{MOVED} Why I am not Roman Catholic

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Scann

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I believe in asking others to pray for me at certain times. Their "rank" has nothing to do with anything. Catholics simply do not see mortality as a barrier to intercessory prayer.
And just why do you find it necessary to ask others to pray for you when you can do it yourself? You underestimate God?

You don't have confidence in what you yourself said?

Yup. My statement remains that there are no excuses of why you can't pray straight to God.
That sounds an awful lot like idolatry. Are you saying Catholics are idolaters?
You ask why I contradict scripture so I ask you why Catholics do the same.
 
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pantingdeer

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I believe in asking others to pray for me at certain times. Their "rank" has nothing to do with anything. Catholics simply do not see mortality as a barrier to intercessory prayer.

Nah.

...

That sounds an awful lot like idolatry. Are you saying Catholics are idolaters?
Catholics idolise Mary when she is not God or even close to God. She is just the human than gave birth to Jesus. They worship her statues in catholic buildings.
 
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K Watt

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As requested, this is my reasoning for not converting to Catholicism.

I was not raised in a Christian family. I knew little about Roman Catholicism except for the vitriolic attacks my father would launch from time to time. After I was saved, I investigated Roman Catholicism. I found it wanting in the extreme. There are many issues that Protestants have with various Bible interpretations. I have learned to agree to disagree with a great deal of denominational teaching. I do not accept that the issues with Protestant beliefs are a reason to adopt Catholicism.

This OP is as brief as I can make it, but there is much more to say. Feel free to challenge any of my statements.

I am well aware that RC theologians have answers for everything, but I find their reasoning specious. I have nothing against Roman Catholics as individuals. My problem is the false teachings of the RC organisation. I’ll use the abbreviation “RC”. I refuse to call it “church” because it is an organisation, not the true Church.

Top of my list is the false teaching is that the Lord Jesus founded the RC organisation. Lord Jesus is the Head of the Church, His body, the fullness of Him who fills all things. (Eph. 1:23). The true Church is all those who are born again. No one is a Christian because they are born into a Christian family. Everyone must choose Christ for themselves. “You must be born again” (John 3:7)

Next is the papacy. RC traces this to the apostle Peter. Supposedly Lord Jesus built the church on him. Yet we know that the “Rock” that the Lord Jesus spoke about was His words, not an individual (Matthew 7:24). Peter was fallible. He allowed himself to be influenced by Judaizers and Paul had to set him straight. There is no conclusive evidence that Peter was the Bishop of Rome.

Another issue is the priesthood. The idea that an individual is the priest while the congregation consists of ignorant simpletons is contrary to God’s word. Every born again Christian is a priest to our God. This leads into to the next issue.

The RC teaches that the Bible alone is not sufficient. RC teachings are equal to the Bible. This is patently false. Since when have the traditions of men taken precedence over God’s word? Since the days of the Pharisees, that’s when. Lord Jesus did not commend them. He rebuked them! Every Christian has the right and the duty to study God’s word for themselves. The Bible is the standard by which every supposed truth must be judged. If it contradicts God’s word, then the “truth” is in fact a lie.

Praying to the saints who have gone before us? Why? I’ve been asking God in Jesus’ name for nearly 50 years. I’ve never heard, “I’m busy, talk to Paul will you? He’ll clue Me in later.” Lord Jesus told us to pray in His name. If we are really stuck, the Holy Spirit intercedes for us. (Romans 8:26).

“For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus……” (1 Timothy 2:5). Yet RC claims that Mary is a mediatrix. She is also awarded titles that are the domain of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Elevating Mary to a godlike figure is idolatry and blasphemous. Mary was not born sinless – her ancestry is traceable to Adam. Therefore she was in just as much need of grace as any other believer. She is not God and the RC obsession with Mary is not reflected in the New Testament.

Finally, consider the Kingdom of God. Lord Jesus declared that his Kingdom is not of this world. Yet the Vatican is a nation in its own right. It has an army, its own central bank, its own currency and postage stamps. It confers citizenship. It is a microcosm of the world system. It has nothing to do with the kingdom of God. Neither does Roman Catholicism.


This post is so full of half truths and lies that it is overwhelming. I'm sure you mean well, but this is shameful.

I'm going to address one point at a time as I can get to it.

