Course Correction for the Church?

steve_bakr · Sep 21, 2013

I borrow the term "course correction" from 20th century Catholic theologian Karl Rahner and chose it over the "c"-word (change, of course) because he thought it possible for such an adjustment to be made without upending or contradicting the teachings of the Church.

What is a course correction? In this case it seems to be a shift in emphasis. This shift seems pastoral in nature. It seems the new emphasis is on Christ's love and compassion; essentially, it is a call for the Church to demonstrate more love to the people who may not be in agreement with Her.

For there to be a new emphasis, there must be a de-emphasis somewhere else. The de-emphasis seems to be the kind of contention seen in the 2012 election.

The more I hear about the Pope, I see similarities with Karl Rahner (for information on Rahner, see: Buller, The Theology of Karl Rahner). This stands to reason because Rahner was a Jesuit like Francis.

The Jesuits look to St. Ignatius for spiritual direction. Ignatius believed that we encounter God in the ordinary moments of our life. Rahner spilled a lot of ink developing this idea.

One of the important ideas that Rahner developed was that things and events in the world are what mediates our reception of God's grace.

But how does all this apply to Pope Francis and the Church? For one thing, Francis is not going to set up a "Church vs the world" atmosphere or paradigm. He is going to have a dialogue with the world instead of condeming it.

The second thing seems to reflect back to something Rahner taught. That is, grace is available to all people at all times. More specifically, grace already exists in us as the fundamental "self-communication" of God. For the development of Rahner's thought on grace, see the aforementioned book.

This thought may have been demonstrated by Francis in his replies to press inquiries about his view of gays. Francis said that God is present in their lives. Perhaps more specifically in Rahnerian terms, God's grace is being communicated to them and they should therefore be treated with love. Whether this grace is accepted or made use of is perhaps a topic for further discussion.

gurneyhalleck1 · Sep 21, 2013

I sometimes wonder what the point is of my papal threads in here. And I don't say that insultingly. What I mean is this---someone puts up a post saying, "Pope Francis is going to end celibacy, totally change the Catholic Church, and alter the course of...."

What happens every time?

a) Most Catholics believe the pope is Peter, infallible, supreme in jurisdiction, and the Holy Spirit guides him correctly no matter what. They won't criticize him EVER. So whatever he does, they'll agree with it and say the article is a media distortion

b) The hardcore liberal Catholic hopes to God that Francis will bring us women priests and change the catechism to include homosexuality as a beautiful expression of sexuality and let people have abortions

c) The non-Catholic just reads it and sees it from a totally different angle in the greater scheme of things.

These 3 reactions are predictable and as sure as the sun rises, they'll be the only responses: HE KNOWS WHAT HE'S DOING, IT'S ALL GOOD! or it'll be THANKS BE TO GOD, THE POPE IS LIBERAL AND GOING TO UNDO THIS CONSERVATIVE JUNK! or thirdly THE POPE ISN'T MY PATRIARCH...INTERESTING....

steve_bakr · Sep 22, 2013

gurneyhalleck1 said:
I sometimes wonder what the point is of my papal threads in here. And I don't say that insultingly. What I mean is this---someone puts up a post saying, "Pope Francis is going to end celibacy, totally change the Catholic Church, and alter the course of...."

What happens every time?

a) Most Catholics believe the pope is Peter, infallible, supreme in jurisdiction, and the Holy Spirit guides him correctly no matter what. They won't criticize him EVER. So whatever he does, they'll agree with it and say the article is a media distortion

b) The hardcore liberal Catholic hopes to God that Francis will bring us women priests and change the catechism to include homosexuality as a beautiful expression of sexuality and let people have abortions

c) The non-Catholic just reads it and sees it from a totally different angle in the greater scheme of things.

These 3 reactions are predictable and as sure as the sun rises, they'll be the only responses: HE KNOWS WHAT HE'S DOING, IT'S ALL GOOD! or it'll be THANKS BE TO GOD, THE POPE IS LIBERAL AND GOING TO UNDO THIS CONSERVATIVE JUNK! or thirdly THE POPE ISN'T MY PATRIARCH...INTERESTING....

Actiually, the Pope has used the word, "change" several times, and I think what the Pope has been saying is noteworthy enough to warrant discussion and excitement.

