I am not under the law, am dead to the law, and am delivered from the law...(a question)

disciple1 · Aug 30, 2016

Travis93 said:
God only loves those who love him, not everyone.
Deuteronomy 7:9 Know therefore that the LORD thy God, he is God, the faithful God, which keepeth covenant and mercy with them that love him and keep his commandments to a thousand generations;
Deuteronomy 7:10 And repayeth them that hate him to their face, to destroy them: he will not be slack to him that hateth him, he will repay him to his face.

Psalms 5:5 The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity.
Psalms 11:5 The LORD trieth the righteous: but the wicked and him that loveth violence his soul hateth.
Psalms 45:7 Thou lovest righteousness, and hatest wickedness: therefore God, thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

Jesus also hates people in rebellion to God.
Revelation 2:6 But this thou hast, that thou hatest the deeds of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate.
Revelation 2:14 But I have a few things against thee, because thou hast there them that hold the doctrine of Balaam, who taught Balac to cast a stumblingblock before the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed unto idols, and to commit fornication.
Revelation 2:15 So hast thou also them that hold the doctrine of the Nicolaitans, which thing I hate.
Even the writer of Hebrews knows this.
Hebrews 1:8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
Hebrews 1:9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

Tell me, if God loves everyone, why is he going to do this?
Revelation 14:11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.
Revelation 20:11 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
Revelation 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
Revelation 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Revelation 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Travis93 said:
God only loves those who love him, not everyone.

Your wrong a lot Travis.
Luke chapter 6

27 “But to you who are listening I say: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, 28 bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you. 29 If someone slaps you on one cheek, turn to them the other also. If someone takes your coat, do not withhold your shirt from them. 30 Give to everyone who asks you, and if anyone takes what belongs to you, do not demand it back. 31 Do to others as you would have them do to you.

32 “If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners love those who love them. 33 And if you do good to those who are good to you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners do that. 34 And if you lend to those from whom you expect repayment, what credit is that to you? Even sinners lend to sinners, expecting to be repaid in full. 35 But love your enemies, do good to them, and lend to them without expecting to get anything back. Then your reward will be great, and you will be children of the Most High, because he is kind to the ungrateful and wicked. 36 Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful.

giftofGod2 · Aug 30, 2016

Concerninng the exhortation to KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS, I say, Which?

In John 5:18 Jesus violated the sabbath commandment, and in Mark 7:15-19 with 1 Timothy 4:1-6 the New Testament testimony is that the Old Testament food laws concerning clean and unclean animals are no longer in effect. Also Acts 10:9-13, Acts 11:5-7.

LittleLambofJesus · Aug 30, 2016

Travis93 said: ↑
God only loves those who love him, not everyone.
Deuteronomy 7:9 Know therefore that the LORD thy God, he is God, the faithful God, which keepeth covenant and mercy with them that love him and keep his commandments to a thousand generations;...................

Travis93 said:
Ecclesiastes 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.

amadeois said:
The summary:

KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS.
GOD'S COMMANDMENTS.
ALL OF THEM.

giftofGod2 said:
Concerning the exhortation to KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS, I say, Which?

In John 5:18 Jesus violated the sabbath commandment, and in Mark 7:15-19 with 1 Timothy 4:1-6 the New Testament testimony is that the Old Testament food laws concerning clean and unclean animals are no longer in effect.
Also Acts 10:9-13, Acts 11:5-7.

Good point..........

Mark 7:7
Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
[Matt 15:9, Titus 1:14]

Titus 1:14
Not giving heed to Jewish fables and commandments of men, that turn from the Truth.

Reve 14:12
Here the endurance of the Saints is, the ones keeping the commandments of YAHWEH and the Faith of JESUS.
Rev 22:14
Blessed are those who do His commandments,
that they may have the right to the tree of the life, and may enter through the gates into the city.

........................................

disciple1 · Aug 30, 2016

giftofGod2 said:
Concerninng the exhortation to KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS, I say, Which?

In John 5:18 Jesus violated the sabbath commandment, and in Mark 7:15-19 with 1 Timothy 4:1-6 the New Testament testimony is that the Old Testament food laws concerning clean and unclean animals are no longer in effect. Also Acts 10:9-13, Acts 11:5-7.

