, that the one who loves God should love his brother also.

1 John 5:2
By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and observe His commandments.

John 13:34
A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another, even as I have loved you, that you also love one another.

Hello dear friend and welcome here.

Word and Spirit said:

The Ten Commandments are passing away.

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Perhaps you mean old covenant? There is nowhere in the bible that says that God's 10 commandments pass away or are abolished. In the new covenant God's 10 commandments give us the knowledge of right and wrong, good and evil, sin and righteousness *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4 and if we break anyone of them we stand guilty before God of sin *JAMES 2:10-11. Perhaps dear friend your mixing up the shadow laws in ordinances from the Mosaic book of the law for remission of sins from the old covenant (blood offerings, burn't offerings, animal sacrifices) *HEBREWS 10:1-31 which were shadows of things to come.

to be continued..

Word and Spirit said:

The Law of the Spirit is much more glorious. 2 Corinthians 3:7-11 7....

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No one has God's Spirit if they do not believe what God's Word says and follows it. According to the scriptures no one has God's Spirit by living in known unrepentant sin (breaking anyone of God's 10 commandments). Sin is the difference between the children of God and the children of the devil *1 JOHN 3:6-10.

2 CORINTHIANS 3 is in relation to the old and the new covenants. It is not saying God's 10 commandments are abolished as these are a part of God's eternal law that gives us the knowledge of good and evil in the new covenant *ROMANS 3:20 etc.. and only a part of what made up the old covenant. It is the shadow laws that pointed to JESUS as God's lamb, the Sanctuary services and laws in ordinances that point to the work of JESUS in the heavenly Sanctuary of which the earthly was only a copy (see HEBREWS 7; HEBREWS 8; HEBREWS 9 and HEBREWS 10).

Let's look at the context of 2 CORINTHIANS 2 which is talking about the new covenant...

2 CORINTHIANS 3:1-14
[1], Do we begin again to commend ourselves? or need we, as some others, letters of commendation to you, or letters of commendation from you?
[2], you are our letter written in our hearts, known and read of all men:
[3], For as much as you are manifestly declared to be the letter of Christ ministered by us, WRITTEN NOT WITH INK, BUT WITH THE SPIRIT OF THE LIVING GOD; NOT IN TABLES OF STONE, BUT IN FLESHY TABLES OF THE HEART.

Note: in [v3] that Paul is stating that the Corinthians here are letters of Christ ministered by Paul and his companions “written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone (reference to the 10 commandments) but IN the fleshly tables of the HEART! Pauls reference here is to Gods new covenant promise of JEREMIASH 31:31-34 repeated by Paul in HEBREWS 8:10-12 [10], FOR THIS IS THE COVENANT that i will make with the house of israel after those days, said the lord; I WILL PUT MY LAWS INTO THEIR MIND, AND WRITE THEM IN THEIR HEARTS: and I will be to them a god, and they shall be to me a people.

So the context here is the ministration (Paul and his companions being the ministers) of the new covenant Gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ of which the Corinthians are examples who have been given a new heart to love God and walk in his commandments which is the new covenant promise of JEREMIAH 31:31-34 repeated by Paul in HEBREWS 8:10-12 and HEBREWS 10:15-17.

[4], And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward:
[5], Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God.
[6], WHO ALSO HAS MADE US ABLE MINISTERS OF THE NEW COVENANT; NOT OF THE LETTER, BUT OF THE SPIRIT: FOR THE LETTER KILLS, BUT THE SPIRIT GIVES LIFE.

Note: in [6] the context are repeated from [v3] that is that Paul and his companions were the MINISTERS of the NEW COVENANT. “NOT OF THE LETTER OF THE LAW BUT OF THE SPIRIT; FOR THE LETTER KILLS BUT THE SPIRIT GIVES LIFE”.

Note: no where here does [v6] teach that God’s law is abolished. It simply states that “the letter killeth” that is the letter of the law gives us a knowledge of what sin is *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4 when God’s 10 commandments are broken and the penalty of sin is death *ROMANS 6:21-23; ROMANS 8:13 but it is not able to save us from sin and change our hearts to love and follow God.

