Musk's Government Slashing Took Place When He Was Under the Influence of Ketamine, Ecstasy, Adderall, and More

[iluvatar5150]

Even the cybertruck in particular, if you go back and look at articles from 2019 about it, they were much more nuanced

Love it or hate it, Tesla’s Cybertruck is revolutionary

There’s no question Tesla’s Cybertruck will face stiff competition in the electric pickup truck market. Here’s why it has the edge.

theconversation.com

While they would acknowledge that it looked "odd", they almost talked about it in a "weird is good" (in a hipster kind of sense), and would often counterbalance any soft aesthetic critiques with a reminder that "EVs are important, and if this can get some truck drivers on to EVs, it's a net good"

Had Musk not re-aligned his political views, I'm guessing that a lot of left-leaning folks would've seen one as a status symbol, much like they did the Prius or the Chevy Bolt. (the Chevy Bolt was riddled with design flaws, battery issues, and constant recalls -- and despite all that, they still moved over 300,000 units)

Your article doesn’t contradict anything I wrote. Of course it was less overtly critical then - nobody had run it through its paces yet. But even that article says that it was “polarizing” and points out how Musk’s claims regarding the durability of the windows were nonsense. The thing was obviously flawed right out of the gate, meaning that people weren’t dumping on it because they didn’t like Musk. They were dumping on it because it was stupid.

ETA: As far as it being a status symbol- if you think something that ostentatious would function as a status symbol for the average Model 3/Y customer, then I have to wonder how many Tesla owners you know. Heck, I have to wonder how many urban/suburban normie-lib car owners you know. Aesthetically, Teslas are among the most boring looking cars in a sea of boring cars. The status displayed by a regular Tesla is “I’m cool, demure, high-tech, and eco-friendly,” whereas Cybertruck gives off similar vibes as a Lamborghini with a body kit. Yeah, everybody can see you spent a bunch of money, but…. ick.

 

[NxNW]

Could you offer something more substantial than accusations and insults?

I guess you missed the link I provided.

 

[NxNW]

Is that more important financially than what a company is worth?

We've already established that you're misusing terminology; try to keep up.

 

[NxNW]

Post accusations and insults rather than put any effort into your argument. Okey dokey.

Your argument was defeated, but you still don't recognize that.

 

[NxNW]

I doubt Prius or Chevy Bolt buyers were motivated by status. A more likely motivator was owning a low cost vehicle that was seen as a green alternative to comparable gas vehicles.

I bought my Bolt because the Tesla 3 wasn't out yet. They did replace the battery after the recall, which took a day. I'm not aware of these alleged design flaws.

 

[Servus]

Your argument was defeated, but you still don't recognize that.

When someone issues personal attacks in the form of accusations and insults in a debate, they've lost by default.

 

[Servus]

We've already established that you're misusing terminology; try to keep up.

More rudeness.

 

[Servus]

I guess you missed the link I provided.

When I ask someone a question I expect them to answer it in their own words.

 

[7thKeeper]

The losses in sales, profit, market share and standing as a brand are significant. The valuation is fantasy.

I follow the EV market a little bit. Tesla stock has started to gain reputation as a meme stock at this point, especially when you compare how the company is doing compared to other car makers and their stock.

 

[7thKeeper]

Even the cybertruck in particular, if you go back and look at articles from 2019 about it, they were much more nuanced

Love it or hate it, Tesla’s Cybertruck is revolutionary

There’s no question Tesla’s Cybertruck will face stiff competition in the electric pickup truck market. Here’s why it has the edge.

theconversation.com

While they would acknowledge that it looked "odd", they almost talked about it in a "weird is good" (in a hipster kind of sense), and would often counterbalance any soft aesthetic critiques with a reminder that "EVs are important, and if this can get some truck drivers on to EVs, it's a net good"

The problem is, the Cybertruck then arrived and failed to hold onto several promises made by Elon. Durability, range, price, all were way WAY worse than what Elon promised in 2019 and after.
It's a truck that doesn't work as well as a truck as other vehicles, it has issues with getting wet, the build quality isn't good with panels coming off, etc. and it cost over twice as much (iirc) than what it was originally supposed to.
And to top it all off, it can't be sold outside of the USA because the thing isn't road legal anywhere else in the world due to its design and build.

