Are the Jews Israel, or is the church Israel? Or does it depend on the context of the passage?

[Daniel Martinovich]

However, Mount Zion has always represented rulership - David`s and the Lord`s.

What’s the point though? Did you read the link? The new Jerusalem is Gods people in the here and now on earth. Suffering and then triumphant on earth.

 

[Daniel Martinovich]

I agree with a lot that you write, but this all started with the appearance of the Messiah 2000 years ago. This work has been ongoing since the earthly ministry of Christ and will continue till the second coming. This is not merely a future event. Yes, God can move in a dramatic way among physical israelites today (to whatever degree), but His focus is the nations today (including Israel) and will continue until His climactic return.

The whole thing is a process that started way before Christ came. The only reason I mention the future is because that is where the process is leading us.
However, I don’t hold to any traditions of a second advent and especially when it involves a physical kingdom on earth.

 

[sovereigngrace]

The whole thing is a process that started way before Christ came. The only reason I mention the future is because that is where the process is leading us.
However, I don’t hold to any traditions of a second advent and especially when it involves a physical kingdom on earth.

You do not believe in a literal physical visible future return of Christ?

 

[Daniel Martinovich]

I do believe in the literal- physical; coming, past present and future of the Lord. I do not believe in the traditions of men about second advent heralding the end of the world as we know it.

THE COMING OF THE LORD

The Bible's record of the Lord physically coming to the earth.

wordservice.org

 

[Marilyn C]

What’s the point though? Did you read the link? The new Jerusalem is Gods people in the here and now on earth. Suffering and then triumphant on earth.

The Body of Christ is never called the New Jerusalem and it is not our inheritance but for the OT saints. (Heb. 11: 16)

Our inheritance in on the Lord`s own throne in the highest. (Rev. 3: 21)

 

[Daniel Martinovich]

That is just a pathetic falsehood.
But you do you.

 

[Guojing]

Several passages of Scripture clearly establish that the coming of Christ has brought an end to the Mosaic Law.

Exactly when do you think Peter, James and the other apostles realized that to be true?

 

[sovereigngrace]

Paul was saying that of the Jews - a person who is truly a Jew is one inwardly - by believing in Jesus.

Paul was not saying that a Gentile by virtue of believing in Jesus is a Jew.

The only thing that matters is if a person is a Christian or not. Believers in Jesus are Christians. Just go with that.

Can you answer these simple questions?

1. The Bible says we (the redeemed of all nations and ethnic groups) have been grafted into 'an Israeli tree' (Romans 9-11). Is that an ethnic or spiritual tree?
2. The Bible says we who were once aliens from the "citizenship of Israel" have now been brought in through the blood of Christ to that privileged place (Ephesians 2). Is that ethnic or spiritual Israel?
3. The Bible says that Jew and Gentile alike, have now been graciously merged together into "the Israel of God" (Galatians 6:15-16). Is that ethnic or spiritual Israel?
4. The Bible says we are 'Jews' and we are "the circumcision" today (Romans 2:25-29; Philippians 3:3 and Colossians 2:11). Is that ethnic or spiritual Jews?
5. The Bible says we are "the children of Abraham" (Romans 4:11; 4:13-15; 4:16-18; 9:6-8; Galatians 3:7-9; 3:12-14; 3:16 and 3:26-29) today. Are we the ethnic or spiritual "children of Abraham"?
6. The Bible says we now reside and abide in "Jerusalem" and "Mount Zion" (Matthew 21:42-46; John 3:3; Romans 9:33; 11:26; Ephesians 1:3; Ephesians 2:4-6; Philippians 3:20; Hebrews 12:22 and 1 Peter 2:5-10). Is that natural physical earthly "Jerusalem" and "Mount Zion" or is that spiritual heavenly "Jerusalem" and "Mount Zion"?