Note: in [v6] continued “FOR THE LETTER KILLS BUT THE SPIRIT GIVETH LIFE” reference to the new covenant promise of JEREMIAH 31:31-34; HEBREWS 8:10-12 and HEBREWS 10:15-17. The Jews had the letter of the law but did not have the Spirit of the law. JESUS said to the Jews that “unless your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and pharisees, you shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven” *MATTHEW 5:20; MATTHEW 23:13. The Scribes and Pharisees had the letter of the law but not the Spirit of the law. They had the outward appearance as to what the law required but not the change of heart that the new covenant promised *JEREMIAH 31:31-34; HEBREWS 8:10-12; HEBREWS 10:15-17. “THE LETTER KILLS BUT THE SPIRIT GIVETH LIFE”. They had the letter or outward forms and ceremonies but were not born again *JOHN 3:3-7; 1 JOHN 3:6-9 by the Spirit to love through a change of heart by the Spirit that brings life. On the OUTSIDE the Scribes and Pharisees appeared righteous to men but inwardly they were breaking God’s law and were full of dead mans bones *MATTHEW 23:25:28.

JESUS came to magnify the LAW from the INSIDE OUT quoting MATTHEW 5:17-32 (thoughts and feelings) in fulfillment of *ISAIAH 42:21. This is to show that unless our RIGHTOUESNESS EXCEEDS the RIGHTOUESNESS of the Scribes and Pharisees we can in no way enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN. Jesus is saying the problem runs deeper then outward observance to the 10 Commandments. EVIL begins in the HEART. BREAKING GOD's 10 COMMANDMENTS from the heart defile a man *MATTHEW 15:18-19. JESUS is saying we can be outwardly perfect and blameless like the Scribes and Pharisee but inwardly like dead mans bones *MATTHEW 23:27-28.

JESUS magnified the LAW to the INSIDE OUT. To show us that we are all sinners in need of a Saviour and that sin originates in the HEART (thoughts and feelings). That is why we have the NEW COVENANT promise to LOVE and need to be BORN AGAIN by Faith in God's WORD for salvation to be free from SIN (breaking any one of God's 10 commandments) *HEBREWS 8:10-12; 1 JOHN 3:3-10.

This is leading to the NEW COVENANT PROMISE of a NEW HEART to LOVE *HEBREWS 8:10-12; JOHN 5:42; 1 JOHN 5:17-19; 1 JOHN 4:16; 1 JOHN 5:3; 1 JOHN 4:8.

We do not have the LOVE of GOD in us *JOHN 5:42. We need to be BORN OF GOD to LOVE *1 JOHN 4:7 and partake of the NEW COVENANT promise. This is why JESUS teaches in *JOHN 3:3-7 that UNLESS we are made CLEAN from the INSIDE OUT and BORN AGAIN to LOVE we cannot enter the KINGDOM of HEAVEN. This is what JESUS is talking about in MATTHEW 5:20 when discussing the Scribes and the Pharisees teaching the application of God's LAW from the INSIDE OUT.

Whosoever is BORN of GOD to LOVE in the NEW COVENANT *HEBREWS 8:10-12 does not commit SIN *1 JOHN 3:9; ROMANS 13:8-10; JAMES 2:8-12; ROMANS 3:31; MATTHEW 22:36-40. This is the GOOD NEWS of the Gospels in the NEW COVENANT we have a SAVIOUR to save us from sin (not in sin) but we have to be made new to walk in God's Spirit *GALATIANS 5:16; ROMANS 8:1-4.

1 JOHN 3:3-10 is talking about all those who are BORN AGAIN to LOVE and it is LOVE that fulfills God's LAW in all those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD in the NEW COVENANT *HEBREWS 8:10-12; ROMANS 13:8-10. This results in a people that keep God's LAW (10 commandments) from the INSIDE OUT. *REVELATION 14:12; REVELATION 22:14; 1 JOHN 2:3-4; 1 JOHN 3:3-10; ROMANS 13:8-10; ROMANS 3:31; HEBREWS 8:10-12. Unless we are BORN AGAIN to LOVE we cannot enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN *JOHN 3:3-7.