In response to your observations:

a) Papal infallibility is a bit more complicated than what you have characterized. It is actually a rare occurence of being "ex-cathedra." Be that as it may, I am behind what the Pope has said and support him.

b) The "hard core liberal Catholic" is as an extreme representation as the "ultra-conservative traditionalist." There exists a wide spectrum of Catholics in between. Most Catholics know that the Pope is not going to alter accepted Catholic doctrine. What he is talking about is an emphasis on the love and compassion of Christ.

c) I think this Pope is going to be a good communicator to non-Catholics.

What are your thoughts on what the Pope has said?

Fantine · Sep 22, 2013

What an exceptionally negative response to a beautiful, enlightening insight about Pope Francis.

I appreciate your insights, Steve.

And I think the idea that "liberals" want "women priests, homosexuality, and abortion" is the kind of silly, one-dimensional interpretation that only a hyperfocused social conservative could come up with.

I don't think that liberals want any of those things. What they want is an emphasis on collegiality, shared responsibility, openness, and spirituality. As Steve said, they want a Church that interacts with the world rather than warring against it. Will that kind of Church result in women priests someday? I won't stir the pot by answering that question, but it will certainly result in a greater role for women in the Church, which is a good thing--in a world with so much need, drawing from the wisdom of only half the earth's population is a foolish action motivated by fear and the desire to retain power.

AvilaSurfer · Sep 22, 2013

1. Yes, the media does have an innate ability to misinterpret what anyone says.
2. Stir all you want, there will be no women priests.

Erose · Sep 22, 2013

gurneyhalleck1 said:
I sometimes wonder what the point is of my papal threads in here. And I don't say that insultingly. What I mean is this---someone puts up a post saying, "Pope Francis is going to end celibacy, totally change the Catholic Church, and alter the course of...."

What happens every time?

a) Most Catholics believe the pope is Peter, infallible, supreme in jurisdiction, and the Holy Spirit guides him correctly no matter what. They won't criticize him EVER. So whatever he does, they'll agree with it and say the article is a media distortion

b) The hardcore liberal Catholic hopes to God that Francis will bring us women priests and change the catechism to include homosexuality as a beautiful expression of sexuality and let people have abortions

c) The non-Catholic just reads it and sees it from a totally different angle in the greater scheme of things.

These 3 reactions are predictable and as sure as the sun rises, they'll be the only responses: HE KNOWS WHAT HE'S DOING, IT'S ALL GOOD! or it'll be THANKS BE TO GOD, THE POPE IS LIBERAL AND GOING TO UNDO THIS CONSERVATIVE JUNK! or thirdly THE POPE ISN'T MY PATRIARCH...INTERESTING....

Quite honestly it is more perception than truth. Much of what is being wrote about the pope isn't true, especially the pope Benedict. I don't see a change in direction of the Church. I see pope Francis following in the footsteps of the popes before. The media's perception and sadly most Catholic's perception is that there has been a shift. The only shift is that we have a pope now who is media savy enough to dupe the media enough that he ends up staying in the media. I see the current pope, changing nothing, but making the world think he is and has.

steve_bakr · Sep 22, 2013

Erose said:
Quite honestly it is more perception than truth. Much of what is being wrote about the pope isn't true, especially the pope Benedict. I don't see a change in direction of the Church. I see pope Francis following in the footsteps of the popes before. The media's perception and sadly most Catholic's perception is that there has been a shift. The only shift is that we have a pope now who is media savy enough to dupe the media enough that he ends up staying in the media. I see the current pope, changing nothing, but making the world think he is and has.

So, you are accusing Pope Francis of practicing deception? What's that all about?

scraparcs · Sep 22, 2013

It sounds like he is trying to minister to those caught up in the Church's recent focus on abortion, contraception, and homosexuality. The Church still has a duty to demonstrate the love of God to the woman who may have children, but also had an abortion; to the couple that struggles to feed their children and has chosen contraception for a time; to the gay person that can't imagine a life with an opposite sex partner nor a celibate life. They've all heard so many times that they're sinners, sinful, evil opponents of the Church.

A shift in emphasis might well be what is dearly needed.

Erose · Sep 22, 2013

steve_bakr said:
So, you are accusing Pope Francis of practicing deception? What's that all about?

No that isn't what I am saying Steve, so lay off trying setup a shock statement. Pope Francis is just claiming what the Church, including his recent predecessors taught as well. There is no true difference between pope Francis' teaching and pope Benedict's except that pope Francis knows better how to handle the media. The biggest difference I think between the current pope and the previous one, is that pope Francis is much more media savy.

