Mississippi School Homecoming Celebrations Turn Deadly as 8 People are Killed 20 Injured in Separate Shootings

[Larniavc]

They need strong religious leaders who teach those things. They need strong political leaders who teach those those things. They need teachers who teach those things.

Americans will never let that happen.

 

[Larniavc]

Drug and gang activity, and shooting at rival gang members tends to keep one poor.

It’s the other way around.

 

[MarkSB]

The question becomes, how many homicides were committed by people who bought the gun from a private sale?

It's a small percentage of the total, but it still happens. There are many examples provided in one of the other posts.

It's a loophole in the law. Why not close the loophole?

 

[RileyG]

Correct.

I never meant human responsibility should be diminished. There MUST be policies changes. But I probably sound like a broken record

Sigh

 

[JosephZ]

Most guns used in the crimes we're talking about were bought from dealers after a background check, or stolen.

This is true, but many of those guns that were legally purchased from dealers are then sold through private sales. A 2010 article from The New England Journal of Medicine states that some 85% of all guns used in crimes and then recovered by law-enforcement agencies have been sold at least once by private parties. It goes on to say, the private-party gun market, sometimes called the informal gun market, has long been recognized as a leading source of guns used in crimes. Although private-party sales are primarily a convenience for the law-abiding purchaser (since they involve no paperwork, no background check, and no waiting period), such sales are also the principal option when the prospective purchaser is a felon, a domestic-violence offender, or another person prohibited by law from owning a gun.

A study conducted around the same time found that regulation of private gun sales significantly lowered levels of gun trafficking.

Our findings indicated that comprehensive regulation and regular compliance inspections of retail gun dealers as well as the regulation of private handgun sales were each associated with significantly lower levels of gun trafficking. As would be expected, these relationships were strongest for guns originally sold within the same state in which they were recovered from criminals. Although cities in states with the most comprehensive gun sale regulations attract some guns from states with weaker gun laws, the combination of strong gun dealer regulations and regulation of private handgun sales were still associated with fewer trafficked guns even after controlling for local levels of gun ownership. Consistent with our findings, a recent study found that states which regulate private gun sales exported crime guns to other states at a rate that was half as high as that of states that did not regulate private guns sales

 

[Aldebaran]

It’s the other way around.

The other way around is that the poor go out and get a job, not a gang membership.

 

[Bradskii]

Bradskii checks to see if he's still in a Christian forum.

 

[Aldebaran]

It's a small percentage of the total, but it still happens. There are many examples provided in one of the other posts.

It's a loophole in the law. Why not close the loophole?

The word "loophole" is meant to be derogatory. That's like saying tax exemptions are a loophole in the tax law that need to be closed, when in fact they are there for specific reasons. Or mandating that a person working on his own vehicle in his own driveway should be taxed and regulated the same way an auto body shop is. The background checks for guns is meant for dealers, not private individuals.

 

[Aldebaran]

Bradskii checks to see if he's still in a Christian forum.

Good for him.

 

[Aldebaran]

This is true, but many of those guns that were legally purchased from dealers are then sold through private sales. A 2010 article from The New England Journal of Medicine states that some 85% of all guns used in crimes and then recovered by law-enforcement agencies have been sold at least once by private parties. It goes on to say, the private-party gun market, sometimes called the informal gun market, has long been recognized as a leading source of guns used in crimes. Although private-party sales are primarily a convenience for the law-abiding purchaser (since they involve no paperwork, no background check, and no waiting period), such sales are also the principal option when the prospective purchaser is a felon, a domestic-violence offender, or another person prohibited by law from owning a gun.

A study conducted around the same time found that regulation of private gun sales significantly lowered levels of gun trafficking.

Our findings indicated that comprehensive regulation and regular compliance inspections of retail gun dealers as well as the regulation of private handgun sales were each associated with significantly lower levels of gun trafficking. As would be expected, these relationships were strongest for guns originally sold within the same state in which they were recovered from criminals. Although cities in states with the most comprehensive gun sale regulations attract some guns from states with weaker gun laws, the combination of strong gun dealer regulations and regulation of private handgun sales were still associated with fewer trafficked guns even after controlling for local levels of gun ownership. Consistent with our findings, a recent study found that states which regulate private gun sales exported crime guns to other states at a rate that was half as high as that of states that did not regulate private guns sales

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I've purchased guns privately in the past. It never made them part of "illegal commerce" since private transactions are legal.

 

[Bradskii]

Good for him.

You really won't believe the number of times I have to remind myself. I quoted what someone said a couple of weeks ago to my wife. She said that if I go trolling in the darker reaches of the internet then there's bound to be some people with those sorts of degenerate views. Then I showed her which forum it was. There was a sigh and a slow head shake...

