• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

Trump dispenses with trials, orders military strike on alleged Venezuelan drug-trafficking boat (Now up to 2, 3, 4...)

stevevw

inquisitive
Nov 4, 2013
17,042
1,989
Brisbane Qld Australia
✟337,089.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
How?

Everyone that is in peril at sea, should be helped. Innocent or not.
Your assuming they are in a no terrorist situation and just on some venture and capsized. Combating terror is peril full stop. Where is the line between innocent peril and engaging in activities of terror.

Your assuming they are innocents when we have not got all the info. You are applying a civilian scenario to what is combating terrorist who are not innocent.

We all know in the midst of combating such groups and people that they are not so innocent and don't think like us. The need to stop these people so that they cannot spread their evil. The rules are completely different to a civilian situation.
 
Upvote 0

stevevw

inquisitive
Nov 4, 2013
17,042
1,989
Brisbane Qld Australia
✟337,089.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Who is this They you are referring to? What was much much worse?
The ones who persued Trump and his admin and supporters relentlessly to the point of derangement. To the point that they would never apply the same criteria to themselves.

When someone refers to the activities of those who did this then the same applies to them.

When these same people who object to Trump bring up his past fraud and corruption I am saying this pales into insignificances whats coming out on those who hounded Trump, his admin and supporters. They have no leg to stand on.

This is what happens when people throw stones and accuse others. They better be pure skins themselves as God says don't judge unless you want to be judged. as it turns out it seems those who are loudest and fixated on condemning and judging are actually the ones with the most grevious wrongs. The pot calling the kettle black.
The GOP led by Comer spent years “investigating” Biden and his family, wasting time and money, to result in nothing.
Yes sure. We all know there was corruption. Its coming out now. Actually I feel sorry for Biden as he was cognitively impaired and did not know. Its the people behind him that are now being found out.
Trump is frequently hateful in his rhetoric towards immigrants and those who don’t bow to kiss his ring- citizens who voted against him, Congress members who stand up to him, Governors who won’t bend to his will, political appointees who just want to do their job correctly, etc. He is the problem now and he will receive continued negativity reflected back at himself.
No he is the same as his accusers. They are all bad. But the difference is at least he does not pretend. What you see is what you get. But as for those who pretended that they were sheep when all the time they were the wolves. They are the truely evil ones. You will see. It will all come out.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

BCP1928

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2024
9,829
4,998
83
Goldsboro NC
✟287,930.00
Country
United States
Faith
Other Religion
Marital Status
Married
Your assuming they are in a no terrorist situation and just on some venture and capsized. Combating terror is peril full stop. Where is the line between innocent peril and engaging in activities of terror.

Your assuming they are innocents when we have not got all the info. You are applying a civilian scenario to what is combating terrorist who are not innocent.

We all know in the midst of combating such groups and people that they are not so innocent and don't think like us. The need to stop these people so that they cannot spread their evil. The rules are completely different to a civilian situation.
No, we assume that they are noncombatant civilian criminal gangsters smuggling cocaine. That terrorist business is just a fairy story dreamed up by morally bankrupt Christian nationalists to justify to themselves why it's OK to exterminate the men in the boats instead of arresting them
 
Upvote 0

Stopped_lurking

Well-Known Member
Jan 12, 2004
546
243
Kristianstad
✟20,862.00
Country
Sweden
Gender
Male
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Private
Your assuming they are in a no terrorist situation and just on some venture and capsized. Combating terror is peril full stop. Where is the line between innocent peril and engaging in activities of terror.
If one is without a functioning vessel out at sea then one is in peril (what is innocent peril or non-innocent peril?).
Your assuming they are innocents when we have not got all the info. You are applying a civilian scenario to what is combating terrorist who are not innocent.
I'm not assuming they were innocent! It is irrelevant.
We all know in the midst of combating such groups and people that they are not so innocent and don't think like us. The need to stop these people so that they cannot spread their evil. The rules are completely different to a civilian situation.
Smugglers whose boat have been put out of play should also be deemed worthy of saving, IMO. I'm starting to understand that you find their deaths ok (good?).

