Conversion to Islam

I must say Michael, this doesn't surprise me. With you being so weak to be fooled into the "extreme orthodoxy" sects and all. Being carried about with various and strange doctrines, and all is normal for a foolish child of the world.

When you've had you fill of this, maybe Mormonism will be next. Hey, perhaps even Hinduism. If you ever decide to embrace the truth, and reject the demons of delusion, I will be waiting to welcome you back with open arms. Until then, enjoy your roller coaster ride Michael.

You might be able to convert to Islam and naturally you may even find yourself beginning to associate with Muslims, but what if one day you wish to revert to Christianity? Do you know what the penalty for leaving Islam can be? You can convert TO Islam, but LEAVING Islam can be dangerous and deadly if you make your departure from Islam public.

I'm teaching the class for inquirer's at my parish this year, and we just had our first session. For good reason, it laid the foundation: Why do we believe in one God, not many? A personal God, as opposed to pantheism? God as Trinity, Who revealed Himself in the Incarnation. It is essential to know what you believe, and why, and not be swayed by emotion.

The Creed is such a powerful prayer. It really does set forth the uniqueness of the Christian faith.

My problem with God only being God and not a Trinity is that without the Son, there remains that chasm between human sinfulness and God - we are completely separated, forever and ever. And without the Holy Spirit, we are simply obeying God because "it says so in the Koran, it's forbidden in Islam" etc., not because we have God INSIDE us. I can't tell you in enough words, how I feel like I've changed on opinions, thoughts, and attitudes, with the Holy Spirit inside me, as opposed to "extrinsic" motivation to strictly please God. I mean, with the Son, my sins are forgiven, and with the Holy Spirit, God has equipped me with what feels like a "piece of him" inside me that enables me to do his will because I WANT to do his will.
Without the Son and Holy Spirit, how can we be forgiven, and how can we get that wonderful feeling of God inside us, helping us to do what is right? Christianity feels more complete to me than Islam simply because the God of Christianity enables Himself to be connected to humans and form relationships with them based on the Son and Holy Spirit. Without those two, what kind of relationship should it be?

Why are you even posting here? What is your motivation? Do you enjoy to see us get angry because you offend us before Christ? What is the purpose of posting here your story if you are NEVER going to listen any advice that has been given to you? No wonder muslims traits are already being adapted, ike wearing the horse blinders as usual in theological matters.

BY NO MEANS I AM ADDRESSING THIS TO YOU. YOU HAVE ALREADY REJECTED CHRIST with your blasphemy. I am posting this for other members of this forum. Don't bother to reply, BECAUSE I KNOW YOU and your mullah friends WON'T BE ABLE TO!

MichaelArchangelos said:

I talked with my girlfriend this weekend, and she told me that she would still marry me even if I was Muslim. That has been the main thing stopping me converting to Islam - I don't want to lose her. She is a catechumen in the Orthodox Church

Click to expand...

Nonsense, if she is an Orthodox Cathecumen, and will become an Orthodox, why is the reason this dude is following islam? Islam is heresy, how can she become an Orthodox by marrying a muslim?

and I told her that she could still be Christian, as Islam allows Muslims to marry "People of the Book".

Click to expand...

Don't give me that people of the book nonsense... What book? Quran talks about Kitab, which is book, a Scripture, but doesn't specify whose ... The book that has been sent before... With the historical context of Quran, the people of the book it addresses ARE NOT even Orthodox Christians, what book, whenever it fits the agenda, that book is the allegedly lost Injeel, now it fits your agenda, it is the people of the book???

Quran doesn't even USE the word for Christian in Arabic, but calls us something to the effect "Helpers of Allah" What kind of nonsense is that, when in 7th century, the word was Christian was already circulating in MANY languages. I am not a helpers of Allah, I am the follower of Christ, that is my definition and in arabic it is Mesihi, not NASARA, tell that false book Quran to get a clue.

Islam allows you to marry her WITH THE ONLY CONDITION that you will convert her, don't be dishonest, and insult people's intelligence here.

Furthermore, I think we could get married as soon as I accept Islam, because marriage in Islam is simple, the writing of a contract between the husband and wife. We could then have the wedding party (walimah) back in Malaysia, where she is from.

Click to expand...

I think that I am going to become a Muslim

Click to expand...