[7], BUT IF THE MINISTRATION OF DEATH, WRITTEN AND ENGRAVED IN STONES, WAS GLORIOUS, SO THAT THE CHILDREN OF ISRAEL COULD NOT STEADFASTLY BEHOLD THE FACE OF MOSES FOR THE GLORY OF HIS COUNTENANCE; WHICH GLORY WAS TO BE DONE AWAY:

Note: It is condemnation and death (sin) that is to be done away with and the letter through the Spirit not God’s law as God’s law is not sin but is Holy, Just and Good * ROMANS 7:7; ROMANS 7:11-12 and gives us a knowledge of what sin is in the new covenant *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7 and leads us to Christ that we might be forgiven through faith *GALATIANS 3:22-25

[8], HOW SHALL NOT THE MINISTRATION OF THE SPIRIT BE RATHER GLORIOUS?
[9], FOR IF THE MINISTRATION OF CONDEMNATION BE GLORY, MUCH MORE DOES THE MINISTRATION OF RIGHTEOUSNESS EXCEED IN GLORY.

Note: The 10 commandments (the letter) written on stone is the “MINISTRATION OF CONDEMNATION” that is it condemns sin or the breaking of God’s 10 commandments. It brings a knowledge is sin and condemnation brings the guilt of sin which is death. Through the Spirit of JESUS our sins are forgiven as we have faith in God’s Word *JOHN 3:16-19; 1 JOHN 1:9 and His Spirit through faith in the Word of God *JOHN 6:63 changes our heart *HEBREWS 8:10-12 to love and obedience that leads to righteousness *ROMANS 13:8-10; HEBREWS 8:10-12; ROMANS 3:31; ROMANS 8:1-4; ROMANS 6:14:16; ROMANS 1:5; 1 JOHN 2:3-4; 1 JOHN 3:6-9; REVELATION 14:12; REVELATION 22:14.

[10], FOR EVEN THAT WHICH WAS MADE GLORIOUS HAD NO GLORY IN THIS RESPECT, BY REASON OF THE GLORY THAT EXCELS.
[11], FOR IF THAT WHICH IS DONE AWAY WAS GLORIOUS, MUCH MORE THAT WHICH REMAINS IS GLORIOUS.

Note: The purpose of God’s law was only to give us a knowledge of what sin is *ROMANS 3:20 and to lead us to JESUS *GALATIANS 3:22-25. It could never change us and free us from the power and condemnation of sin. The old covenant Sanctuary laws for remission of sins (burnt offerings and animal sacrifices and blood offerings) pointed to JESUS and God’s plan of salvation in the new covenant and God’s promise of salvation from sin’s power *JEREMIAH 31:31-34; HEBREWS 8:10-12; HEBREWS 10:15-17; JOHN 8:31-36; 1 JOHN 3:6-9.

[12], Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech:
[13], AND NOT AS MOSES, WHICH PUT A VEIL OVER HIS FACE, THAT THE CHILDREN OF ISRAEL COULD NOT STEADFASTLY LOOK TO THE END OF THAT WHICH IS ABOLISHED:

Note: the veil to be abolished is the “letter of condemnation and sin” which leads to the Spirit of life which is received by faith in God’s Word that leads us to the Spirit of Christ that works in us to love *PHILIPPIANS 2:13; HEBREWS 8:10-12; ROMANS 3:31; ROMANS 8:1-4; GALATIANS 3:22-25; GALATIANS 5:16; ROMANS 13:8-10; 1 JOHN 3:6-9; REVELATION 14:12.

[14], BUT THEIR MINDS WERE BLINDED: FOR UNTIL THIS DAY REMAINS THE SAME VEIL NOT TAKEN AWAY IN THE READING OF THE OLD TESTAMENT; WHICH VEIL IS DONE AWAY IN CHRIST.
[15], BUT EVEN TO THIS DAY, WHEN MOSES IS READ, THE VEIL IS ON THEIR HEART.

Note: Following the “letter of the law”(old covenant) only leads to the outward appearance of righteousness condemned by JESUS when talking to the Scribes and Pharisees as highlighted above and in MATTHEW 5:20; MATTHEW 23:13 MATTHEW 23:25-28. We need to be saved from the INSIDE and receive a new heart to love. Outward obedience to God’s law does not save us because sin originates from the heart *MATTHEW 5:17-27.