Let's return to my question to you. So who do I have to hold accountable in order to hold a view of this situation according to you?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Hans Blaster
Upvote 0

stevevw

inquisitive
Nov 4, 2013
17,042
1,989
Brisbane Qld Australia
✟337,089.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
No, we assume that they are noncombatant civilian criminal gangsters smuggling cocaine. That terrorist business is just a fairy story dreamed up by morally bankrupt Christian nationalists to justify to themselves why it's OK to exterminate the men in the boats instead of arresting them
Ah so you are making it about identity politics again. The bad old mean white Christian nationalist.

You are adding fuel to the fire.

Where was all this moral outrage at the 1,000s of lives destroyed by all these drugs coming in. Why did it actually increase in recent years. Where is the morality here. Or is it selective morality.

How do you know what the stakes are. Do you have the intel. How do you know there is not connections to actual terrorist. That the money from drugs is funding terrorism. Who says that the flooding of poison into a neighbouring nation that kills 1,000s and destroys families and communities is not an act or terror.

Is not a national safety and securoty issue. There may be lots of crime, human trafficking and all sorts of evil going on.

But you don't know. Yet your quite willing to claim you know. I don't trust your opion as your claiming to know stuff you cannot possibly know.

Your also claiming a moral truth. According to whose moral truth. Is not morality a subjective belief. How is your opinion truth. Who says so, you.
 
Upvote 0

comana

Senior Veteran
Site Supporter
Jan 19, 2005
8,054
4,638
Colorado
✟1,175,955.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
The ones who persured Trump and his admin and supporters relentlessly to the point of derangement. To the point that they would never apply the same criteria to themselves.

I will let you work out who they were. But when someone refers to the activities of those who did this then its the same people and the same applies.

What was much worse. The corruption and fraud. When these same people who object to Trump bring up his past of fraud and corruption I am saying this pales into insignificances whats coming out on those who hounded Trump, his admin and supporters.

This is what happens when people throw stones and accuse others. They better be pure skins themselves as God says don't judge unless you want to be judged. as it turns out it seems those who are loudest and fixated on condemning and judging are actually the ones with the most grevious wrongs. The pot calling the kettle black.

Yes sure. We all know there was corruption. Its coming out now. Actually I feel sorry for Biden as he was cognitively impaired and did not know. Its the people behind him that are now being found out.

No he is the same as his accusers. They are all bad. But the difference is at least he does not pretend. What you see is what you get. But as for those who pretended that they were sheep when all the time they were the wolves. They are the truely evil ones. You will see. It will all come out.
The only scandal coming out is Trump sending his had picked loyalists in the DOJ after everyone who opposes him, and aside from the attention grabbing headlines, these accusations also amount to to nothing.

It will all come out…. Sure, we just need to give Comer more time to conclude his investigations in search of a crime.

True that Trump has never hid who he is. It was glaring from day one. That is the most disturbing part of his Presidency- the fact that he was elected at all.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: GoldenBoy89
Upvote 0

stevevw

inquisitive
Nov 4, 2013
17,042
1,989
Brisbane Qld Australia
✟337,089.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
If one is without a functioning vessel out at sea then one is in peril (what is innocent peril or non-innocent peril?).
I am saying that you are assuming this and that you keep framing it that way shows your determined to make it stick before we have found out what actually happened. Have you seen the footage. So how can you make these claims. You are being biased for framing it that way in the first place.

We don't know. As stated by Bradley that the two so called innocents were radioing through and trying to recover the packages. They were not so innocent. So we have two different stories. But your claiming you know that only one is truth.