 

[JosephZ]

I've purchased guns privately in the past. It never made them part of "illegal commerce" since private transactions are legal.

Again, what you say is true. If I want to, I could head to my local flea market in the morning and buy a gun without a background check and few, if any, questions asked. Or I could check out Armslist and see if anyone in my area has a good deal on an AR15 and meet them somewhere, hand them the money they're asking, and take it home. It shouldn't be that easy for me to buy a gun.

 

[rjs330]

There's no way to know for certain, but it's a problem. Below are a few examples of why a law requiring background checks when a gun is sold privately is a good idea.

New York City gunman bought rifle from casino supervisor, police say

Gun law loophole allowed Odessa mass shooting suspect to buy AR-type assault rifle: Sources

St. Louis school shooter bought gun from private seller after dealer sale was blocked, police say

Suspect in Austin shooting rampage bought gun after 2022 assault arrest, police say

Killer bought gun after stalking charge dropped

Man accused of killing ex-girlfriend is sentenced to life in prison

Family of Slain Chicago Police Officer Sues Armslist

Family massacre suspect reportedly details how 8 killings were planned, executed

North Las Vegas day care shooting that killed nurse was domestic violence murder-suicide

From a Loving Father Who Lost His Son in the Columbine Massacre 14 Years Ago

The Tanner Gun Show is a regular fixture in Denver, conducted a few weekends every year. Firearms are sold by both licensed dealers and private (unlicensed) sellers. The would-be killers examined guns and asked [Klebold’s friend, Robyn] Anderson to buy three guns they spotted. Two were shotguns, and one was a shorter gun, a Hi Point 9 mm Carbine. The killers assumed they needed Anderson to purchase the guns for them because she was eighteen and they were both seventeen at the time.

According to Anderson, the gun sellers should have known it was a straw purchase—a purchase by one person on behalf of another who is prohibited from making the purchase. She claimed it should have been clear because the killers were the ones who asked questions and checked out weapons.

Anderson purchased the firearms from a private seller, not a licensed dealer. She testified before a legislative panel that as she and the two boys walked through the gun show, Harris and Klebold “kept asking sellers if they were private or licensed. They wanted to buy their guns from someone who was private and not licensed because there would be no paperwork or background check…I was not asked any questions at all [she said]. There was no background check…I would not have bought a gun for Eric and Dylan if I had had to give any personal information or submit any kind of check at all.”

Robyn Anderson was not charged with a crime for transferring the three guns she had bought in a straw purchase for the Columbine killers.

Early in 1999 Klebold and Harris returned to the Tanner Gun Show. They met [two men], Philip Duran, a man they knew from the pizza restaurant [where they worked], and his friend, Mark Manes… Duran became the middleman in a deal to purchase an Intratek TEC DC-9 semi-automatic handgun from Manes. Because it was a handgun, rather than a long gun or rifle, it was illegal for Manes to sell it to minors, and illegal for Duran to act as middleman in arranging the sale. They would later be convicted and sent to jail for those crimes.


Armslist was source of guns in high-profile domestic violence deaths

Radcliffe Haughton and Robert Schmidt weren't allowed to have a gun.

Haughton could not have a gun because of a restraining order issued following his longtime abuse of his wife, Zina Daniel Haughton. Schmidt couldn't have one under a bond condition he had in a felony domestic violence case stemming from an assault on his wife, Sara Schmidt.

Haughton and Schmidt were able to sidestep those court orders by turning to Armslist.com, where each bought a handgun in a private sale.


It Was Just Another Texas Gun Deal, Except the Buyer Was Cop Killer Micah Johnson

Parked in a 2005 gold Impala, Colton Crews waited in a busy Target parking lot, an AK-47 in the trunk of his car.

He’d met the buyer in a private gun-trading Facebook group and set the deal up in this parking lot. Despite its apparent seediness, it was perfectly legal in Texas for individuals to sell guns from their private stock out of the back of their cars as long as the buyer is a Texan.

Facebook users across the nation have been buying, selling and trading guns in private Facebook groups. Members often meet in parking lots and at flea markets to complete their transactions.

He’d been buying and trading firearms out of the back of his car in parking lots across North Texas since 2012. He picked up the AK-47 in the trunk about six months earlier, in a parking lot behind a pancake house in Bedford.

Micah Johnson had finally arrived for his rifle.

Johnson became an internationally reviled mass murderer, and Crews still can’t believe he sold him a gun that could have been used to kill five Dallas police officers and injure nearly a dozen more at a demonstration against police violence on July 7.