[16], NEVERTHELESS WHEN IT SHALL TURN TO THE LORD, THE VEIL SHALL BE TAKEN AWAY.
[17], NOW THE LORD IS THAT SPIRIT: AND WHERE THE SPIRIT OF THE LORD IS, THERE IS LIBERTY.
[18], BUT WE ALL, WITH OPEN FACE BEHOLDING AS IN A GLASS THE GLORY OF THE LORD, ARE CHANGED INTO THE SAME IMAGE FROM GLORY TO GLORY, EVEN AS BY THE SPIRIT OF THE LORD.

The Spirit of the law is JESUS and God’s new covenant promise of salvation from sin and a new heart to love *HEBREWS 8:10-12; ROMANS 13:8-10; Whosoever is born of God does not practice sin *1 JOHN 3:6-9. Sin is breaking anyone of God’s 10 commandments *JAMES 2:10-11 or not believing and following Gods’ Word *ROMANS 14:23.

Hope this is helpful dear friend. Nice to meet you

HARK! said:

Repentance from what?

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All the things Paul was yelling at them for in the first letter. LOL

HARK! said:

Psalm 119
44 So shall I keep Your law continually, Forever and ever.
45 And I will walk at liberty,For I seek Your precepts.

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Of course, but the laws of the Spirit are like the Ten Commandments on steroids. They are more powerful, and deeper to the core of iniquity. But the Spirit does them naturally, and we are no longer in the flesh, but in the Spirit, so we do them naturally too.

HARK! said:

(CLV) Lk 16:17
Yet it is easier for heaven and earth to pass by than for one serif of the law to fall.

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We establish the law.

HARK! said:

John 14:21
Whoever has My commandments and keeps them is the one who loves Me. The one who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and reveal Myself to him."

John 14:23
Jesus replied, "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word. My Father will love him, and we will come to him and make Our home with him.

John 15:10
If you keep My commandments, you will remain in My love, just as I have kept My Father's commandments and remain in His love.

1 John 2:3
By this we can be sure that we have come to know Him: if we keep His commandments.

1 John 5:3
For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome,

2 John 1:6
And this is love, that we walk according to His commandments. This is the very commandment you have heard from the beginning, that you must walk in love.

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Amen. These are the commandments of Jesus.

1 John 3:23-24

23 And this is His commandment: that we should believe on the name of His Son Jesus Christ and love one another, as He gave us commandment.

24 Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

klutedavid said:

You need to be a little more precise.

1 John 3:23-24
This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us. The one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him.

1 John 4:21
And this commandment we have from Him, that the one who loves God should love his brother also.

1 John 5:2
By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and observe His commandments.

John 13:34
A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another, even as I have loved you, that you also love one another.

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Yep, those are the commandments taught by Jesus.

LoveGodsWord said:

Hello dear friend and welcome here.

Perhaps you mean old covenant? There is nowhere in the bible that says that God's 10 commandments pass away or are abolished. In the new covenant God's 10 commandments give us the knowledge of right and wrong, good and evil, sin and righteousness *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4 and if we break anyone of them we stand guilty before God of sin *JAMES 2:10-11. Perhaps dear friend your mixing up the shadow laws in ordinances from the Mosaic book of the law for remission of sins from the old covenant (blood offerings, burn't offerings, animal sacrifices) *HEBREWS 10:1-31 which were shadows of things to come.

to be continued..

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No, the Ten Commandments are the ministry of death. And the New Covenant is the ministry of the Spirit. 2 Corinthians 3:7-11

Romans 8:2 And the law of the Spirit of life in Christ has set me free from the law of sin and death (ministry of death).

2

@lovegod'sWord (Your post was too long, and I only had to read the first part to let me know you don't understand what I believe.

Those who obey the Spirit cannot break any commandment. It is not in their new nature. But the commandments of Jesus are what He taught while on earth. To believe in Him (not in the Ten Commandments), and to love one another (in the Ten Commandments you couldn't murder, but you could still hate.) The Commandments of Jesus are the Ten Commandments on steroids. Much deeper and thorough, but it is the Spirit in us that makes it natural for us to love God and man. Whereas the Old Covenant had to be kept unnaturally with a carnal nature.