This is biased especially that your claiming your truth over the actual person who is at the center. Yourt more or less dismissing him and charging him guilty before we have established the facts.
I'm not assuming they were innocent! It is irrelevant.
You are assuming they are innocent by framing that they were in peril. Combating terror is peril and there will be dangerous situations as a result. Combatants within that situation are not in peril if they are still in the fight. Thats the nature of terror. Its not like they were out on some fishing trip and got into peril.
Smugglers whose boat have been put out of play should also be deemed worthy of saving, IMO. I'm starting to understand that you find their deaths ok (good?).
There you go making unfounded personal attacks. This shows you personalise things. I could say 'I am beginning to think you support drug smnugglers and want innocent lives to be destroyed'. See how this game works. We could go back and forth over which is the worst moral situation.

You don't know they were put out of play. Just trying to save the drugs is still actively engaging in the continuation of the drug trade. You don't know whether they were contacting for help. But your quite willing to keep framing it in a way where you seem to know more than the intel.
Let's return to my question to you. So who do I have to hold accountable in order to hold a view of this situation according to you?
You have to first find out the facts as to whether anyone is to be held accountable. Your jumping the gun in assuming that someone should already be held accountable.

Lets find out the facts and the context first. If it turns out that a wrong has been done then I have no issues with that. A wrong is a wrong. But lets first determine this.
 
Upvote 0

BCP1928

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2024
9,829
4,998
83
Goldsboro NC
✟287,930.00
Country
United States
Faith
Other Religion
Marital Status
Married
Ah so you are making it about identity politics again.
You're complaining about "identity politics?" You're the one claiming the moral right to summarily execute a particular group of criminal gangsters because of the political identity you assigned them.
The bad old mean white Christian nationalist.
Well, it's no secret that I think Christian nationalists are traitors to their country and enemies of Christ.
You are adding fuel to the fire.

Where was all this moral outrage at the 1,000s of lives destroyed by all these drugs coming in. Why did it actually increase in recent years. Where is the morality here. Or is it selective morality.
Definitely selective. The moral approach would be to stop the boats, arrest the crews and then sink the boats. That's the way it was done before. The US Coast Guard is still using that method quite effectively in the Pacific, where most of the cocaine actually heading for the US is run.
How do you know what the stakes are. Do you have the intel. How do you know there is not connections to actual terrorist. That the money from drugs is funding terrorism. Who says that the flooding of poison into a neighbouring nation that kills 1,000s and destroys families and communities is not an act or terror.

Is not a national safety and securoty issue. There may be lots of crime, human trafficking and all sorts of evil going on.

But you don't know. Yet your quite willing to claim you know. I don't trust your opion as your claiming to know stuff you cannot possibly know.

Your also claiming a moral truth. According to whose moral truth. Is not morality a subjective belief. How is your opinion truth. Who says so, you.
Well, if I was looking for moral truth I certainly wouldn't expect to find it in a MAGA Christian. The Law of Armed Conflict was created with a good deal of Christian input by Christian nations. Now Trump wants to ignore it and his Christian supporters are cheering him on.
 
Upvote 0

stevevw

inquisitive
Nov 4, 2013
17,042
1,989
Brisbane Qld Australia
✟337,089.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
The only scandal coming out is Trump sending his had picked loyalists in the DOJ after everyone who opposes him, and aside from the attention grabbing headlines, these accusations also amount to to nothing.
This language is full of hate and division. It comes from the same mentality as when people call Trump supporters morons or deplorables. To call Trumps admin some sort of dumb loyalist without their own minds to know what is going on is just dimissing people are idiots.

Everything you say is also done by the Left and even worse as far as headlines. They have actually been caught for doctoring headlines to lie about Trump. Like I said its the pot calling the kettle black. I suggest you not throw stones as its only going to reflect badly on those throwing them.
It will all come out…. Sure, we just need to give Comer more time to conclude his investigations in search of a crime.
No I mean the crime, corruption and fruad committed by the Dems and their agencies. It will all come out. Its already coming out. Thats why I say be careful about throwing stones. Its not going to be good.