 

[SimplyMe]

From 270 billion to 429 billion from October 2024 until now, does not in any way whatsoever indicate that he's not making money or that he's losing money. 270 + 159 = 429. 159 divided by 8 months is 20. So he's made an average of an extra 20 billion per month in the last 8 months.

So going by the last 8 months it rounds off at 20 billion per month. However going by the last three months it rounds off at 23 billion. This clearly indicates that he's steadily been making more money, not less.

You seem to have missed my main points. First, that as you are further proving, the stock price has nothing to do with what Elon's actual worth. Yes, he could be worth that much but it is just a "paper" value -- if he actually tried to sell shares in Tesla to get that money, his selling of the stock would cause Tesla prices to drop, meaning he can't get that full value out of the shares he owns.

Next, it's been clearly shown that Tesla, the actual performance of the company, is declining. For most stocks, this causes stock prices to drop; for odd reasons Teslas is not dropping. This happens at times with stocks, as I mentioned, tech stocks went through this in the 1990s; where their stock was valued far more than the actual worth of the company, and we basically had a mild recession when the market corrected itself. Eventually, this is going to happen with Tesla, at some point -- particularly as they continue to lose market share.

Tesla used to be the only major EV maker (aside from a single car from Chevrolet and Nissan), the price they charged reflected they were the only choice and their market share was extremely high. Over about the last 5 years that has changed. Tesla is slowly selling less cars every year, even while the EV market is expanding (even in the US). As part of this, Tesla has substantially dropped the price on their cars -- while they haven't "lost" quite as much per sale as the price drop of each car, as their manufacturing has become more efficient, they are still making less per car. So making less per car and selling fewer cars means the company is making less money; at some point, the stock price will correct itself again (like it did last fall/winter) and Musk will again lose hundreds of billions of net worth. Whether Elon is high on drugs or not is not affecting his net worth, that is solely based on investors being willing to overpay for Tesla stock.

 

[Hans Blaster]

I was referring to the EV market share.

For what it's worth, even with all the other car makers dipping their toes into the EV market, Tesla still has over 40% of the domestic market share for electric vehicles.

Since Tesla is the only EV-only brand I recognize on the street, I can hardly tell what cars are electric while driving unless they have the Tesla badge. I've seen a few other electrics parked, but they look just like IC or Hybrid vehicles. They are a pretty minor component of vehicles on the road and most are small 4-door sedans. (There is that one ugliod driving around town, though.) Tesla is a minor manufacturer of cars.

Electric Vehicle Sales and Market Share (US - Q3 2025 Updates)

Automakers are rapidly launching electrified lineups. This page will be updated with the latest EV market share and sales numbers in 2025.

caredge.com

As of the first quarter of 2025, Tesla holds approximately 43.5% of the U.S. electric vehicle (EV) market share, according to Cox Automotive . This marks a decline from 49% in 2024 and 55% in 2023, continuing a downward trend from its peak of 75% in early 2022.

Gee that doesn't sound like it was driven by politics, does it?

 

[SimplyMe]

I was referring to the EV market share.

For what it's worth, even with all the other car makers dipping their toes into the EV market, Tesla still has over 40% of the domestic market share for electric vehicles.

Electric Vehicle Sales and Market Share (US - Q3 2025 Updates)

Automakers are rapidly launching electrified lineups. This page will be updated with the latest EV market share and sales numbers in 2025.

caredge.com

As of the first quarter of 2025, Tesla holds approximately 43.5% of the U.S. electric vehicle (EV) market share, according to Cox Automotive . This marks a decline from 49% in 2024 and 55% in 2023, continuing a downward trend from its peak of 75% in early 2022.