You think? This is a conscious denial of faith, eternally lost.

but I'm going to do quite a bit more reading before I do.

Click to expand...

What are you going to read about? The sword of the Prophet, or Ahmed Deedat's unfounded Swoon theory?

The mosque here is just 5 mins away from the university, and I have no classes in the afternoons, so I'll go to the mosque library to read the Qur'an and to read more about Islam.

Click to expand...

The mosque is pretty much open during the day in Ramadan. I know I could convert right now, though, which is far better than the Orthodox system,

Click to expand...

What do you know about Orthodox "system"? Your ignorance is clear from the way you formed your sentence...

where a priest tells you when you can convert and be baptized.

Click to expand...

That is right, because they would want you to be prepared for the important decision, make your mind, and know the faith you are accepting. Any mullah will pick a loser like you off the street, the emptier the brain, easier to wash it. I can't wait until I meet you in Iraq... On opposite sides though, sorry!

Apparently your prayers aren't as strong until you're baptized,

Click to expand...

Read the Scriptures about it, they don't require you to be baptized to read them, they say "ask and you shall receive, seek, you shall find"

so it seems that the priest is withholding the full power of the grace of God (glorious and exalted is He).

Click to expand...

My girlfriend has also talked about being baptized in the Coptic Church, because 1) the priest might baptize her quicker than the Antiochian Orthodox priest and 2) she likes the falafels there.

Click to expand...

MichaelArchangelos said:

Because it seems to be the truth.

Click to expand...

Well, flash news for you, IT IS NOT!, it is a lie based on the fallacy of an illiterate arab merchant, who did not know whom he met in a dark cave concerning the revelation he received, his folks aournd him assured that the being must have been from Allah, the only God they held higher among all the other pagan gods.

To worship God (glorious and exalted is He) alone and not to associate partners with Him in worship.

Click to expand...

Who is ascribing a partner to God? Who is associating a partner to God? Do you have the courage to tell me? I will tell you who, the heretic sect of Marianism, where Muhammad traveled and came across, but Quran did not bother to tell you that it addressed a heretical group NOT Christians, oh did it now?

No one has the right to be invoked, supplicated, prayed to or shown any act of worship but God alone.

Click to expand...

AND YES HIS NAME IS CHRIST JESUS PANTOCRATOR!

MichaelArchangelos said:

Allah is the Arabic word for "God". Arabic-speaking Christians call God "Allah". In the service books in my Antiochian church there is a book of the Divine Liturgy with English and Arabic side-by-side, and "Allah" is used for "God".

The Arabic word "Allah" is actually better than the English "God" because "Allah" has no plural form (gods) and no feminine form (goddess).

Click to expand...

I call him Christ, is that FEMININE?

MichaelArchangelos said:

I am not going to get into a debate on the Trinity.

Click to expand...

Because you can't, because you know nothing about Him, therefore it is easy to reject Him.

But I am excited that my girlfriend and I can get married as soon as I convert.

Click to expand...

Why don't you tell everyone that this is all about pants business?

ladybug1980 said:

You might be able to convert to Islam and naturally you may even find yourself beginning to associate with Muslims, but what if one day you wish to revert to Christianity? Do you know what the penalty for leaving Islam can be? You can convert TO Islam, but LEAVING Islam can be dangerous and deadly if you make your departure from Islam public.

Click to expand...

THANK YOU, the PUNISHMENT is DEATH!

I can't understand why some converts to Islam seem to overlook the fact that it is somewhere in the Koran or Hadith that the "Prophet" ordered any apostates to be killed.

Why can't this alone incite any doubt among Muslims as to whether Muhammad was a legitimate prophet? Anyone who forms a religion and pronounces death to someone who leaves it, is definitely a cult leader! I just don't understand, why can't some people see through this?

About a year ago, my local newspaper's opinion article was about this one man named Abdul Rahman (if I'm not mistaken on the name) from Afghanistan, who converted to Christianity and is in exile in Italy. And the article was written by a Muslim woman who said that his conversion to Christianity warranted death, and nothing short of it, because she said that in Islam it is forbidden to convert to another religion. And this woman lives in MY town! How many other Muslims in my town have the same mentality as this woman? She could be shopping right in the grocery store with me and I wouldn't even know it. And she may even have the guise of a nice woman, but you never know what is going on in people's minds!