The question will be where was all this moral outrage in regards to all this corruption and fruad and abuse. Why did they keep it quiet. What were they hiding.

Its usually when someone makes a big noise about another doing wrong to the point where its constant. Then usually this is a sign that they are diverting attention away from themselves. So the more fixated the elites were on Trump the more we can say they were doing the same and much worse.

So who are we to trust. The whole system is broken.
True that Trump has never hid who he is. It was glaring from day one. That is the most disturbing part of his Presidency- the fact that he was elected at all.
I disagree. You see what you get. I fear the quiet ones, the wolves posing as sheep. The smiling assassins. They are the truely evil ones to fear. Like I said its all coming out.

For example everyone knows about Trumps fraud. Actually the DOJ had to bring up antiquated rulings and practically change careers to just make the charges stick. It was a crazy bending of the law and no one has been treated with such bias.

Anyway we know, Trump accepted it and the people still supported him as a president and they were not dumb or diplorable for doing so. They seen through the Dems gas lighting the nation and their identity politics.

But what is coming out with the fraud in Waltz's state makes Trumps fraud child play. It is going to be the biggest fraud scandel in US history. It also looks like other Dem States who acted as sanctuary States are going to have big fraud issues as well and they are refusing to hand over their books. They have something to hide.

So this could blow whatever Trump did out of the water.

Heres the thing. It looks like all of this was happening while Waltz was being nominated for VP. This shows how far out of touch they were. Not just that they were hounding Trump for his small acts and Waltz was one of the biggest mouths.

So it was hidden. So when people complain about Trumps little indiscretions they sort of can't take seriously a side that has domne much worse but also hid it and pretended they were doing the right thing. People hate that.
 
Upvote 0

Stopped_lurking

Well-Known Member
Jan 12, 2004
546
243
Kristianstad
✟20,862.00
Country
Sweden
Gender
Male
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Private
I am saying that you are assuming this and that you keep framing it that way shows your determined to make it stick before we have found out what actually happened. Have you seen the footage. So how can you make these claims. You are being biased for framing it that way in the first place.
The assumption that their boat was put out of play? Who is arguing that their boat wasn't? Bradley? Tom Cotton?
We don't know. As stated by Bradley that the two so called innocents were radioing through and trying to recover the packages. They were not so innocent. So we have two different stories. But your claiming you know that only one is truth.
What difference does it make if they were trying to gather the packages?
This is biased especially that your claiming your truth over the actual person who is at the center. Yourt more or less dismissing him and charging him guilty before we have established the facts.
Where did Bradley say that their boat was ok?
You are assuming they are innocent by framing that they were in peril.
They were in peril.
Combating terror is peril and there will be dangerous situations as a result. Combatants within that situation are not in peril if they are still in the fight. Thats the nature of terror. Its not like they were out on some fishing trip and got into peril.
Did they have any means to reach the shore according to Bradley?
There you go making unfounded personal attacks. This shows you personalise things. I could say 'I am beginning to think you support drug smnugglers and want innocent lives to be destroyed'.
Say it then. Then I'll just say that I wish all narcotics smugglers to be interdicted (that is what I want!).
See how this game works. We could go back and forth over which is the worst moral situation.
Which situations do you want to compare?
You don't know they were put out of play. Just trying to save the drugs is still actively engaging in the continuation of the drug trade. You don't know whether they were contacting for help. But your quite willing to keep framing it in a way where you seem to know more than the intel.
They have a right to radio for help, otherwise they would likely have been hurt or even died from exposure.
You have to first find out the facts as to whether anyone is to be held accountable. Your jumping the gun in assuming that someone should already be held accountable.
That wasn't what I was asking, in this post Trump dispenses with trials, orders military strike on alleged Venezuelan drug-trafficking boat (Now up to 2, 3, 4...)