He knows the perceptions of the Catholic Church out there, and even though they are false perceptions, ie the Church focuses more on abortion and gay marriage than taken care the poor, as an example. This obviously is a false perception, but instead of fighting against that perception, he uses it a says what is already true, ie the Church needs to focus more on the poor and bringing Christ's mercy into the world; and gets the media to parrot that and voila the media is out there proclaiming that the Church is going to start focusing on the poor and bringing mercy into the world, which hopefully will resonate with those who have bought into the false perceptions.

Franny50 · Sep 22, 2013

I think what the Pope was trying to say was that people are welcome in the church even if they do not share every belief.However abortion is still wrong,although as a liberal Catholic,I support birth control and the idea of women Priests.

Erose · Sep 23, 2013

Franny50 said:
I think what the Pope was trying to say was that people are welcome in the church even if they do not share every belief.

True. The point I am making is this has not changed. It has been this way under the previous popes as well. Maybe a difference would be his emphasis of calling out the non-orthodox Catholics, ie the conservatives, liberal, progressive, traditional, etc. and telling them that they have no right to judge who is and is not Catholic. That all of us are at a different point in our faith journey, and as we all know this journey of faith is usually, particularly at the beginning, messy.

Fantine · Sep 23, 2013

Erose said:
True. The point I am making is this has not changed. It has been this way under the previous popes as well. Maybe a difference would be his emphasis of calling out the non-orthodox Catholics, ie the conservatives, liberal, progressive, traditional, etc. and telling them that they have no right to judge who is and is not Catholic. That all of us are at a different point in our faith journey, and as we all know this journey of faith is usually, particularly at the beginning, messy.

Beautiful summation.

Erose · Sep 23, 2013

We must all strive for true orthodoxy, but I don't think none of us start as an orthodox Catholic. We out of our preconditioning and quite frankly pride, come to the table unorthodox initially. It is through our journey as Catholics that we should start loosing those preconditions and our pride, and become more and more trusting of the Church in that what it teaches is a much better paradigm than my personal paradigm.

Obedience is the one virtue that seems to take a lifetime to perfect. As Americans we are taught to be individualistic, our own person, and that is well and good to a certain point; but as a Catholic we have to go beyond our own individualism, and give it all to Christ: to become Christ. Not just in our individual Churches and our homes, but also to the everyone else. This mentality is what will change the world.

On a side note, I do think that our pope(s) do realize that the reason for so many Catholics holding onto those preconditions, i.e. contraception, abortion, gay marriage, exclusive church, the rejection of Vatican II, etc., is due to the Church over the last 50 plus years not doing a very good job in presenting the case of why these things are wrong and should be rejected. This I think through the New Evangelization efforts is being corrected, but like all things in the Church it looks like a slow process to us, but change is afoot. We are finally getting new bishops ordained in this country, and I would assume in all countries, who are orthodox Catholics, and not conservative or liberal or whatever other label Catholics. And we need to thank God for that. For more than ever we need orthodox Bishops leading our flocks.

steve_bakr · Sep 23, 2013

Erose said:
No that isn't what I am saying Steve, so lay off trying setup a shock statement. Pope Francis is just claiming what the Church, including his recent predecessors taught as well. There is no true difference between pope Francis' teaching and pope Benedict's except that pope Francis knows better how to handle the media. The biggest difference I think between the current pope and the previous one, is that pope Francis is much more media savy.

He knows the perceptions of the Catholic Church out there, and even though they are false perceptions, ie the Church focuses more on abortion and gay marriage than taken care the poor, as an example. This obviously is a false perception, but instead of fighting against that perception, he uses it a says what is already true, ie the Church needs to focus more on the poor and bringing Christ's mercy into the world; and gets the media to parrot that and voila the media is out there proclaiming that the Church is going to start focusing on the poor and bringing mercy into the world, which hopefully will resonate with those who have bought into the false perceptions.

OK, this and your subsequent posts give me a little better understanding of where you're coming from.

MKJ · Sep 23, 2013

Erose said:
True. The point I am making is this has not changed. It has been this way under the previous popes as well. Maybe a difference would be his emphasis of calling out the non-orthodox Catholics, ie the conservatives, liberal, progressive, traditional, etc. and telling them that they have no right to judge who is and is not Catholic. That all of us are at a different point in our faith journey, and as we all know this journey of faith is usually, particularly at the beginning, messy.

It's true that this has always been true. But I think in the last number of years, many people have begun to associate church positions with hard political positions.