1) Jesus started a single Church. He chose leaders for his Church. He gave these leaders the authority to teach, baptize, forgive sins, and appoint successors. He promised to be with his Church until the end of time. He promised that the Holy Spirit would guide the Church into all truth. He told the rest of us to listen to the Church.

Here are the verses that demonstrate these truths:

ONE CHURCH
Matt 16:18 18And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades will not prevail against it.

Also, note that Jesus spoke Aramaic. In Aramaic, Jesus said, thou art CEPHAS and on this CEPHAS I will build my Church.

CHOSEN LEADERS WITH AUTHORITY
John 15:16
You did not choose me, but I chose you and appointed you so that you might go and bear fruit

Matt 28:18
All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to Me. 19Therefore go and make disciples of all nations,
John 20 21Again Jesus said to them, “Peace be with you. As the Father has sent Me, so also I am sending you.
23If you forgive anyone his sins, they are forgiven; if you withhold forgiveness from anyone, it is withheld.”
Luke 1016Whoever listens to you listens to Me; whoever rejects you rejects Me; and whoever rejects Me rejects the One who sent Me.”
Matt 18 17If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, regard him as you would a pagan or a tax collector.
John 16 13However, when the Spirit of truth comes, He will guide you into all truth.

Matt 18:18 18 “Truly I tell you, whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.

INSTRUCTIONS TO US TO FOLLOW AND OBEY
Heb 13:17 Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit to them: for they watch in behalf of your souls, as they that shall give account; that they may do this with joy, and not with grief: for this were unprofitable for you.

1 Tim 3:15
if I am delayed, you will know how people ought to conduct themselves in God's household, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and foundation of the truth.

Acts 15
The apostles and the elders, your brothers,
To the brothers among the Gentiles in Antioch, Syria, and Cilicia:
Greetings. 24It has come to our attention that some went out from us without our authorization and unsettled your minds by what they said.
 
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K Watt

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Catholics idolise Mary when she is not God or even close to God. She is just the human than gave birth to Jesus. They worship her statues in catholic buildings.

That is a lie. Please don't say such things when you are bearing false witness.

From the Catechism:
970 "Mary's function as mother of men in no way obscures or diminishes this unique mediation of Christ, but rather shows its power. But the Blessed Virgin's salutary influence on men . . . flows forth from the superabundance of the merits of Christ, rests on his mediation, depends entirely on it, and draws all its power from it."513 "No creature could ever be counted along with the Incarnate Word and Redeemer
 
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pantingdeer

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That is a lie. Please don't say such things when you are bearing false witness.

From the Catechism:
970 "Mary's function as mother of men in no way obscures or diminishes this unique mediation of Christ, but rather shows its power. But the Blessed Virgin's salutary influence on men . . . flows forth from the superabundance of the merits of Christ, rests on his mediation, depends entirely on it, and draws all its power from it."513 "No creature could ever be counted along with the Incarnate Word and Redeemer
What is catechism
 
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Barney2.0

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I checked the verse that came before and after and it is nothing close to Johnny praying to St. Intervio because he believes his prayers have a better chance of being heard.
Once again ignoring the Biblical passages because it does not conform to your fundamentalist Protestant theology, does Revelation teach that the saints carry on our prayers to God or not?

:laughing::laughing: Did he carve images and put them in churches and ask people to pray to them?
No one prays to statues, but come to think of it who carved statues and put them on the Ark, Moses did on the command of God himself:

And make two cherubim out of hammered gold at the ends of the cover.

Exodus 25:18

Let’s see how the Book of 1 Kings describes inside of the Temple of God as designed by Solomon:

In the inner sanctuary he made two cherubim, each ten cubits high, out of olive wood. One wing of the first cherub was five cubits long, and the other wing was five cubits long as well. So the full wingspan was ten cubits. The second cherub also measured ten cubits; both cherubim had the same size and shape, and the height of each cherub was ten cubits. And he placed the cherubim inside the innermost room of the temple. Since their wings were spread out, the wing of the first cherub touched one wall, while the wing of the second cherub touched the other wall, and in the middle of the room their wingtips touched. He also overlaid the cherubim with gold. Then he carved the walls all around the temple, in both the inner and outer sanctuaries, with carved engravings of cherubim, palm trees, and open flowers. And he overlaid the temple floor with gold in both the inner and outer sanctuaries.

