Son of Israel
Well-Known Member
Sunlover's post;
Miracles were always performed in the ministry of evangelism of the early church from what I see in scripture.
Except when they weren't of course.
(Some were told to keep it to themselves iirc)
The gift of healing wasn't used for personal reasons, like healing friends just because they were sick. For example,
Except when they were.
Perhaps you're mistaken. Could be possible.
I can think offhand of Lazerus. Thats one!
IIRC, He did it as a personal favor for Mary and Martha.
That and we are all considered "Personal friends of God"
(1Ti 5:23) Drink no longer water, but use a little wine for thy stomach's sake and thine often infirmities.
This would be an entirely pointless recommendation by Paul if apostles were abundant and within calling distance, AND if it was acceptable to heal christians just because of their "often infirmities".
I wear glasses to read but last December when I had a walnut sized lump
I went to the church and a lady laid hands on me and i was healed.
And also, I do take a little wine for my stomach and for my nerves
Or how about when Paul's dear brother Epaphroditus was sick near death?
(Php 2:26) For he longed after you all, and was full of heaviness, because that ye had heard that he had been sick.
(Php 2:27) For indeed he was sick nigh unto death: but God had mercy on him; and not on him only, but on me also, lest I should have sorrow upon sorrow.
Why wouldn't Paul have healed Epaphroditus? Paul was an apostle evangelizing and healing at will. Yet he didn't think to heal Epaphroditus, and if he did, he sure didn't admit to being tempted to.
27 Indeed he was ill, and almost died. But God had mercy on him,
and not on him only but also on me, to spare me sorrow upon sorrow.
This passage doesn't really give us any sort of information
on when, how or what exactly went on... It says he was sick
and God had mercy.
- "He was ill"
- He almost died
- God had mercy on Him.
- And God had mercy on me
Yet today, we "hear" that pentes claim to regularly perform miracles of healing upon each other. Not only that, but pray for jobs and marriages and finances etc etc as though God is some kind of a personal needs lottery maching that if you crank the handle enough, the chance something comes out of it for ones self gets better and better. Something is very wrong there it sure seems to me. Why not instead pray for the things that He promises to answer?
Amen. I ONLY pray for the things He promises.
Who'd want anything else?!
Why didn't Paul heal Epaphroditus? Could it be that it was because Epaphroditus was a Christian?
It doesn't say or imply that paul didn't heal him.
We really don't know how He came about his healing
Isn't a Christians concern to be saved from their sins and all else means nothing anymore? That is what it means to me. To be perfected in Spirit, to be at peace and joy in the Holy Spirit regardless of what happens in this world, that is my rest in the Lord.
My real concern is to do my Father's will.
We do have an enemy who would like us to
think that our health and well being is of
no importance.. but it is to God and it is
to our loved ones.
"Healed" The REAL meaning of being "saved"...
No it's not the real meaning.
Healed is often used throughout the NT
by Jesus Himself when "healing" people.
(Jas 5:14) Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:
(Jas 5:15) And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him.
Here we see that our prayer for a sick brother's sins to be forgiven is a real thing. It is a prayer for him to be "saved". So that he can be "raised up".
What does that mean?
It's quite clear what it means.
If his sins are forgiven and his body dies he is "raised up" in eternal life.
Even if he survives and is raised up from his sickness back into this world, it is still all about his sins being forgiven, not his illness being healed.
The passage is speaking of any who are physically ill being made well.
It's written to Christians who are already "saved".
What other healing do we want!? lol! Why aren't we desiring for that final disease to take us out of this world? I'm ready
Because we need to desire HIS will.
Jesus went around healing all who were "oppressed of the devil".
If someone is "oppressed" of the devil.. who's going to help them?!
WE, His body, HIS arms and hands to lay on their heads.
HIS love to wrap around them and comfort them.
As He is, SO are WE, in this world.
Let your will be done on earth
AS IT IS IN HEAVEN
Hmmm. His will ISNT done on earth??
Is there sickness in Heaven?
Just thinking out loud.
Thank you for the scriptural conversation
refreshing around here .
Dear Sun, I really would enjoy a scriptural conversation actually
Your response to my post doesnt qualify in that though
Let me explain why;
(Rom 3:4) God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.
Personal ideas or unsubstantiated statements lacking the Word and Spirit guidance of Jesus isnt really an acceptable form of searching the scriptures and proving all things. You are a nice enough person, and you sure believe what you believe, but that doesnt substitute for truth. Are you a truth seeker?
Thinking out loud or any other form of Thinking is only carnal. That is why we need the Mind of Christ in these things. Mans Thinking is a bad substitute indeed! No?
Is not our fathers will to be at rest in Him in peace and joy in His Holy Spirit? With Christ in us, is not His Will done in our Earth bodies as it is in Heaven?
By the way, Jesus raising Lazarus wasnt done as a personal favor to Martha or Mary or Lazarus. You should quickly reprimand whoever it was who told you that. In fact, he tarried and purposefully let Lazarus DIE and CORRUPT. This caused great anguish to Martha and Mary. If he was doing it as a friend, He sure wouldnt have done that.
He let Lazarus die. He did it to show forth in EVANGELISM, that HE was the Resurrection and the Life.
A big big difference.
The crowd laughed Him to scorn in their faithlessness, causing Him to weep.
He did it in hope that they would come to believe Him as the resurrection and the life and receive Him.
NOT because he was their friend.
Im hoping you might do something for me show me one scripture of what it is that you pray for that God promises he will give YOU, that is related to the topic of this OP.
Ive read this entire thread and havent seen any one Pente\charis give an honest undisputable example.
I can show you where we ask seek knock pray and otherwise petition God for knowledge wisdom understanding, righteousness joy and peace, the fruit of the Spirit, and His Holy Spirit by which we are given to know all things He PROMISES to give us those things. I can list every scripture for you. I pray for THOSE things.
But what scripture can a Chaismatic/Pentecostal follower show forth without a shadow of a doubt, to support what goes on in their circles? After all, this thread is specifically about that. And I havent seen one thing presented by a pente\charis yet here that isnt a flagrant wresting of the meaning of scripture. I would REALLY like to be proven otherwise!
Thanks
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