Here I believe is the only command we need to keep.
Matthew chapter 25 verses 31-46
When the Son of Man comes" in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his throne in heavenly glory. All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. he will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left. Then the King will say to those on his right, Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me. then the righteous will answer him, Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? When did we see you sick or in prison and got visit you? The King will reply, I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me. Then he will say to those on his left, Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.They also will answer, Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you? He will reply, I tell you the truth, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me. Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.

amadeois · Aug 30, 2016

These verses are not a command, they are the explanation that Jesus gives about the "JUDGEMENT OF THE GENTILES."

These are the consequences:

Eternal life, or
Everlasting punishment.

disciple1 · Aug 30, 2016

amadeois said:
These verses are not a command, they are the explanation that Jesus gives about the "JUDGEMENT OF THE GENTILES."

These are the consequences:

Eternal life, or
Everlasting punishment.

Galatians chapter 5 verse 6
The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself in love.

amadeois · Aug 30, 2016

So we are in agreement that "faith which worked by love."

Love God and obey His commsndments, all of them, and

Love your neighbour.

Jesus summarized the law and the prophets on the above 2 COMMANDS.

amadeois · Aug 30, 2016

Fear God is presented 314 times in the word.

3 of those are translated as REVERENCE:

Leviticus 19:30 and Leviticus 26:2

Ye shall keep my sabbaths, and REVERENCE my sanctuary: I am the LORD.

Psalms 89:7

God is greatly to be feared (H6206='arats) in the assembly of the saints, and to be had in REVERENCE of all them that are about him.

The REVERENCE word is yare' = H3372.

So Ecclesiastes is telling you to HONOR God. He is the Creator so you should respect Him as such.

And how do you do that?
By keeping His commandments.

Honoring Him is also the outmost sign of worship.

Worship is to honor, have respect, God.

You SHOULD worship Him all the time. Not only 2 hours on Sunday. (Wrong day)

What is done on Sunday is praise.

disciple1 · Aug 30, 2016

amadeois said:
So we are in agreement that "faith which worked by love."

Love God and obey His commsndments, all of them, and

Love your neighbour.

Jesus summarized the law and the prophets on the above 2 COMMANDS.

You don't obey his commandments no one does.
1 John chapter 1 verse 8
If anyone claims to be without sin they deceive themselves and the truth is not in them.
James chapter 2 verse 10
If anyone keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it.
Or are you one of those people who say you keep his commands just not perfectly, if you don't keep it perfectly you don't keep it.

amadeois · Aug 30, 2016

How about Jesus own words:

Matthew 5:48

"Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect."

bugkiller · Aug 30, 2016

amadeois said:
How about Jesus own words:

Matthew 5:48

"Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect."

Nothing but another bad translation. The passage bugged me for a very long time before I looked into it. It would be better translated as be complete. I would use the word mature except most would not understand it. The passage can not possibly mean what the common understanding seem to be. No one can be perfect as the law shows.

bugkiller

LittleLambofJesus · Aug 30, 2016

amadeois said:
These verses are not a command, they are the explanation that Jesus gives about the "JUDGEMENT OF THE GENTILES."

These are the consequences:

Eternal life, or
Everlasting punishment.

And what sayeth St Paul about both Jews and Gentiles:

Romans 2:
1 You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge another, you are condemning yourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things. 2 Now we know that God’s judgment against those who do such things is based on truth. 3 So when you, a mere human being, pass judgment on them and yet do the same things, do you think you will escape God’s judgment? 4 Or do you show contempt for the riches of his kindness, forbearance and patience, not realizing that God’s kindness is intended to lead you to repentance?

5 But because of your stubbornness and your unrepentant heart, you are storing up wrath against yourself for the day of God’s wrath, when his righteous judgment will be revealed. 6God “will repay each person according to what they have done.”a 7 To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. 8 But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger.
9 There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile;
10 but glory, honor and peace for everyone who does good: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile.
11 For God does not show favoritism.

12 All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. 13 For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God’s sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous. 14 (Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law.

.

LittleLambofJesus · Aug 30, 2016

bugkiller said:
Nothing but another bad translation. The passage bugged me for a very long time before I looked into it. It would be better translated as be complete. I would use the word mature except most would not understand it. The passage can not possibly mean what the common understanding seem to be. No one can be perfect as the law shows.

bugkiller

Interesting post bugsy.
I only found 1 Bible version that uses the word "complete" and appears to be the main meaning of that the greek word #5046. Never noticed that before

http://biblehub.com/matthew/5-48.htm

Weymouth New Testament
You however are to be complete in goodness, as your Heavenly Father is complete.