1 Kings 6:23-30
 
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Albion

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Folks, the Original Post identified a number of reasons why the writer was not a Roman Catholic. I repeated them in summary form in post 49.

The discussion seems to have jumped around, but the sides never change.

What I'm wondering is if there are people who agree with some of the OPs points and disagree with some others of them, and if so which are which?

This is my own list (some are difficult because each point came with a lot of commentary that might affect the response). Each answer is on agreeing with the OP.

1. Agree. The RCC not the particular and only church founded by Christ.
2. Partial. The Papacy not Scriptural.
3. Disagree. All members are priests.
4. Agree. Tradition not the equal of Scripture.
5. Agree. No prayer to Saints as intercessors.
6. Agree. Mariolatry not Scriptural.
7. Pass. Church not to be a temporal power (Vatican City).
 
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Barney2.0

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Before I go on, kindly answer why you think a "vision" from a man who is not a prophet is legit. It could be lies, demonic vision or simply a delusion.
Because the devil wouldn’t have inspired him to help God’s faithful and the Church, rather he would have him persecute and destroy it not raid it up as God had King Solomon raise up his Temple in Jerusalem.
 
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Scann

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Once again ignoring the Biblical passages because it does not conform to your fundamentalist Protestant theology, does Revelation teach that the saints carry on our prayers to God or not?
Your verses proved nothing.

No one prays to statues,
Praying to the Saints .Let's read an article by the Catholic themselves shall we?
but come to think of it who carved statues and put them on the Ark, Moses did on the command of God himself:
"but come to think of it who carved statues and put them on the Ark, Moses did on the command of God himself:"
 
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Scann

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Because the devil wouldn’t have inspired him to help God’s faithful and the Church, rather he would have him persecute and destroy it not raid it up as God had King Solomon raise up his Temple in Jerusalem.
If that's the case then any future emperors after him can simply make any claims and we are supposed to believe it's true. As for helping God's faithful, look how the church turned out.
 
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TLSITD

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This is propaganda with no truth in Catholic Doctrine.
Regardless of their origin, none of those things I mentioned are Biblical, and neither are many other things that Catholics practice and teach (some of which so-called "Protestants" also practice, vestiges of Roman Catholicism).

The problem with Catholicism is not what it gets right, but the many serious things it gets wrong.
 
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K Watt

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Regardless of their origin, none of those things I mentioned are Biblical, and neither are many other things that Catholics practice and teach (some of which so-called "Protestants" also practice, vestiges of Roman Catholicism).

The problem with Catholicism is not what it gets right, but the many serious things it gets wrong.

They aren't Catholic either. You are repeating half truths and lies about the Church. Do a little research before slandering others.
 
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K Watt

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If that's the case then any future emperors after him can simply make any claims and we are supposed to believe it's true. As for helping God's faithful, look how the church turned out.

Wonderfully! The Catholic Church spread the gospel throughout the world. There are now 1.2 billion Catholics. The Catholic Church is the largest charity in the world. The Catholic Church invented hospitals, orphanages and universities. Go the poorest places on earth and you will find Catholics feeding the poor, caring for the sick, and spreading the gospel.
 
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Scann

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Wonderfully! The Catholic Church spread the gospel throughout the world. There are now 1.2 billion Catholics. The Catholic Church is the largest charity in the world. The Catholic Church invented hospitals, orphanages and universities. Go the poorest places on earth and you will find Catholics feeding the poor, caring for the sick, and spreading the gospel.
Inquisition.Ustase. *Cough* *Cough*
 
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TLSITD

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They aren't Catholic either. You are repeating half truths and lies about the Church. Do a little research before slandering others.
Catholics don't venerate or pray to Mary and the saints? "Christ"-mass didn't originate with the pagan Roman festival of Saturnalia? I don't think you're being honest.
 
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K Watt

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Catholics don't venerate or pray to Mary and the saints? "Christ"-mass didn't originate with the pagan Roman festival of Saturnalia? I don't think you're being honest.

I think you are a victim of propaganda. Of course Catholics venerate the saints. Don't you? Christmas is a celebration of the birth of Jesus. If it supplanted another holiday that's fine with me.
 
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