Bible condones poisoning yourself with ethanol?

Fish14 · Jan 15, 2019

I drank that horrendous, lethal poison for the second time in my life last night. It is ABSOLUTELY DISGUSTING! First it felt kind of good, but memorizing that, it was more about losing self-control than being happy. I possibly lost my reputation by sending drunken messages to everyone, in the morning I will see! Or maybe I will stay at home due to hangover. I wish there was a worlwide prohibition for the next thousand years or so because no one needs to drink that anti-life, anti-happiness, Satanic psychoactive narcotic poison. At least 50 000 000 000 life years, or 50 BILLLION, have been lost directly due to this chemical during the history of mankind, and much more because of lost productivity and thus less charity to help poor countries in birth control and food security.

Now why does the Bible have verses such as these:

1 Timothy 5:23
Stop drinking only water, and use a little wine...

Ecclesiastes 9:7
...drink your wine with a joyful heart...

In John 2:3-11, our beloved God turns jarfuls of delicious water into disgusting wine. Why?

Bumble Bee · Jan 15, 2019

I believe that it is because, in moderation, there are positive effects. Back then, the water supplies were not always clean so the wine was better for drinking as it prevented water born illness. In moderation, wine can help with stomach issues. Alcohol can be used as a pain suppressant when medication is unavailable (especially back then).

sfs · Jan 15, 2019

I had half a glass of wine with dinner. It was quite pleasant.

JustRachel · Jan 15, 2019

You've also got to read the verses about drunkenness.

Fish14 · Jan 15, 2019

Bumble Bee said:
I believe that it is because, in moderation, there are positive effects. Back then, the water supplies were not always clean so the wine was better for drinking as it prevented water born illness. In moderation, wine can help with stomach issues. Alcohol can be used as a pain suppressant when medication is unavailable (especially back then).

I would rather suffer from diarrhea every day and finally die of cholera (preferably at a ripe old age) than be drunk half of my life. Simply boiling water would be better, but the people back then didn't understand infections are caused by living things in the water. Quite understandable. If I were God, I would give the people pure water or teach them how to make it instead of letting them suffer from the mind-altering nauseous effects of methylcarbinol.

And what about pain? Well, alcohol is quite a pain in itself so I wouldn't drink it to any small pain. But for amputation, large operations and such, again understandable. However, this is a rare use of alcohol and doesn't quite explain the widespread use of it.

Tree of Life · Jan 15, 2019

I'm sipping on a nice bottled-in-bond whiskey RIGHT NOW.

Bumble Bee · Jan 15, 2019

Fish14 said:
I would rather suffer from diarrhea every day and finally die of cholera (preferably at a ripe old age) than be drunk half of my life. Simply boiling water would be better, but the people back then didn't understand infections are caused by living things in the water. Quite understandable. If I were God, I would give the people pure water or teach them how to make it instead of letting them suffer from the mind-altering nauseous effects of methylcarbinol.

And what about pain? Well, alcohol is quite a pain in itself so I wouldn't drink it to any small pain. But for amputation, large operations and such, again understandable. However, this is a rare use of alcohol and doesn't quite explain the widespread use of it.

And that is where moderation comes in. Different people can tolerate different amounts. For me, my limit is one. Some can tolerate more, some can tolerate less.

The same thing goes for many different food substances. Some people can tolerate wheat fine, some in small amounts, some not at all.

Fish14 · Jan 15, 2019

sfs said:
I had half a glass of wine with dinner. It was quite pleasant.

I drank a fourth of a strong vodka bottle and still suffer from nausea and headaches. I hope I won't touch thay stuff ever again. Glass of wine was pleasant? Do you mean the wobbly feeling and gay mood?

Fish14 · Jan 15, 2019

Tree of Life said:
I'm sipping on a nice bottled-in-bond whiskey RIGHT NOW.

If you are able to enjoy alcohol, good for you! I can't. I lose inhibitions and drink more. I have drunk only two times in my life but have alcoholist's genes. My grandmother is dying in a hospital because of alcohol while her ex-husband of the same age, my grandfather, is living a thriving and active life.

Tree of Life · Jan 15, 2019

Fish14 said:
If you are able to enjoy alcohol, good for you! I can't. I lose inhibitions and drink more. I have drunk only two times in my life but have alcoholist's genes. My grandmother is dying in a hospital because of alcohol while her ex-husband of the same age, my grandfather, is living a thriving and active life.

There's no such thing as alcoholic genes. But if you wish to abstain then God bless you in your abstinence.

Fish14 · Jan 15, 2019

JustRachel said:
You've also got to read the verses about drunkenness.

In my opinion, drunkenness is the same as drinking alcohol. The "drunk" effect doesn't begin suddenly but increases in correlation with the amount of poison drunk.

Bumble Bee · Jan 15, 2019

And that is why moderation is key.

Fish14 · Jan 15, 2019

Tree of Life said:
There's no such thing as alcoholic genes. But if you wish to abstain then God bless you in your abstinence.

According to some studies (I googled quickly so don't trust me completely) about half of the chance of alcoholism is due to genes. Other half is due to upbringing, environment etc. But of course, I believe in free will and that everyone could stop using any drug (sometimes with nearly impossible amounts of "willpower")

sfs · Jan 15, 2019

Fish14 said:
I drank a fourth of a strong vodka bottle and still suffer from nausea and headaches.

Well, why did you drink a fourth of a bottle?

Fish14 said:
Glass of wine was pleasant? Do you mean the wobbly feeling and gay mood?

No, I mean it tasted good and gave a slightly warm sensation. It was probably less than half a glass.

Fish14 said:
If you are able to enjoy alcohol, good for you! I can't.

Then don't. But why assume your experience defines how everyone else experiences alcohol?

sfs · Jan 15, 2019

Tree of Life said:
There's no such thing as alcoholic genes.

There most certainly are genes(*) that affect alcohol metabolism, as well as genes that are strongly associated with susceptibility to substance abuse more broadly.

(*) That is, genetic variants.

Fish14 · Jan 15, 2019

sfs said:
Well, why did you drink a fourth of a bottle.

No, I mean it tasted good and gave a slightly warm sensation. It was probably less than half a glass.

Then don't. But why assume your experience defines how everyone else experiences alcohol?

Because I was stupid.
Okay, sounds nice.
I wanted to express my feelings towards alcohol to other people. But you're right, maybe I should keep my own decisions to myself and let others enjoy their drinks...

Tree of Life · Jan 15, 2019

sfs said:
There most certainly are genes(*) that affect alcohol metabolism, as well as genes that are strongly associated with susceptibility to substance abuse more broadly.

(*) That is, genetic variants.

Correlation is not causation.

Fish14 · Jan 15, 2019

Tree of Life said:
Correlation is not causation.

Some people are tempted more to abuse alcohol due to the genetic variants than others, who hardly think about it.

Fish14 · Jan 15, 2019

Oh no, I feel a bit like vomiting again! Bye, I will close Christian Forums and focus on my breathing so I won't vomit.

sfs · Jan 15, 2019

Tree of Life said:
Correlation is not causation.

Yes, I know. Observation of the heritability of alcoholism, however, means that there is a genetic basis. When the genetic variants strongly associated with alcoholism are in the genes that code for the enzymes that metabolize alcohol, and in genes that are known independently to be involved in substance abuse, then you have more than mere correlation.

Bible condones poisoning yourself with ethanol?

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