Since you dont know how many then you cannot say its a problem. In order to say something is a problem you have to be able to give correct data to support it. And since you dont have it, you can't say its a problem. You are guessing.

 

[rjs330]

Racist is not a culture.

We've seen a clash of cultures not racism. Not all cultures believe in tge same things. Thats why there are different cultures. Depending on where people are from even those of the same race can have a different culture. Not everything is racial. But I guess you are entitled to think it is. Thats a very limited point of view.

 

[rjs330]

Americans will never let that happen.

What Americans? I certainly dont think i could put a stop to it. I also wouldn't want to. I certainly dont think I'm the only one.

 

[rjs330]

It's a small percentage of the total, but it still happens. There are many examples provided in one of the other posts.

It's a loophole in the law. Why not close the loophole?

Funny how small percentages seem to only matter for certain things. Yet small percentages don't matter for others. They are touted as "not that bad because its just a small percentage and so we dont really need to address it."

Look, I personally could care less if private sales had to have background checks. Just dont blow smoke up our skirts, trying to tell us its a problem and its going to solve much of anything. Its not.

 

[Larniavc]

Bradskii checks to see if he's still in a Christian forum.

I grew up in rural southern England in the late 70s. The Christianity that was endemic then is very different to the Christianity I’m exposed to in this site.

 

[Larniavc]

We've seen a clash of cultures not racism. Not all cultures believe in tge same things. Thats why there are different cultures. Depending on where people are from even those of the same race can have a different culture. Not everything is racial. But I guess you are entitled to think it is. Thats a very limited point of view.

Thing is, the ‘culture’ that went on those marches is my culture. I’m as English as the long day. But it is only the racist people within my culture who go on these marches.

Also the ring leaders often turn out to be criminals like Stephen Yaxley-Lennon and Anthony Styles.

So it’s not about culture; it’s about racism with a side of fraud, common assault and indecent assault of children.

 

[Hazelelponi]

This is true, but many of those guns that were legally purchased from dealers are then sold through private sales. A 2010 article from The New England Journal of Medicine states that some 85% of all guns used in crimes and then recovered by law-enforcement agencies have been sold at least once by private parties. It goes on to say, the private-party gun market, sometimes called the informal gun market, has long been recognized as a leading source of guns used in crimes. Although private-party sales are primarily a convenience for the law-abiding purchaser (since they involve no paperwork, no background check, and no waiting period), such sales are also the principal option when the prospective purchaser is a felon, a domestic-violence offender, or another person prohibited by law from owning a gun.

A study conducted around the same time found that regulation of private gun sales significantly lowered levels of gun trafficking.

Our findings indicated that comprehensive regulation and regular compliance inspections of retail gun dealers as well as the regulation of private handgun sales were each associated with significantly lower levels of gun trafficking. As would be expected, these relationships were strongest for guns originally sold within the same state in which they were recovered from criminals. Although cities in states with the most comprehensive gun sale regulations attract some guns from states with weaker gun laws, the combination of strong gun dealer regulations and regulation of private handgun sales were still associated with fewer trafficked guns even after controlling for local levels of gun ownership. Consistent with our findings, a recent study found that states which regulate private gun sales exported crime guns to other states at a rate that was half as high as that of states that did not regulate private guns sales

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I don't know anything about the research this medical journal did, and don't automatically trust it. Gun sales aren't exactly medicine, so that makes this outfit most likely to be politically partisan while masquerading as something upstanding in the field of medicine.

It is actually illegal here in the United States to sell a gun to someone legally prohibited from purchasing a gun.

That actually mean If someone couldn't pass a background check to legally purchase a gun, it's a crime on it's own to sell it to them.

When guns are legally registered to you - and you registered upon purchase like 99.9% of gun owners in America - anything that happens with that gun is still potentially on you.

Because, let's say you sold your gun to joe blow and he goes and commits a crime with the gun, and then it's found the individual was a felon at the time of the sale, guess what - you get to go to jail.

Being hyper careful about the who, you are entering into a private gun sale with is exceedingly important.

The private gun sale behind the counter of a convenience store to a felon or other criminal type is illegal on its face and the seller is as criminal as the buyer in such a situation.

The one thing legal gun ownership does actually help teach is respect for the law. There's laws inside laws on all of it, Federal and State level.

If we were to set law enforcement free to enforce the laws on the books we would be well served as a society. We don't need new laws we need to simply enforce the laws we have. Just straight up.

 

[d taylor]

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Well if yall think Mississippi is going to change its gun laws, then you better look for another solution.