You alluded that those that complain cannot do that because we who complain in some way allowed something much worse to happen (unclear how). So before I complain about this, what much worse thing do you think I should complain about? I wish the US took better care about those that struggle with addiction. Is this what you're after?
Lets find out the facts and the context first. If it turns out that a wrong has been done then I have no issues with that. A wrong is a wrong. But lets first determine this.
Firing at a capsized boat is always wrong. (check 1 minute and 25 seconds in the video below). Might there be more information coming, sure. If the films show that they righted the boat and got it going again then the second strike was justified, but so far no one has even claimed that they righted the boat and got it going again.

 
Upvote 0

stevevw

inquisitive
Nov 4, 2013
17,042
1,989
Brisbane Qld Australia
✟337,089.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
You're complaining about "identity politics?" You're the one claiming the moral right to summarily execute a particular group of criminal gangsters because of the political identity you assigned them.
How have I claimed that. Show me where. I said we don't know and gave what the people involved said. Thats all. I am merely arguing that there may be a number of factors we don't know and we have to know all of them before we can make a judgement.

But having different moral opinions is not identity politics anyway. IP about making it about identity as you have done. You blame Christian nationalists. You make evrything that has happened due to identity.

Whereas moral opinions are usually based on a moral basis such as human wellbeing or Gods laws or Islam for that matter. #Which is not identity as anyone can be a Christian. But even conflating what may be good Christian truths as Christian nationalism is also identity politics as its categoring everything into the identity when its far more complex.
Well, it's no secret that I think Christian nationalists are traitors to their country and enemies of Christ.
I don't even understand what a Christian nationalist is. Or the difference between a Christian who believes in Christian values as a nation. Did not the US use to be a sort of Christian nation. In God we trust and all that.

Or at least as far as identifying themselves as different to say Islam. The middle eastern nations were Islam and the western nations primarily Christian. That was the moral destinction.
Definitely selective. The moral approach would be to stop the boats, arrest the crews and then sink the boats. That's the way it was done before. The US Coast Guard is still using that method quite effectively in the Pacific, where most of the cocaine actually heading for the US is run.
How can it be quiet effective when the problem has increased. There is a drug epidemic in some States. When 100,000 people are dying a year and a million every generation and more than all wars in the 20th century thats a national crisis.

Why was it not addressed. How many people have dies unnecessarily. If Trump has stopped 80% of boats and drugs is that not morally good in saving 1,000s of lives. Its all relative.

People keep talking about the old ways that have not been working and stick their head in the sand and in 10 years another million die. You could argue now that this is mass murder because we just let it continue using the same methods that have not worked.
Well, if I was looking for moral truth I certainly wouldn't expect to find it in a MAGA Christian.
There you go again. I find it hard to reconcile a Christian with immoral acts. That does not make sense. Thats like saying a priest who is a satanist lol.

What is it about a MAGA Christian that is so bad that they have no moral truths at all. It seems crazy to call them Christians if they have no moral truths at all. I am sure this is extreme rhetoric again. Identity politics and mispresenting others in a bad stereotypical light. Ie they are white or men = bad. White + male + Christian = extra bad.
The Law of Armed Conflict was created with a good deal of Christian input by Christian nations. Now Trump wants to ignore it and his Christian supporters are cheering him on.
Wait a minute. Your calling Trump and his supporters as Christian nationalists or supporting such. But then your saying Trump wants to ignore the Christian nationalists and the Christians are cheering him on.

I am confused. But nevertheless I think the whole idea of lumping Trump supporters as Christian nationalist is IP. They are much more varied than that and even some X Dems and independents. They all seem to agree on Trumps policies. These are the same policies and promises he was elected on. Why would people now change.
 
Upvote 0

comana

Senior Veteran
Site Supporter
Jan 19, 2005
8,054
4,638
Colorado
✟1,175,955.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
This language is full of hate and division. It comes from the same mentality as when people call Trump supporters morons or deplorables. To call Trumps admin some sort of dumb loyalist without their own minds to know what is going on is just dimissing people are idiots.

