Debate-For MJ's Only Obervance of the Moedim

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I marked this thread as debate for MJ only. I don't want this thread to turn into a debate. The purpose of this is to work together to seek truth. Non MJ's are free to help with this; BUT I don't want to hear that we are "not under the law," or, "that was the old covenant," or any attempt to diminish the fact that YHWH told us that the Moedim are FOREVER.


Many Messianic Congregations hold different interpretations of the scripture. Many follow different unscriptural traditions. I left my Messianic congregation over some of these differences; and I began to lead a Bible study, on Shabbat, in my home. Late last year, with Pesach approaching quickly, I came up with a plan to create a public Shabbat study group for this year. This group would come together to seek the truth. I would not lead this group, other than in the capacity of the chairman, executing Robert's Rules of Order. This would bring order to the group, in order to give everyone an opportunity to bring their evidence of the truth forward. I met some random people who were interested in taking part in such discussions; and I told them that I would let them know if I could get this off the ground. In that light, I felt that time was of the essence, to get this project rolling. In the process of researching the logistics of getting this group started; I came across some interesting information about the Moedim. I relayed this to the participants in my home study. One of the participants asked me, "what will we tell the public congregation concerning the Moedim?" Sigh, even as a simple chairman, I knew at that time that the congregation would look to me for answers to these important questions. I'm not quite ready to start this Messianic congregation.

I don't follow tradition. I follow the Torah. My understanding of the Torah gets revised regularly. Last year I watched for the barley to be abib in Israel; then I watched the moon here at home, to wait for the first sliver to appear. I placed the blood of the lamb on my doorposts, ate the lamb in haste, with homemade matzah, and bitter herbs. We prepared the lamb in a pit, as the Samaritans do, on preparation day. Then we read the story of the Exodus. We discussed how this applies to us. We didn't leave the house in the night; and we burnt the remains shortly before dawn. I know that's not perfect; but we did the best that we could.

Now concerning the other Moedim, they are timed according to Pesach. No biggie concerning the timing for me. What is a biggie to me, are the dietary aspects with my High Priest having taken his place next to the Father.

The way that I see it, is that when the Temple was destroyed; we, by default, go back to the Tabernacle observance.

With Pesach quickly approaching, and my previous understandings being challenged, I would appreciate input from like minded believers on this very important subject
 
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I marked this thread as debate for MJ only. I don't want this thread to turn into a debate. The purpose of this is to work together to seek truth. Non MJ's are free to help with this; BUT I don't want to hear that we are "not under the law," or, "that was the old covenant," or any attempt to diminish the fact that YHWH told us that the Moedim are FOREVER.


Many Messianic Congregations hold different interpretations of the scripture. Many follow different unscriptural traditions. I left my Messianic congregation over some of these differences; and I began to lead a Bible study, on Shabbat, in my home. Late last year, with Pesach approaching quickly, I came up with a plan to create a public Shabbat study group for this year. This group would come together to seek the truth. I would not lead this group, other than in the capacity of the chairman, executing Robert's Rules of Order. This would bring order to the group, in order to give everyone an opportunity to bring their evidence of the truth forward. I met some random people who were interested in taking part in such discussions; and I told them that I would let them know if I could get this off the ground. In that light, I felt that time was of the essence, to get this project rolling. In the process of researching the logistics of getting this group started; I came across some interesting information about the Moedim. I relayed this to the participants in my home study. One of the participants asked me, "what will we tell the public congregation concerning the Moedim?" Sigh, even as a simple chairman, I knew at that time that the congregation would look to me for answers to these important questions. I'm not quite ready to start this Messianic congregation.

I don't follow tradition. I follow the Torah. My understanding of the Torah gets revised regularly. Last year I watched for the barley to be abib in Israel; then I watched the moon here at home, to wait for the first sliver to appear. I placed the blood of the lamb on my doorposts, ate the lamb in haste, with homemade matzah, and bitter herbs. We prepared the lamb in a pit, as the Samaritans do, on preparation day. Then we read the story of the Exodus. We discussed how this applies to us. We didn't leave the house in the night; and we burnt the remains shortly before dawn. I know that's not perfect; but we did the best that we could.

Now concerning the other Moedim, they are timed according to Pesach. No biggie concerning the timing for me. What is a biggie to me, are the dietary aspects with my High Priest having taken his place next to the Father.

The way that I see it, is that when the Temple was destroyed; we, by default, go back to the Tabernacle observance.

With Pesach quickly approaching, and my previous understandings being challenged, I would appreciate input from like minded believers on this very important subject
I'm wondering why, as a Messianic believer, you put lamb's blood on your doorposts?
 
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HARK!

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I'm wondering why, as a Messianic believer, you put lamb's blood on your doorposts?

Exodus 12 Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)
12 Adonai spoke to Moshe and Aharon in the land of Egypt; he said, 2 “You are to begin your calendar with this month; it will be the first month of the year for you. 3 Speak to all the assembly of Isra’el and say, ‘On the tenth day of this month, each man is to take a lamb or kid for his family, one per household — 4 except that if the household is too small for a whole lamb or kid, then he and his next-door neighbor should share one, dividing it in proportion to the number of people eating it. 5 Your animal must be without defect, a male in its first year, and you may choose it from either the sheep or the goats.