MichaelArchangelos said:

I think that I am going to become a Muslim, but I'm going to do quite a bit more reading before I do.

Click to expand...

..."He that receiveth a prophet in the name of a prophet shall receive a prophet's reward." (Matthew 10:41) the Bible clearly teaches that Jesus is the Son of God. Islam 'vehemently' denies this. by choosing a 'false' prophet you are choosing that 'prophets' reward, and this is the reward of 'false' prophets: "But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die." (Deuteronomy 18:20)

God promised Moses that one day 'the' Prophet would come: "The Lord thy God will raise up unto thee a Prophet from the midst of thee, of thy brethren, like unto Me; unto Him ye shall hearken." (Deuteronomy 18:15) it's like getting directions to Eternity; depending on 'whom' you shall 'hearken' will determine 'where' you shall go. Jesus said this, "Whom do men say that I the Son of man am? And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. (and Jesus replied) and upon this rock (confession of the Christ) I will build My church." (Matthew 16:13-18)

"He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life." (1 John 5:12) I don't know 'what' your 'conversion' is from, but you are studying Islam. on a matter of such 'significance' you should study Jesus as revealed in the Bible before making your decision. either Jesus or Mohammed; they can't both be right.

Bad news: If Michael stayed in Islam for long, he is bound to become a suicide bomber because he always goes to the most extremist branch of religion of which he's a member at that precise moment.
Good news: Michael won't stay a Moslem for long (he has converted over 8 times to and from different religions).
Bad news: He might not be able to leave Islam (and if he does, it means that the Moselms he knew aren't 'traditional' enough because he's alive.)
Worst news: He converted to and from so many religions that one of them is bound to be true (my bet is on Orthodoxy) - and all of them aren't exactly keen on leaving them.

JustinHesychast said:

I'm sorry, Michael.

My prayers.

Click to expand...

I agree. Apostasy is never a good thing.

If Michael stayed in Islam for long, he is bound to become a suicide bomber because he always goes to the most extremist branch of religion of which he's a member at that precise moment.

Click to expand...

That's exactly the point I was making in my prior post, and I wish I was just being a smart aleck, but I'm not. I could see it happening. Nothing but the craziest and most extreme in any religion is good enough for Michael.

If you do convert, Michael, but then see the error of your ways someday, how are you going to leave? Unless you're hanging out with very westernized, modern Muslims, which I'm sure you couldn't STAND, they WILL KILL YOU IF YOU LEAVE. We have a member here who is a former Muslim who is in hiding from her own father for this reason. Think it couldn't happen to you? Think again.

My problem with God only being God and not a Trinity is that without the Son, there remains that chasm between human sinfulness and God - we are completely separated, forever and ever. And without the Holy Spirit, we are simply obeying God because "it says so in the Koran, it's forbidden in Islam" etc., not because we have God INSIDE us. I can't tell you in enough words, how I feel like I've changed on opinions, thoughts, and attitudes, with the Holy Spirit inside me, as opposed to "extrinsic" motivation to strictly please God. I mean, with the Son, my sins are forgiven, and with the Holy Spirit, God has equipped me with what feels like a "piece of him" inside me that enables me to do his will because I WANT to do his will.
Without the Son and Holy Spirit, how can we be forgiven, and how can we get that wonderful feeling of God inside us, helping us to do what is right? Christianity feels more complete to me than Islam simply because the God of Christianity enables Himself to be connected to humans and form relationships with them based on the Son and Holy Spirit. Without those two, what kind of relationship should it be?

Click to expand...

While written by a non-Orthodox guest, there are definitely some very Orthodox thoughts in here.

Without God taking on human flesh and assuming our nature, we could never be lifted up out of the fallen muck we were in.

Without God being a Triune entity, there is no Love. God the Father eternally begets the Son and eternally breathes forth His Spirit in a never ending communion of Love, and because He is Love, He is able to share that Life of Love with us and give us the hope that through His Son, we will one day live in His life of Love, ie, partake of His divine Nature.

A "god" who is mono-natured cannot love. Period. Of course, that explains why the islamic god is such a jerk and is only interested in total domination and death. It also explain why people who truly follow Islamic teachings to their logical end do not love, but instead worship death, even using their own children as suicide bombers to kill [wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth]r.

Which is it, Michael - love or death? You cannot have both.