Erose · Sep 23, 2013

MKJ said:
It's true that this has always been true. But I think in the last number of years, many people have begun to associate church positions with hard political positions.

And why is that? (Not trying to be crass) It due to those "liberal" and "conservative" Catholics politicizing the Church positions. I mean when the Catholic Church comes out and supports some form of immigration reform, the politically conservative Catholics will accuse the Church for being too liberal; and when the Church comes out and rejects the healthcare mandate on contraceptives, etc. the liberals accuse the Church for being too conservative. I mean if you ask a conservative if the Church is liberal or conservative, he will most probably say liberal; and ask a liberal she will say it is too conservative.

There are just some people who are more political than religious; and pope Francis is trying to get people to be more religious than political.

Erose · Sep 23, 2013

steve_bakr said:
OK, this and your subsequent posts give me a little better understanding of where you're coming from.

Steve in my past I have been at one point either a "liberal" or "conservative" Catholic. And as I have gotten older, and quite honestly this has been a relatively new phase in my religious life, I no longer identify with either. I identify with the Church, because finally I am convinced without a shadow of doubt that the Church's paradigm is it. Not the conservative or liberal paradigm, but the Church's. Liberals will still call me a conservative, and conservatives will call me liberal, which is fine; because that is what they do to the Church.

MKJ · Sep 23, 2013

Erose said:
And why is that? (Not trying to be crass) It due to those "liberal" and "conservative" Catholics politicizing the Church positions. I mean when the Catholic Church comes out and supports some form of immigration reform, the politically conservative Catholics will accuse the Church for being too liberal; and when the Church comes out and rejects the healthcare mandate on contraceptives, etc. the liberals accuse the Church for being too conservative. I mean if you ask a conservative if the Church is liberal or conservative, he will most probably say liberal; and ask a liberal she will say it is too conservative.

There are just some people who are more political than religious; and pope Francis is trying to get people to be more religious than political.

Oh I agree that is the reason. And I think it is high time someone tried to reign it in.

I don't think though it is the fault of non-Christians when they do not realize that is the cause. That's why it is actually important to stop it, that is one of the areas where people who are not Christian see the face of the Church.

The fact that these people have used the Church as a political tool has been really damaging. Even bishops are complicit. I think they probably think they are doing the right thing - it is like people who are passionate about abortion and so insist on being partisan in that cause - they think that can be a tool for the Church to fight abortion.

What they don't realize though is that in doing so they have made the Church the tool of partisan political causes. Which has many many bad effects for the Church, in many ways undermining everything thing it says and its moral authority.

princess_ballet · Sep 23, 2013

MKJ said:
Oh I agree that is the reason. And I think it is high time someone tried to reign it in.

I don't think though it is the fault of non-Christians when they do not realize that is the cause. That's why it is actually important to stop it, that is one of the areas where people who are not Christian see the face of the Church.

The fact that these people have used the Church as a political tool has been really damaging. Even bishops are complicit. I think they probably think they are doing the right thing - it is like people who are passionate about abortion and so insist on being partisan in that cause - they think that can be a tool for the Church to fight abortion.

What they don't realize though is that in doing so they have made the Church the tool of partisan political causes. Which has many many bad effects for the Church, in many ways undermining everything thing it says and its moral authority.

I would argue that is absolutely nothing new at all. Not since the time of Luther, Henry VIII, Tindale, etc. Even before then the church was used as a pawn for the kings of Europe.

I think the difference now is that we can recognize it better.

Fantine · Sep 23, 2013

Pope Francis is on the right track connecting abortion to all other social justice issues.

The reason why liberal Catholics and Christians fail to vote for those who are cynically and euphemistically labeled "pro-life" candidates is that for every small incremental gain they might realize on the abortion front, all the other social justice issues would be seriously harmed.

Quite frankly, they believe that decimating the social safety net programs--most of which would affect people they know, love, and have relationships--in order to potentially make a statistically insignificant difference in the number of abortions--of pre-born people they DON'T know, love, or have relationships with--is unacceptable.

They would happily take up the pro-life cause as part of a comprehensive social justice platform.

What is most troubling to me about pro-lifers are the ones who think that abortion is the only social justice issue, and who not only vote for conservatives reluctantly and hesitantly, doing penance for a month for all the people their votes will harm, but who vote for them enthusiastically and vociferously.

I am horrified.
I am shocked.
I am appalled.
I am stunned.

If you vote for one of these candidates and say you're pro-life, at least have the grace to be embarrassed and apologetic about it.

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