Respect and obey your leaders.

Robert65

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Respect and obey your leaders. Is this absolute or contextual? A number of times I have heard Christians defend Trump by saying something to the effect of respect and obey your leaders. This is troubling to me as why would any Christian respect and obey an ammoral leader whose actions run afoul of the teachings of Christ? Were the Christians in Germany during WWII to respect and obey a madman? Seems illogical to me.

Why would God command Christians to respect and obey leaders who act in contrary to the teachings of Christ?

Reference.
9 Bible verses about Honouring Rulers
 

Greg J.

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Because God receives how we treat those in legitimate authority as if we were treating Him that way. Just because a person doesn't like Trump doesn't mean it is OK to reject what God has decided. It is a way to reveal that we are children of God and follow God in spite of our feeble understanding of the long-term effects of what God will do through that legitimate authority.

On a different note, any power we deny someone in the office of President will also affect the power of whoever is in that office in the future.
 
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StephenDiscipleofYHWH

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Respect and obey your leaders. Is this absolute or contextual? A number of times I have heard Christians defend Trump by saying something to the effect of respect and obey your leaders. This is troubling to me as why would any Christian respect and obey an ammoral leader whose actions run afoul of the teachings of Christ? Were the Christians in Germany during WWII to respect and obey a madman? Seems illogical to me.

Why would God command Christians to respect and obey leaders who act in contrary to the teachings of Christ?

Reference.
9 Bible verses about Honouring Rulers
1 Timothy 5:17 is speaking of Spiritual rulers/leaders as in bishops, Pastors, Etc.
Hebrews 13:17 is speaking of the same thing which is why it says"for they keep watch over your souls" they are the shepherds who keep watch over the flock and make sure we don't wander astray.
Acts 23:5 is simply saying we are not to speak evil of these people, which is no different from how we are to deal with/speak of all peoples regardless of position.
Romans 13 is speaking of the Spiritual powers ordained by God, his spiritual government and rulers and not world governments, they "3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:" the powers being spoken of here are never a terror unto good works but instead praise those who keep God's law and righteousness in every form.
1 Peter 2:17 says we are to honor all men, not just the king.
Jude 1:8 is not speaking of worldly powers. If we look at whose dominion and which dignities it is speaking of it is easy to see it is speaking of the Lord's dominion and his dignities.

8 Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities.

25 To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.

The dignities of God's dominion are his Angels. And his representatives on earth are his ministers.

1. So to answer your question we are to Honor all men(not just dignitaries) as brothers and sisters in Christ and not be disrespectful to them, regardless of their misdeeds. (1 Peter 2:17)

2. We obey these rulers because that is what we are commanded to do(1 peter 2:13-15; Matt 22:20-22), we are supposed to submit ourselves to these authorities when their laws do not break the law of Christ but if they do we are to obey God rather than men(Acts 5:27-29). But if their law breaks the law of Christ then we must obey God and suffer wrongfully(for good works: Romans 13:3; 1 Peter 3:17) at the hands these rulers(1 Peter 2:19-21).
 
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Shiloh Raven

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Respect and obey your leaders. Is this absolute or contextual? A number of times I have heard Christians defend Trump by saying something to the effect of respect and obey your leaders. This is troubling to me as why would any Christian respect and obey an ammoral leader whose actions run afoul of the teachings of Christ? Were the Christians in Germany during WWII to respect and obey a madman? Seems illogical to me.

Why would God command Christians to respect and obey leaders who act in contrary to the teachings of Christ?

Reference.
9 Bible verses about Honouring Rulers

How many of the Christians who say Christians are to respect and obey their leaders now that Trump is the president did that when Obama or Bill Clinton was still the president. Did they preach the same message or did they preach only obey government law when it doesn't contradict biblical teaching?
 
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Robert65

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Because God receives how we treat those in legitimate authority as if we were treating Him that way. Just because a person doesn't like Trump doesn't mean it is OK to reject what God has decided. It is a way to reveal that we are children of God and follow God in spite of our feeble understanding of the long-term effects of what God will do through that legitimate authority.

On a different note, any power we deny someone in the office of President will also affect the power of whoever is in that office in the future.

So those that carried out Hitler’s orders are absolved of the atrocities they committed because they were just following Hitler’s orders?
 
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Robert65

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1 Timothy 5:17 is speaking of Spiritual rulers/leaders as in bishops, Pastors, Etc.
Hebrews 13:17 is speaking of the same thing which is why it says"for they keep watch over your souls" they are the shepherds who keep watch over the flock and make sure we don't wander astray.
Acts 23:5 is simply saying we are not to speak evil of these people, which is no different from how we are to deal with/speak of all peoples regardless of position.
Romans 13 is speaking of the Spiritual powers ordained by God, his spiritual government and rulers and not world governments, they "3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:" the powers being spoken of here are never a terror unto good works but instead praise those who keep God's law and righteousness in every form.
1 Peter 2:17 says we are to honor all men, not just the king.
Jude 1:8 is not speaking of worldly powers. If we look at whose dominion and which dignities it is speaking of it is easy to see it is speaking of the Lord's dominion and his dignities.