Word and Spirit said:

No, the Ten Commandments are the ministry of death. And the New Covenant is the ministry of the Spirit. 2 Corinthians 3:7-11

Romans 8:2 And the law of the Spirit of life in Christ has set me free from the law of sin and death (ministry of death).

2

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No dear friend. Without God's law we have no knowledge of what sin is *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4. All the law does is give us the knowledge of what sin is it cannot save us from sins penalty or power over us. The wages of sin is death *ROMANS 6:23.

ROMANS 8:2 is not talking about the 10 Commandments it is in reference to the law of the sinful nature. Read the contexts...

See the context here...

ROMANS 7:5 [5], For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit to death.

ROMANS 7:23-24 [23], BUT I SEE ANOTHER LAW IN MY MEMBERS, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity TO THE LAW THAT IS IN MY MEMBERS [24], O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the BODY OF THIS DEATH?

Too bad you did not pay attention to what you quoted which only supports what is being shared here...

ROMANS 8:1-4 [1], THERE IS THEREFORE NOW NO CONDEMNATION TO THEM WHICH ARE IN CHRIST JESUS, WHO WALK NOT AFTER THE FLESH, BUT AFTER THE SPIRIT. [2], FOR THE LAW OF THE SPIRIT OF LIFE HAS MADE ME FREE FROM THE LAW OF SIN AND DEATH. [3], For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: [4], THAT THE RIGHTEOUSNESS OF THE LAW MIGHT BE FULFILLED IN US, WHO WALK NOT AFTER THE FLESH, BUT AFTER THE SPIRIT.

links to...

ROMANS 8:12-14 [12], Therefore, brothers, WE ARE DEBTORS, NOT TO THE FLESH, TO LIVE AFTER THE FLESH.[13], FOR IF YOU LIVE AFTER THE FLESH, YOU SHALL DIE: but IF YOU THROUGH THE SPIRIT DO MORTIFY THE DEEDS OF THE BODY, YOU SHALL LIVE.[14], FOR AS MANY AS ARE LED BY THE SPIRIT OF GOD, THEY ARE THE SONS OF GOD.

GALATIANS 5:16[16], THIS I SAY THEN, WALK IN THE SPIRIT, AND YOU SHALL NOT FULFILL THE LUST OF THE FLESH.

Please also read ROMANS 6:1-23

Also, read on a little further from ROMANS 8:2 your interpretation to God's 10 commandments being abolished is false as verse 4 says it is ESTBLAISHED not abolished...

ROMANS 8:3-4 [3], For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
[4], THAT THE RIGHTEOUSNESS OF THE LAW MIGHT BE FULFILLED IN US, WHO WALK NOT AFTER THE FLESH, BUT AFTER THE SPIRIT.

Context matters....

Hope this helps

@LoveGodsWord

If all the laws were for people on the ground, but suddenly you are a new creature that spends all its time flying in the air, do the rules of the road apply to them?

If all you do is love, does the rule to not murder apply to you anymore?

What I am hearing from the few that are debating with me is the you all assume a Christian sins. No, we establish the law from a nature that is divine, not carnal.

Word and Spirit said:

@lovegod'sWord (Your post was too long, and I only had to read the first part to let me know you don't understand what I believe.

Those who obey the Spirit cannot break any commandment. It is not in their new nature. But the commandments of Jesus are what He taught while on earth. To believe in Him (not in the Ten Commandments), and to love one another (in the Ten Commandments you couldn't murder, but you could still hate.) The Commandments of Jesus are the Ten Commandments on steroids. Much deeper and thorough, but it is the Spirit in us that makes it natural for us to love God and man. Whereas the Old Covenant had to be kept unnaturally with a carnal nature.

