We could learn from the Jordanians.

OldWiseGuy · Mar 4, 2017

Jordan hangs 15 convicts at dawn, most in years

Since Americans are already desensitized to the heinous crimes committed here perhaps it's time to become less sensitive to the 'human rights' of our killers and rapists.

This might be a good place to start.

Police: 3 teen girls kidnapped by Salvadoran gang in Houston

Thoughts?

Desk trauma · Mar 4, 2017

OldWiseGuy said:
Since Americans are already desensitized to the heinous crimes committed here perhaps it's time to become less sensitive to the 'human rights' of our killers and rapists.

A state that is not concerned with human rights is a larger threat than violent criminals.

Nithavela · Mar 4, 2017

Why bother with human rights for anyone?

OldWiseGuy · Mar 4, 2017

Desk trauma said:
A state that is not concerned with human rights is a larger threat than violent criminals.

I agree. The State should be more concerned with victim's rights than criminal's rights. As it is victims are victimized twice; first by the criminal and then by the State. The result is that crime flourishes.

Desk trauma · Mar 4, 2017

OldWiseGuy said:
I agree. The State be more concerned with victim's rights than criminal's rights. As it is victims are victimized twice; first by the criminal and then by the State. The result is that crime flourishes.

This result is not supported by the facts. Crime has been on a steady decline for decades.

Greg J. · Mar 4, 2017

OldWiseGuy said:
Jordan hangs 15 convicts at dawn, most in years

Since Americans are already desensitized to the heinous crimes committed here perhaps it's time to become less sensitive to the 'human rights' of our killers and rapists.

This might be a good place to start.

Police: 3 teen girls kidnapped by Salvadoran gang in Houston

Thoughts?

I'm with you. No murderer has the right to create a situation where taxpayers have to pay several million dollars to care for him. Anything but death is a grace. Unfortunately, I think hearts have become so hard that capital punishment wouldn't reduce crime for long (but finances are enough motivation for it). However, the worst thing is when society teaches people that you can do anything and won't be killed for it. It creates a culture where people don't think God should be sending anyone to hell, instead of giving us a tangible display of the Truth to help people recognize all are accountable eternally for their actions and giving people good reason to listen to the Good News.

Nithavela · Mar 4, 2017

Greg J. said:
I'm with you. No murderer has the right to create a situation where taxpayers have to pay several million dollars to care for him.

Why even bother with a trial?

Desk trauma · Mar 4, 2017

Nithavela said:
Why even bother with a trial?

Due process: low energy, sad.

Moral Orel · Mar 4, 2017

Just as soon as we have a perfect justice system that never convicts innocent people ever, you got my vote!

OldWiseGuy · Mar 4, 2017

Desk trauma said:
This result is not supported by the facts. Crime has been on a steady decline for decades.

Isn't that largely due to longer prison sentences? And, criminals don't limit their illegal activities to a single type of offense but commit all sorts of crimes. While in prison all those crimes naturally decline. Note that there is criticism for the millions behind bars, yet it is this very fact that is responsible for much of the decline in crime.

So as long as we are on the right track let's expedite the death penalty and thus relieve crowding on death row. Recall that career criminals have been released because of simple overcrowding, and budget considerations as well. Not a good idea.

OldWiseGuy · Mar 4, 2017

Nithavela said:
Why even bother with a trial?

Really. Especially if we're convicting so many innocent people. Why you'd think everyone in prison was wrongly convicted (yet they remain in prison. Curious.) :scratch:

JackRT · Mar 4, 2017

The US justice system has in the past found the innocent guilty and has sometimes found out far too late. I just have to wonder if the Jordanians do any better.

Greg J. · Mar 4, 2017

JackRT said:
The US justice system has in the past found the innocent guilty and has sometimes found out far too late. I just have to wonder if the Jordanians do any better.