Everything you say is also done by the Left and even worse as far as headlines. They have actually been caught for doctoring headlines to lie about Trump. Like I said its the pot calling the kettle black. I suggest you not throw stones as its only going to reflect badly on those throwing them.

No I mean the crime, corruption and fruad committed by the Dems and their agencies. It will all come out. Its already coming out. Thats why I say be careful about throwing stones. Its not going to be good.

The question will be where was all this moral outrage in regards to all this corruption and fruad and abuse. Why did they keep it quiet. What were they hiding.

Its usually when someone makes a big noise about another doing wrong to the point where its constant. Then usually this is a sign that they are diverting attention away from themselves. So the more fixated the elites were on Trump the more we can say they were doing the same and much worse.

So who are we to trust. The whole system is broken.

I disagree. You see what you get. I fear the quiet ones, the wolves posing as sheep. The smiling assassins. They are the truely evil ones to fear. Like I said its all coming out.

For example everyone knows about Trumps fraud. Actually the DOJ had to bring up antiquated rulings and practically change careers to just make the charges stick. It was a crazy bending of the law and no one has been treated with such bias.

Anyway we know, Trump accepted it and the people still supported him as a president and they were not dumb or diplorable for doing so. They seen through the Dems gas lighting the nation and their identity politics.

But what is coming out with the fraud in Waltz's state makes Trumps fraud child play. It is going to be the biggest fraud scandel in US history. It also looks like other Dem States who acted as sanctuary States are going to have big fraud issues as well and they are refusing to hand over their books. They have something to hide.

So this could blow whatever Trump did out of the water.

Heres the thing. It looks like all of this was happening while Waltz was being nominated for VP. This shows how far out of touch they were. Not just that they were hounding Trump for his small acts and Waltz was one of the biggest mouths.

So it was hidden. So when people complain about Trumps little indiscretions they sort of can't take seriously a side that has domne much worse but also hid it and pretended they were doing the right thing. People hate that.
I never claimed Trump loyalists are idiots or mindlessly doing Trump’s bidding. No , they are willfully participating and enjoying the benefits of their positions, at least for now. He will discard each and every one of them right under the bus should any of their actions (that he directly asked of them) reflect badly on him.

As far as the corruption of those opposing Trump, it’s been “coming out” for years and all amounts to distracting headlines and no substance. It’s hard to take each new revelation of corruption seriously at this point.
 
Upvote 0

GoldenBoy89

We're Still Here
Sep 25, 2012
27,146
30,005
LA
✟671,909.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Humanist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Democrat
This language is full of hate and division.
You are full of hate and division. You write people off only because they’re opposed to Trump. That’s divisive. You don’t even live here and you are pushing division between Americans who are debating and discussing matters about their own government’s actions. That’s what we do. That’s what we’ve always done. Our government answers to us, or they’re supposed to, at least. I’m sorry the politics in your country are just so boring that you have to talk about ours but you clearly have a very heavy bias showing when you say no one can criticize the current administration because they haven’t been equally critical of past administrations. Following your lead, we can just write you off as an illogical Trump loyalist. Defending this criminal administration means you also have no moral high ground to talk down to us from.
 
Upvote 0

stevevw

inquisitive
Nov 4, 2013
17,042
1,989
Brisbane Qld Australia
✟337,089.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
The assumption that their boat was put out of play? Who is arguing that their boat wasn't? Bradley? Tom Cotton?
No that is not your assumption. If it was just that the boat was put out of play then we could not make any other assumptions as to what was happening. But you interjected they were out of play in a particular was as innocents stranded. When we don't know. They could have been salvaging all the drugs and then eventually get help to continue the mission.
What difference does it make if they were trying to gather the packages?
Because it means they intend to gather them and continue the mission. Those very drugs that are gathered could end up on the streets in the US.
They were in peril.
Thats what happens when your trying to stop terrorist. Were the terrorist who were bombed in other hits in other situations in peril if they survived. Of course. Thats what happens when you commit terror. Expect to be put in peril. Because you commiting peril on others.