5046. teleios from 5056; complete (in various applications of labor, growth, mental and moral character, etc.); neuter (as noun, with 3588) completeness:--of full age, man, perfect.

https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/Lexicon/Lexicon.cfm?strongs=G5046&t=KJV
Strong's Number G5046 matches the Greek τέλειος (teleios),which occurs 19 times in 17 verses in the Greek concordance

Mat 5:48
Be G2071 ye G5210 therefore G3767 perfect, G5046 even G5618 as your G5216 Father G3962 which G3588 is in G1722 heaven G3772 is G2076 perfect. G5046

[URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/rom/12/2/s_1058002']Rom 12:2
And G2532 be G4964 G0 not G3361 conformed G4964 to this G5129 world: G165 but G235 be ye transformed G3339 by the renewing G342 of your G5216 mind, G3563 that G1519 ye G5209 may prove G1381 what G5101 is that good, G18 and G2532 acceptable, G2101 and G2532 perfect, G5046 will G2307 of God. G2316[/URL]

.

bugkiller · Aug 30, 2016

LittleLambofJesus said:
Interesting post bugsy.
I only found 1 Bible version that uses the word "complete" and appears to be the main meaning of that the greek word #5046. Never noticed that before

http://biblehub.com/matthew/5-48.htm

Weymouth New Testament
You however are to be complete in goodness, as your Heavenly Father is complete.

5046. teleios from 5056; complete (in various applications of labor, growth, mental and moral character, etc.); neuter (as noun, with 3588) completeness:--of full age, man, perfect.

https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/Lexicon/Lexicon.cfm?strongs=G5046&t=KJV
Strong's Number G5046 matches the Greek τέλειος (teleios),which occurs 19 times in 17 verses in the Greek concordance

Mat 5:48
Be G2071 ye G5210 therefore G3767 perfect, G5046 even G5618 as your G5216 Father G3962 which G3588 is in G1722 heaven G3772 is G2076 perfect. G5046

[URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/rom/12/2/s_1058002']Rom 12:2 [/URL]
[URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/rev/3/2/s_1170002'][URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/rev/3/2/s_1170002'][URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/rev/3/2/s_1170002'][URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/rev/3/2/s_1170002'][URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/rev/3/2/s_1170002'][URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/rev/3/2/s_1170002']And [URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/Lexicon/Lexicon.cfm?strongs=G2532&t=KJV']G2532 be G4964 G0 not G3361 conformed G4964 to this G5129 world: G165 but G235 be ye transformed G3339 by the renewing G342 of your G5216 mind, G3563 that G1519 ye G5209 may prove G1381 what G5101 is that good, G18 and G2532 acceptable, G2101 and G2532 perfect, G5046 will G2307 of God. G2316.[/URL][/URL][/URL][/URL][/URL][/URL]
[URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/rev/3/2/s_1170002'][URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/rev/3/2/s_1170002'][URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/rev/3/2/s_1170002'][URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/rev/3/2/s_1170002'][URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/rev/3/2/s_1170002'][URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/rev/3/2/s_1170002'][/URL][/URL][/URL][/URL][/URL][/URL][/URL]

[URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/rev/3/2/s_1170002'][URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/rev/3/2/s_1170002'][URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/rev/3/2/s_1170002'][URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/rev/3/2/s_1170002'][URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/rev/3/2/s_1170002'][URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/rev/3/2/s_1170002'][URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/rev/3/2/s_1170002']Leave it to you. Thanks for the back up.

bugkiller[/URL][/URL][/URL][/URL][/URL][/URL][/URL]

Travis93 · Aug 31, 2016

amadeois said:
How about Jesus own words:

Matthew 5:48

"Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect."

Genesis 17:1 And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect.
Deuteronomy 18:13 Thou shalt be perfect with the LORD thy God.

disciple1 · Aug 31, 2016

amadeois said:
How about Jesus own words:

Matthew 5:48

"Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect."

Hebrews chapter 7

11. If perfection could have been attained through the Levitical priesthood (for on the basis of it the law was given to the people), why was there still need for another priest to come--one in the order of Melchizedek, not in the order of Aaron?

12. For when there is a change of the priesthood, there must also be a change of the law.

18. The former regulation is set aside because it was weak and useless

19. (for the law made nothing perfect), and a better hope is introduced, by which we draw near to God.

