To Kill, Or To Be Killed?

it is at least given the crims a second chance

I just think its quite clear that with the coming of Jesus, the right for human to kill human was taken away.

I like to think I would do the right thing in the moment.

Originally posted by Dewjunkie
Apparently, I am in the minority who would save myself or my family. I have a 2 year old daughter who needs to grow up with a father. I have a wife who is a quadripelegic and needs me to take care of her. I have the ability through Christian love and living to touch many lives before my time is done. If someone is evil enough to threaten my life for no good reason, chances are that person isn't a positive difference maker in this world. I realize I am no one's judge, but if it came down to me or some scumbag trying to off me so he can take my money and get his next fix, it'll have to be him.

This is a question that any potential law enforcement candidate has to answer at their oral boards. If you aren't able to say you would take the criminal's life to save those around you, chances are you're not going to get your badge. If the citizens you swear to protect and serve can't trust you to take down someone who is threatening the lives of others, then you're no protector or servant. Same goes for your family.

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I'm with you.  My primary earthly responsibility is to protect my family. 

The bible also tells us not to participate in other's sin.  If, by being passive you allow another to take lives, are you not participating in sin?

Originally posted by blueiverson
um...one question.

would you join the army, or anything like that?

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Whould I join the army. No. My reason for this is that a lot of wars are not needed. If I was to go into the army, or any branch for defense, I would have to do what they say. I am not that good at taking orders without questioning. I dont like people who think they are better than me and show it. I wouldn't last. If I was drafted and there was a war that I did believe in I would willingly go.

Originally posted by Zorobabel
I shouldn't say he agreed with me. I should say that from the scripture I believe that he would be against it. That was wrong, and I hope you will forgive me. 

When John the Baptist was arrested, he probably could have asked his hundreds of followers to try an uprising. It would have failed, but they could have at least tried, but he didn't ask that. Jesus re-attached the ear of the Roman and rebuked Peter for it: "Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword".

Still, the decision is up to you. I don't think the matter is that important, as it won't happen to any of us most likely.

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I agree with you on the matter that it isn't that important. Also that is fine with the first mistake you made with word choice.

When John the Baptist was arrested he could have fought back but he didn't. Doesn't it mention some where in the Bible that we are supposed to obey the government. I dont know where it says that because I am not good with exact versus. I need to know it better.

I think the concept of perspective plays a very important role in each persons right choice. For a single person the right choice may be to lay down your life. For one who is married with children the right choice my be to defend to the death. In either case I believe that the Lord looks at the heart and determines motive or righteousness of the action better than we can by looking at circumstances.

The only reason that men kill others, or even impose on them, is greed.

The reason for wars is greed.


The only time that killing another man is justified is when the other man intrudes on you. God gave you life, an NO MAN IS TO TAKE IT.

Your duty to God and to yourself - and to the entirety of mankind is to PROTECT THE LIFE THAT GOD GAVE TO YOU.

It only perpetuates evildoings to simply let someone kill you without taking action against his intrusion upon your life.

YOUR LIFE IS SACRED. YOU ARE TO KEEP IT UNTIL GOD TAKES IT HIMSELF.

Is life so valueless to you that you would not stand in the way of a wrongddoer?

If that's the thinking around here, then no wonder there's so much evildoing in the world!

VALUE THE LIFE THAT GOD GAVE TO YOU!!

I dont like people who think they are better than me and show it.

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I understand this feeling. But let me assure you, you will find these people everywhere. In Church! Even here in these forums! Not just in the military. So these we have to learn to love and deal with, whereever we find them.

Originally posted by Gerry
I understand this feeling. But let me assure you, you will find these people everywhere. In Church! Even here in these forums! Not just in the military. So these we have to learn to love and deal with, whereever we find them.

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I clearly understand that. But the military is made up of a chain of command and a lot of orders from people higher up. Quite a few of them get a swell head from being above so many people. That is what I meant. I dont like taking orders without question.

Originally posted by GraftMeIn
After reading all the responses and thinking about the whole gun issue, I find I have to ask myself this....

If I went out and bought a gun because I felt that I needed something to protect my family with. Would I be in a way telling God that I didn't trust him enough to do it? Somehow I think that I would.

Only guns you'll ever see around my house are the ones that belong to friends who like to eat venison.