Thats the difference between being in peril out on a days fishing and engaging in terror activities. From what I read they were actually standing on the boat and taking their shirts off and gathering the parcels. So they were not exactly drowning. This happened some time back and the report says there were a number of JAGs there when it happened live and none said it was illegal.
Did they have any means to reach the shore according to Bradley?
I don't know. Your asking questions that have not come out yet. I am sure they would have all sorts of communication including phones on a boat worth 1/4 of a million dollars.
Say it then. Then I'll just say that I wish all narcotics smugglers to be interdicted (that is what I want!).
The problem is what is morally right is a matter of opinion according to secular thinking. So theres no way to determine what is right. Whoever is in power gets to decide.

Bidens government may have been softe on crime and drugs and this was morally wrong and caused harm to many. Trump may be tougher and it seems unfair but saves 10 times as many lives.

Its the good old Trolly ethical dilemma. Either way some die and some live. The more you save is deemed more moral. This is the problem with relative morality.
Which situations do you want to compare?
I just gave one above. If say 100 die oin drug boats but it stops 80% of the trade and saves say 10,000 people. Or we continue the same policy that has allowed it to get out of hand and we lose those 10,000 and maybe it increases to an additional 10,000 as it gets worse.

Which is more moral.
They have a right to radio for help, otherwise they would likely have been hurt or even died from exposure.
So if they have a right to radio for help how do you know it was not to get another boat to collect all the drugs and then continue the mission.
That wasn't what I was asking, in this post Trump dispenses with trials, orders military strike on alleged Venezuelan drug-trafficking boat (Now up to 2, 3, 4...)

You alluded that those that complain cannot do that because we who complain in some way allowed something much worse to happen (unclear how). So before I complain about this, what much worse thing do you think I should complain about? I wish the US took better care about those that struggle with addiction. Is this what you're after?
You could start with the lack of action in stopping the drug trade. It has increased under Biden. You could also condemn the Dems soft policies that have allowed crime and rugs to flourish thus allowing both sides of the problem to grow and kill many people and destroy families and communities.

This not onlt has to be doine but done with the same level of passion and vitriole as made against Trump and his administration. That is attack them, misrepresent the Dems and call them out at the same level with headlines and all to be consistent. No excuse making like they have for other stuff like fraud. Just call out their own for all the immoral stuff done re the drug problem and crimne associted.,

Just pretend that it was the dems who helped cultivate both the drug smuggling and active use on the streets which is responsible for killing 1,000s. Because this is what the Rep will be accusing the Dems of doing.
Firing at a capsized boat is always wrong.
Actually no in combating terrorism. Biden and Obama participated and gave go aheads for attacks on terrorist that involved 2nd hits at finishing the job. Heck Obama gave the ok to go into Bin Ladens compound and kill every single person in the house. Including women and children.

Vehicles hit in terror coveys have been hit multiple times while terrorists are still running around. This is how combating in a war like situation happens with terrorist. Its easy to play moralist from the sidelines and an armchair.
(check 1 minute and 25 seconds in the video below). Might there be more information coming, sure. If the films show that they righted the boat and got it going again then the second strike was justified, but so far no one has even claimed that they righted the boat and got it going again.
It does not matter if they don't right the boat. Just trying to right the boat and getting the cargo is still actively engaged in trying to continue.
I hate all this. It sounds like all the other conspiracies and claims and counter claims. People come up with all these spectualtions up until the actual facts are released.

They were calling Trumps assassin a radical Right supporter or that Trump did not get hit with a bullet. All sorts of silly claims. Just let the facts come out.

I also noticed they have made another hit on another drug boat. So this is not stopping them from stopping these drug boats. They seem to believe they have a legal right and no one has challenged this yet. So they must have some pretty good intel and legal advice.
 