Romans chapter 9 verses 30-Romans chapter 10 verse 4
What then shall we say? That the Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have obtained it, a righteousness that is by faith; but Israel, who pursued a law of righteousness, has not attained it. Why not? Because they pursued it not by faith but as if it were by works. They stumbled over the stumbling stone. As it is written: See, I lay in Zion a stone that causes men to stumble and a rock that makes them fall, and the one who trusts in him will never be put to shame. Brothers my heart's desire and prayer to God for the Israelites is that they may be saved. For I can testify about them that they are Zealous for God, but their zeal is not based on knowledge. Since they did not know the righteousness that comes from God and sought to establish their own the did not submit to God's righteousness, Christ is the end of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes.

amadeois · Aug 31, 2016

The end of the law. The last part of the law. Not to be abolished.

Jesus said it himself. I come to complete it. He is the last part, so there will be NO more changes.

Jesus is the law.

How?

Changes were made.

Why?

He had to redeem everybody back to His Father on the Sabbath day. Not Sunday.

To redo what Adam had destroyed with sin, desobedience to God. If you are desobedient, you pay the price. The wages of sin: death. Spiritual death.

So, is everybody going to be saved?

Revelation says that some people will end up in the lake of fire together with the dragon, the beast and the false prophet. For eternal damnation.

Those are the unbelievers that do not want to accept the gift.

Some are those that have been deceived by the Dragon in a very SUBTLE way.

They believe that they have the truth, that is right in front of their eyes but they don't see it.

They have not obtained refined golf, white linen clothes and eye salve. No idea what that means.

Eye salve to see the TRUTH.

amadeois · Aug 31, 2016

Gold not golf. It is par for the course of life to be deceived if you don't have the eye salve.

disciple1 · Aug 31, 2016

amadeois said:
The end of the law. The last part of the law. Not to be abolished.

Jesus said it himself. I come to complete it. He is the last part, so there will be NO more changes.

Jesus is the law.

How?

Changes were made.

Why?

He had to redeem everybody back to His Father on the Sabbath day. Not Sunday.

To redo what Adam had destroyed with sin, desobedience to God. If you are desobedient, you pay the price. The wages of sin: death. Spiritual death.

So, is everybody going to be saved?

Revelation says that some people will end up in the lake of fire together with the dragon, the beast and the false prophet. For eternal damnation.

Those are the unbelievers that do not want to accept the gift.

Some are those that have been deceived by the Dragon in a very SUBTLE way.

They believe that they have the truth, that is right in front of their eyes but they don't see it.

They have not obtained refined golf, white linen clothes and eye salve. No idea what that means.

Eye salve to see the TRUTH.

1 Timothy chapter 1 verse7, 8
They want to be teachers of the law but they do not know what they are talking about or what they so confidently affirm.
We know that the law is good if one uses it properly.
Galatians chapter 3 verses 24,25,23
So the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith. Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law. Before this faith came, we were held prisoners by the law, locked up until faith should be revealed.
Hebrews chapter 7

11. If perfection could have been attained through the Levitical priesthood (for on the basis of it the law was given to the people), why was there still need for another priest to come--one in the order of Melchizedek, not in the order of Aaron?

12. For when there is a change of the priesthood, there must also be a change of the law.

18. The former regulation is set aside because it was weak and useless

19. (for the law made nothing perfect), and a better hope is introduced, by which we draw near to God.
Love is the only thing that makes anything perfect.

LittleLambofJesus · Aug 31, 2016

amadeois said:
The end of the law. The last part of the law. Not to be abolished.

Jesus said it himself. I come to complete it. He is the last part, so there will be NO more changes.
Eye salve to see the TRUTH.

Yes Jesus completed it all for OC Judah and Israel with the destruction of Jerusalem, it's Temple/Sanctuary and High priesthood [which I and a lot of others believe is that Great City in Revelation, IMHO]

John 19:30
When then the Jesus had received/got the vinegar, He said "It is finished"! and reclining the head He gives-up the spirit.

Reve 1:18
and the living One! And I became dead and behold! I am living into the Ages of the Ages,
and I am having the Keys of the Hades and of the Death

Reve 16:17
and the seventh Messenger pours out the bowl of him into the air and came out great Voice from the Sanctuary of the heaven from the throne saying "it is finished!".

Revelation 21:6
and He said to me, `It is finished!
I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End;
I, to him who is thirsting, will give of the fountain of the water of the life freely;

.

I am not under the law, am dead to the law, and am delivered from the law...(a question)

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Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

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Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

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