This is a good reason to not have capital punishment, except it is a single argument in a vast array of other arguments for and against it. And it is not the real reason many people are against capital punishment. It is because people are afraid of being unjustly executed themselves. Decisions based on fear are irrational and made without a realistic assessment of the results. In this case, hundreds of millions of people suffer as a result of that fear (receiving greater fear I might add). We are so ungodly that we have no ability as a society to evaluate whether to have capital punishment or not. Consider the amount of reasoning and opinion on the matter that does not include relying on God.

Nithavela · Mar 4, 2017

Greg J. said:
This is a good reason to not have capital punishment, except it is a single argument in a vast array of other arguments for and against it. And it is not the real reason many people are against capital punishment. It is because people are afraid of being unjustly executed themselves. Decisions based on fear are irrational and made without a realistic assessment of the results. In this case, hundreds of millions of people suffer as a result of that fear (receiving greater fear I might add). We are so ungodly that we have no ability as a society to evaluate whether to have capital punishment or not. Consider the amount of reasoning and opinion on the matter that does not include relying on God.

I'm not afraid. You can execute me anytime, as long as everyone else dies, too.

Nithavela · Mar 4, 2017

OldWiseGuy said:
Really. Especially if we're convicting so many innocent people. Why you'd think everyone in prison was wrongly convicted (yet they remain in prison. Curious.)

Yeah, some stay for 34 years, the lazy bums.

https://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/15/...son-murder-conviction-is-thrown-out.html?_r=0

Moral Orel · Mar 4, 2017

Greg J. said:
This is a good reason to not have capital punishment, except it is a single argument in a vast array of other arguments for and against it.

You don't weigh a decision based on the number of arguments for or against it. You make a decision based on the validity of those arguments. Each one carries it's own weight, it isn't a simply tally of pros/cons.

Greg J. said:
And it is not the real reason many people are against capital punishment. It is because people are afraid of being unjustly executed themselves.

No, the people who advocate this argument are against the death penalty because they believe it's wrong to kill innocent people.

Greg J. · Mar 4, 2017

One of the effects on society has been that people think that everyone is innocent, when in fact, everyone is guilty, and we can actually trust God to ensure He will grant grace at the right time to the right people according to his will. Governmental authorities are granted the sword by God's command, and they do not bear it for no reason. Do you think that all through time God's command has been invalid?—because there is nothing new about our society where it is now suddenly possible to accidentally find someone guilty of a crime they didn't commit. It is one of the effects of the sin of wanting humans to rule us. We are getting human reasoning and wisdom instead of God's will which takes into account the benefit to our great grandchildrens' society.

Nithavela · Mar 4, 2017

Greg J. said:
One of the effects on society has been that people think that everyone is innocent, when in fact, everyone is guilty, and we can actually trust God to ensure He will grant grace at the right time to the right people according to his will. Governmental authorities are granted the sword by God's command, and they do not bear it for no reason. Do you think that all through time God's command has been invalid?—because there is nothing new about our society where it is now suddenly possible to accidentally find someone guilty of a crime they didn't commit. It is one of the effects of the sin of wanting humans to rule us. We are getting human reasoning and wisdom instead of God's will which takes into account the benefit to our great grandchildrens' society.

I agree. Let's just drop all nukes and let god sort us out.

crjmurray · Mar 4, 2017

Let's not do this.

OldWiseGuy · Mar 4, 2017

Nicholas Deka said:
You don't weigh a decision based on the number of arguments for or against it. You make a decision based on the validity of those arguments. Each one carries it's own weight, it isn't a simply tally of pros/cons.

No, the people who advocate this argument are against the death penalty because they believe it's wrong to kill innocent people.

More innocent people are killed by released or escaped criminals that should have been executed than are wrongly killed by the State. So going by the numbers executing even a few innocents saves more innocent lives than not executing them. And, most of those who might be wrongly executed have criminal pasts, so they aren't really all that innocent.

We could learn from the Jordanians.

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our world is happy and mundane

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Wake me when it's soup.

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our world is happy and mundane

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our world is happy and mundane

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Wake me when it's soup.

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