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So I guess if the lock on your front door broke and would no longer lock, you would just leave it?  And when you reach over and buckle your seatbelt?

I say God helps those who help themselves.  Quit working and just sit around and pray for food.  See where that gets you.

Hi all!

As an orthodox Jew, if someone was immediately & acutely threatening my life and I did not use available means to defend myself and so let him murder me, I would be guilty of willful suicide. If I did not use available means to defend someone else whose life was being threatened and let that person be murdered, it would be as if I had committed the murder. I am required to use deadly force in order to prevent a would-be murderer from taking life if it is not possible to stop the would-be murderer any other way before he murders someone. The commandment is "You shall not murder," not, "You shall not kill." Killing in self-defense or in the defense of others is not the same as murder. Anyone who thinks that they are is, in my humble opinion, terribly misguided and in ignorance of the scriptures (such as the meaning of the 6th Commandment as well as Exodus 22:1, Leviticus 19:16, etc.) (This is not to say that we should rejoice and be happy at the prospect of killing or at having been compelled to kill. Under Jewish law, a priest who had taken human life, even if entirely justifiable self-defense or by pure accident, was permanently disqualified from officiating at the Temple altar. Our Sages say that the service at the altar brings life into the world; one who took life cannot officiate.)

Gabriel, in the post before this one, is talking sense. Last Saturday (not yesterday, the Saturday before that), we read I Kings 1:1-31 in synagogue. Our Sages question Nathan's role in the events described therein. Even though Nathan knew full well that God wanted Solomon, not Adonijah, to succeed David, he (Nathan) did not passively sit around waiting for this to happen by itself. Rather, Nathan made every effort he could to foil Adonijah's coup d'etat and bring about the realization of God's wishes.

Be well!

ssv

I just saw this thread so I thought I'd pop in here.

Before I got married and had children, there was no way I would ever kill someone, even in self-defense.  It's a different story now, because I have a family I could lose, or they could lose me.

At 16, I was raped by a very violent person.  I wish I had a gun then.  He went on to do the same thing to several other women, one who was pregnant and lost her baby after he threw her down the stairs.  You think maybe she would have wished she had a gun?  Or that me, a very scared 16 year old naive girl would have done something?  You bet.

I only tell you this because I think it's very easy to be passionate about never killing someone in self-defense, but I hope that everyone here who feels that way doesn't condemn or judge those of us who would.  If someone were to kill my beautiful 3 year old little girl, and I did nothing, I'm the murderer because I didn't protect her.

I have 4 daughters, 2 of which are teenagers.  If someone broke into our home and intended to do the same to them that that slimeball did to me, you better believe I'd protect my daughters in any way I could.  I'm a saved soul, thank God!  And so are my daughters.  I know I wouldn't go to hell for protecting my family, but I'd have to live with the emotional consequences for my actions.  You reap what you sow. 

One thing that has kind of bothered me, is the attitude that if you have enough faith, nothing bad will happen.  There are a lot of evil people out there doing the will of Satan.  The "ruler" of this Earth right now is said Satan, and bad things happen, even to very good people.  I dead-bolt our doors and put my seat belt on.  Why test God that way?

~Peace in Christ,

Terri

Originally posted by blindfaith
One thing that has kind of bothered me, is the attitude that if you have enough faith, nothing bad will happen.  There are a lot of evil people out there doing the will of Satan.  The "ruler" of this Earth right now is said Satan, and bad things happen, even to very good people.  I dead-bolt our doors and put my seat belt on.  Why test God that way?

~Peace in Christ, Terri

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I agree, we should not test God. But you have to go by what the Bible says that all things work out for the best, for them that love God and are called according to His purpose. So if we are following God's plan and purpose for us and our lives, then we have nothing to worry about. If your not following God, then you have everything to worry about. But remember what we trust in, is what our defense is going to be. A gun can not protect you from disease, but God can. Also, the Bible says that if you live by the sword, you die by the sword.

Where I live is safe though, so I can not really judge others and where they may live and what they feel they have to do to protect themselves. I can only decide for myself, what works for me.

Originally posted by Gabriel


I say God helps those who help themselves.  Quit working and just sit around and pray for food.  See where that gets you.

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haha i thought this was funny seeing that my dad doesn't get payed. we live by faith, so we pray for money to come so we can buy food, or pray till we get given some.