8 Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities.

25 To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.

The dignities of God's dominion are his Angels. And his representatives on earth are his ministers.

1. So to answer your question we are to Honor all men(not just dignitaries) as brothers and sisters in Christ and not be disrespectful to them, regardless of their misdeeds. (1 Peter 2:17)

2. We obey these rulers because that is what we are commanded to do(1 peter 2:13-15; Matt 22:20-22), we are supposed to submit ourselves to these authorities when their laws do not break the law of Christ but if they do we are to obey God rather than men(Acts 5:27-29). But if their law breaks the law of Christ then we must obey God and suffer wrongfully(for good works: Romans 13:3; 1 Peter 3:17) at the hands these rulers(1 Peter 2:19-21).

Fair enough yet none the less many Christians use their interpretation of the above to justify supporting an amoral leader. I think your interpretation of the above Scripture makes a lot more sense than those who use Scripture to justify supporting morally bankrupt leaders.

Thanks for your perspective.
 
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Robert65

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How many of the Christians who say Christians are to respect and obey their leaders now that Trump is the president did that when Obama or Bill Clinton was still the president. Did they preach the same message or did they preach only obey government law when it doesn't contradict biblical teaching?

I do not know. I suspect some liberal Christians used the justification to support Clinton or Obama.
 
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StephenDiscipleofYHWH

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Fair enough yet none the less many Christians use their interpretation of the above to justify supporting an amoral leader. I think your interpretation of the above Scripture makes a lot more sense than those who use Scripture to justify supporting morally bankrupt leaders.

Thanks for your perspective.
I agree, I've met far to many people who use the above verses(and several others) to justify all manner of atrocities and unrighteousness.

Happy to help brother.
 
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dgiharris

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Because God receives how we treat those in legitimate authority as if we were treating Him that way. Just because a person doesn't like Trump doesn't mean it is OK to reject what God has decided. It is a way to reveal that we are children of God and follow God in spite of our feeble understanding of the long-term effects of what God will do through that legitimate authority.

On a different note, any power we deny someone in the office of President will also affect the power of whoever is in that office in the future.

I feel that Republicans say these sorts of things when they are the ones in power, i.e. support the President, but when a Dem is in power *cough Obama cough* then said Dem is the anti-Christ and it is the duty of every Christian to oppose him...

I don't mean to infer or imply that this is your view... I'm just sayin...
 
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Blynn

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Christians are to obey human law except where that human law violates God's Law.

I believe what is meant by respect is to respect the leader's authority over me or the authority of the office that they hold.

I will admit that I struggled with this when Obama was in office. I decided to respect him by not trashing him, doing my best to respect the fact that he was my President.
 
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TLK Valentine

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Because God receives how we treat those in legitimate authority as if we were treating Him that way.

Sounds like we should be treating Donald the way we would treat God... not sure how He would react, but I suspect he approves...
 
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Aryeh Jay

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Sounds like we should be treating Donald the way we would treat God... not sure how He would react, but I suspect he approves...

Let’s kill a cow on the White House lawn and see what happens.
 
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TLK Valentine

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Let’s kill a cow on the White House lawn and see what happens.

don't give them ideas -- they've dehumanized Hillary as it is...
 
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In a democracy, leaders "serve" at the will of the people. In a democratic republic, the people elect legislators to act in their behalf--but those legislators, too, serve at the will of the people.

In the case of Trump, "the people" have been waiting since January 20, 2017 to see if he is "serving" anyone but himself. Is he serving the common good? If he is not serving the common good then it is our responsibility as citizens to replace him with a true "servant leader," and to vote for checks and balances on November 6 to prevent him from hurting the common good further.
 
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Greg J.

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So those that carried out Hitler’s orders are absolved of the atrocities they committed because they were just following Hitler’s orders?
Sounds like we should be treating Donald the way we would treat God... not sure how He would react, but I suspect he approves...
Good effort to try to put words in my mouth.
 
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Shiloh Raven

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I feel that Republicans say these sorts of things when they are the ones in power, i.e. support the President, but when a Dem is in power *cough Obama cough* then said Dem is the anti-Christ and it is the duty of every Christian to oppose him...

I don't mean to infer or imply that this is your view... I'm just sayin...

If I were to guess a wager, I would bet that Donald Trump would have never been supported and defended like he is now by the Christian Right if he won the presidency as a liberal Democrat. I don't think it would have mattered what his policies were if he was a liberal Democratic president.
 
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TLK Valentine

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Good effort to try to put words in my mouth.

God receives how we treat Donald the same as He receives how we treat Himself.

Your words -- yes or no?
 
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