Upvote 0

NxNW

Well-Known Member
Nov 30, 2019
7,767
5,309
NW
✟282,118.00
Country
United States
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
That you say this actually shows your bias and in doing so are promoting the very thing I am talking about.
I provided factual links, so your claims of bias are without merit.
Ah the old Trumps a felon. I have not heard that one for a while. When all else fails revert back to the stock standard narrative. We have already seen the witch hunt with all that lawfare trying to get Trump.
It's not a witch hunt when he's convicted by an impartial jury.
I wonder if the same level or even half that level will expose the dirty secrets of those who tried to get him.
So far, no dirty secrets have come out.
Already some are being exposed. More will come out. It seems the Dems fingerprints are all over the Epstein files.
Link?

The GOP were the ones suppressing the files.
Give me a break you have no moral ground to stand on.
I'm not the one committing fraud and rape and pardoning drug dealers.
So far Trump has done exactly what he promosed and it seems most people supported this.
That must be why his approval rating is so low.
Hum have you asked Epstein exactly what Clinton was doing on the plane so many times.
Nobody cares about flying on a plane. They care about traveling to the island, which Clinton never did. He said to go ahead and release the files, since he's got nothing to hide.
Or exactly what he was saying to a Dem rep in congress. Or what all the other Dems connection is with Epstein were up to. Why had this not been investigated by the Dems with the same vigor in getting Trump.
Trump was the one who allowed him to be killed in prison, not the Dems.
Why did the Dems including Waltz who was actually a VP candidate not investigate the many frauds under his watch as though he knew all along but kept it quiet because he would lose votes. Or at the least was grossly incompetent and yet was made the Vice Presidential candidate.
There you go, trying to change the subject.
Which shows how far out of touch with reality they were. Not that everyone already knew that with a inadequate presidential candidate who was not even vetting democractically but chose by the same elites who look like also being connected to all the fraud and dirty deeds.
Which "elites" are these?
While gaslighting the nation over Biden and the auto signing of a record number of people including known felons or those potentially who did wrong being shielded.
Never happened.
There is still more Dem states to be investigated and it looks like more fraud and corruption. In fact the biggest fraud scandel in US history.
So far we haven't seen anything.
Like I said I would be very careful about throwing stones. There is absolutely no moral ground and they have disqualified themselves as credible.
The GOP? I don't see any Dem scandals at all.
In fact their corruption and incompetence is so bad that this is why such drastic action is needed. Because this is a system wide breakdown. Its unreliable, untrustworthy and actually a national safety and security risk. Thus a complete restructuring is needed. We will see how low the Dems in power have gone with their dirty little secrets.
I want to hear about these dirty little secrets. How do they compare to Stormy Daniels and Micheal Cohen and Trump's collusion with Russia?
 
Upvote 0

NxNW

Well-Known Member
Nov 30, 2019
7,767
5,309
NW
✟282,118.00
Country
United States
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
Your using language "in peril at sea" implies innocent people were killed. When you don't know the context. This is not some boating accident but terrorist actively engaged in the transfer of drugs.
None of them were ever convicted of any crimes.
 
Upvote 0

NxNW

Well-Known Member
Nov 30, 2019
7,767
5,309
NW
✟282,118.00
Country
United States
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
Upvote 0

NxNW

Well-Known Member
Nov 30, 2019
7,767
5,309
NW
✟282,118.00
Country
United States
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
Upvote 0

NxNW

Well-Known Member
Nov 30, 2019
7,767
5,309
NW
✟282,118.00
Country
United States
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
How do you know what the stakes are. Do you have the intel. How do you know there is not connections to actual terrorist. That the money from drugs is funding terrorism. Who says that the flooding of poison into a neighbouring nation that kills 1,000s and destroys families and communities is not an act or terror.
You need a guilty verdict in a court of law before you can make such assumptions.

In this country, we don't kill the innocent, nor do we kill the guilty without a trial.
 
Upvote 0