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Post # 24 linked is only scripture applied to contexts and supporting scripture showing that 2 CORINTHIANS 3 is talking about the two covenants (old and new). No one loves God while breaking anyone of God's 10 commandments as love is expressed through obedience through a new heart to love (HEBREWS 8:10-12) God. As we believe God's Word Word through faith we walk in God's Spirit and love is the fulfilling of the law as we believe and follow God's Word *ROMANS 13:8-10; 1 JOHN 5:4. Faith does not abolish God's law it ESTABLISHES God's law in those who believe God's Word *ROMANS 3:31. The scriptures supplied in post # 24 linked shows that 2 CORINTHIANS 3 is in relation to the two covenants one of the letter leading to the Spirit in fulfillment of HEBREWS 8:10-12 (from JEREMIAH 31:31-36). Love does not abolish God's law (10 commandments) it establishes God's law in those who believe God's Word

Blessings.

Word and Spirit said:

@LoveGodsWord

If all the laws were for people on the ground, but suddenly you are a new creature that spends all its time flying in the air, do the rules of the road apply to them?

If all you do is love, does the rule to not murder apply to you anymore?

What I am hearing from the few that are debating with me is the you all assume a Christian sins. No, we establish the law from a nature that is divine, not carnal.

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All have sinned that is why we need salvation. All God's law does is simply give us a knowledge of what sin is *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4. The law cannot save anyone. It shows us that we are all sinners in need of salvation from sin. This is the letter of the law. It is the Spirit of JESUS that saves us as we walk in by faith and believe God's Word. Our faith in God's Word establishes God's law in those who believe God's Word *ROMANS 3:31; ROMANS 8:4; ROMANS 13:8-10 and leads us to God's new covenant promise of a new heart to love *HEBREWS 8:10-12; 1 JOHN 3:6-9 and love is the fulfilling (doing) of the law in those who walk by faith. God's law is our schoomaster to lead us to Christ that we might be forgiven by faith *GALATIANS 5:16 and to set us free to walk in His Spirit *GALATIANS 5:16. Do you know the meaning of MATTHEW 9:12-13 dear WOS?

LoveGodsWord said:

Post # 24 linked is only scripture applied to contexts and supporting scripture showing that 2 CORINTHIANS 3 is talking about the two covenants (old and new). No one loves God while breaking anyone of God's 10 commandments as love is expressed through obedience through a new heart to love (HEBREWS 8:10-12) God. As we believe God's Word Word through faith we walk in God's Spirit and love is the fulfilling of the law as we believe and follow God's Word *ROMANS 13:8-10; 1 JOHN 5:4. Faith does not abolish God's law it ESTABLISHES God's law in those who believe God's Word *ROMANS 3:31. The scriptures supplied in post # 24 linked shows that 2 CORINTHIANS 3 is in relation to the two covenants one of the letter leading to the Spirit in fulfillment of HEBREWS 8:10-12 (from JEREMIAH 31:31-36). Love does not abolish God's law (10 commandments) it establishes God's law in those who believe God's Word

Blessings.

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Old Covenant Ten Commandments - you cannot murder, but you can hate.

New Covenant Law of Liberty through the Spirit - Love God and man, you not only do not murder, you don't hate either or you break the Law of Liberty.

LoveGodsWord said:

All Christians sin that is why we need salvation. All God's law does is simply give us a knowledge of what sin is *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4. The law cannot save anyone. It shows us that we are all sinners in need of salvation from sin. This is the letter of the law. It is the Spirit of JESUS that saves us as we walk in by faith and believe God's Word. Our faith in God's Word establishes God's law in those who believe God's Word *ROMANS 3:31; ROMANS 8:4; ROMANS 13:8-10 and leads us to God's new covenant promise of a new heart to love *HEBREWS 8:10-12; 1 JOHN 3:6-9 and love is the fulfilling (doing) of the law in those who walk by faith. God's law is our schoomaster to lead us to Christ that we might be forgiven by faith *GALATIANS 5:16 and to set us free to walk in His Spirit *GALATIANS 5:16. Do you know the meaning of MATTHEW 9:12-13 dear WOS?

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All Christians sin? What apostle taught you that. Judas?

HARK! said:

What are those things called?



Can you name the laws of the spirit? I can't find a list in the gospels; and Yahashua makes no mention of them.

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It is what Jesus taught over and over. Do the commandments of 1 John 3:23 ring any bells? Why are you looking for a list of rules? That is the letter of the Law which kills. It is the Spirit that brings life. Follow the laws of the Spirit and you more than fulfill the letter of the law.