6 “‘You are to keep it until the fourteenth day of the month, and then the entire assembly of the community of Isra’el will slaughter it at dusk. 7 They are to take some of the blood and smear it on the two sides and top of the door-frame at the entrance of the house in which they eat it. 8 That night, they are to eat the meat, roasted in the fire; they are to eat it with matzah and maror. 9 Don’t eat it raw or boiled, but roasted in the fire, with its head, the lower parts of its legs and its inner organs. 10 Let nothing of it remain till morning; if any of it does remain, burn it up completely.

11 “‘Here is how you are to eat it: with your belt fastened, your shoes on your feet and your staff in your hand; and you are to eat it hurriedly. It is Adonai’s Pesach [Passover]. 12 For that night, I will pass through the land of Egypt and kill all the firstborn in the land of Egypt, both men and animals; and I will execute judgment against all the gods of Egypt; I am Adonai. 13 The blood will serve you as a sign marking the houses where you are; when I see the blood, I will pass over a]">[a] you — when I strike the land of Egypt, the death blow will not strike you.

14 “‘This will be a day for you to remember and celebrate as a festival to Adonai; from generation to generation you are to celebrate it by a perpetual regulation.

15 “‘For seven days you are to eat matzah — on the first day remove the leaven from your houses. For whoever eats hametz [leavened bread] from the first to the seventh day is to be cut off from Isra’el. 16 On the first and seventh days, you are to have an assembly set aside for God. On these days no work is to be done, except what each must do to prepare his food; you may do only that. 17 You are to observe the festival of matzah, for on this very day I brought your divisions out of the land of Egypt. Therefore, you are to observe this day from generation to generation by a perpetual regulation. 18 From the evening of the fourteenth day of the first month until the evening of the twenty-first day, you are to eat matzah. 19 During those seven days, no leaven is to be found in your housesWhoever eats food with hametz in it is to be cut off from the community of Isra’el — it doesn’t matter whether he is a foreigner or a citizen of the land.. 20 Eat nothing with hametz in it. Wherever you live, eat matzah.’”

(v) 21 Then Moshe called for all the leaders of Isra’el and said, “Select and take lambs for your families, and slaughter the Pesach lamb. 22 Take a bunch of hyssop leaves and dip it in the blood which is in the basin, and smear it on the two sides and top of the door-frame. Then, none of you is to go out the door of his house until morning. 23 For Adonai will pass through to kill the Egyptians; but when he sees the blood on the top and on the two sides, Adonai will pass over the door and will not allow the Slaughterer to enter your houses and kill you. 24 You are to observe this as a law, you and your descendants forever.

25 “When you come to the land which Adonai will give you, as he has promised, you are to observe this ceremony. 26 When your children ask you, ‘What do you mean by this ceremony?’ 27 say, ‘It is the sacrifice of Adonai’s Pesach [Passover], because [Adonai] passed over the houses of the people of Isra’el in Egypt, when he killed the Egyptians but spared our houses.’” The people of Isra’el bowed their heads and worshipped. 28 Then the people of Isra’el went and did as Adonai had ordered Moshe and Aharon — that is what they did.




(CLV) Mt 15:24
Now He, answering, said, "I was not commissioned except for the lost sheep of the house of Israel."
 
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HARK!

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Passover 2020
  • begins Wednesday, April 8th at sunset (in 53 days)
  • ends Thursday, April 16 at nightfall

Shabbat shalom

I would argue:

(CLV) Mt 24:36
Now, concerning that day and hour not one is aware, neither the messengers of the heavens, nor the Son; except the Father only.

We know not when the barley will be abib; nor even NASA, with all of its' technology, can accurately predict when the first crescent will be visible to the human eye with 100% accuracy. YHWH will give us the signs.

...and so it seems, out of necessity of proclaiming the truth as I understand it, that it is I who has opened the unwanted debate.
 
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Shabbat shalom

I would argue:

(CLV) Mt 24:36
Now, concerning that day and hour not one is aware, neither the messengers of the heavens, nor the Son; except the Father only.

We know not when the barley will be abib; nor even NASA, with all of its' technology, can accurately predict when the first crescent will be visible to the human eye with 100% accuracy. YHWH will give us the signs.

...and so it seems, out of necessity of proclaiming the truth as I understand it, that it is I who has opened the unwanted debate.


I wasn't putting it there for debate and I too have studied about the aviv and gone some years observing Passover then. However the law was given to the nation and the nation of Israel is following the 19 year calendar. So you can also choose to do both. However I don't believe we are to be sacrificing a lamb.

As it is written 1 Cor 5:7

7 Get rid of the old yeast, that you may be a new unleavened batch, as you really are. For Christ, our Passover lamb, has been sacrificed.
 
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HARK!

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I don't believe we are to be sacrificing a lamb.

Sacrificing, or offering? The torah says forever; but I'm left with many questions lately. If I don't have my answers before Pesach; I'll celebrate with unleavened bread and bitter herbs.
 
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pinacled

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Sacrificing, or offering? The torah says forever; but I'm left with many questions lately. If I don't have my answers before Pesach; I'll celebrate with unleavened bread and bitter herbs.
Will those bitter herbs be like mustard?
 
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pinacled

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I wasn't putting it there for debate and I too have studied about the aviv and gone some years abseving Passover then. However the law was given to the nation and the nation it following the 19 year calendar. So you can also choose to do both. However I don't believe we are to be sacrificing a lamb.

As it is written 1 Cor 5:7

7 Get rid of the old yeast, that you may be a new unleavened batch, as you really are. For Christ, our Passover lamb, has been sacrificed.
Mercy and self sacrifice.
A lambs wool dyed and woven in Love.

Where an empty grave is found. Many promises are assured in the Life of Yeshua before and after the death that has lost its authority.
 
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