The claim I was replying to was that their market share was down because "Their latest product is an electric El Camino dressed in panels from an old walk-in cooler."

I was suggesting that sales decline had less to do with the "looks", and more to do with peoples' distaste for the owner's political positions. (Given that people were more than willing to drive some quite ugly EVs and Hybrids for over a decade)


It would be like if people were trying to claim that the reason for Bud Light sales taking a dip was because the beer tastes bad... It's always tasted bad, and people boycotting it happily drank other ones that tasted just as bad. Anyone with half a brain knew that the reason for the dip was the whole Dylan Mulvaney thing.

Sorry, the facts in your previous post disagree with your claim it is all based on Musk's politics. If it was simply Musk's politics causing the big drop in sales, then it would have started occurring just last year, when he tied himself to Trump. Instead, as you point out, sales started dropping in 2022 and really accelerated in 2023 -- it had far more to do with EVs (much more competition) than it does with politics.

This is doubly true if you look at the countries where the biggest losses are occurring. It is in Europe and places like Australia where Tesla is losing the largest amount of market share. In the US, where it is "the left" that traditionally have bought Teslas and where "the Left" is allegedly the most upset with him, Tesla still sells more EVs in the US than any other company. If your claims were true, it would be the US were Tesla market share would have dropped the most, since "the Left" would have completely quit buying his cars.

It is also worth pointing out there are two main differences between Europe and the US when it comes to non-Tesla EV adoption. First, Teslas use the standard EV charging connectors in the EU (CCS2), as it was mandated all manufacturers use it in Europe. Additionally, EV charging stations have been much more aggressively built out in Europe, so there is little "range anxiety" with non-Tesla cars.

Secondly, and perhaps more importantly, the Chinese sell EVs in Europe and they are starting to dominate the market both there and in Australia. As I mentioned in a previous post, it is BYD that has stolen much of the EV market share from Tesla in Europe. Tesla isn't having to fight them in the US, at least yet, and US manufacturers have claimed that the Chinese EV technology is a decade ahead of ours (at least, other than Tesla).

Even the cybertruck in particular, if you go back and look at articles from 2019 about it, they were much more nuanced

Love it or hate it, Tesla’s Cybertruck is revolutionary

There’s no question Tesla’s Cybertruck will face stiff competition in the electric pickup truck market. Here’s why it has the edge.

theconversation.com

While they would acknowledge that it looked "odd", they almost talked about it in a "weird is good" (in a hipster kind of sense), and would often counterbalance any soft aesthetic critiques with a reminder that "EVs are important, and if this can get some truck drivers on to EVs, it's a net good"

In 2019, though, there was no Cybertruck; they were commenting merely on the prototype and the hype Elon was selling. Then, when it was finally released at the end of 2023 there were a number of promised features that were not there, numerous issues and recalls (bad motors and parts falling off), and people found that it couldn't really tow (you'd pull the back bumper off and bend the frame). Additionally, it doesn't have the range, even if it could reliably tow, and the promised "range extender" that some buyers paid for has been cancelled. It also is not as good at offloading as other EV trucks.

By contrast, both Ford and Chevy made more traditional trucks that appear to be far better at doing "truck things" than the Cybertruck. The Ford F150 Lightning appears to do more of what laborers want in a truck, aside from the fact that range gets cut to about 150 miles if you want to tow. The Chevy Silverado EV (and the GM Sierra EV) appears to solve the towing issue, as their range is up to almost 500 miles under normal conditions, meaning that they should still get 200-plus miles while towing.

Had Musk not re-aligned his political views, I'm guessing that a lot of left-leaning folks would've seen one as a status symbol, much like they did the Prius or the Chevy Bolt. (the Chevy Bolt was riddled with design flaws, battery issues, and constant recalls -- and despite all that, they still moved over 300,000 units)

Except, if you look, the Bolt reflects those issues. First, it sold around 25K in 2017 and dropped to 18K and then 16K the next couple of years. It helped that it was about $20,000 less than Teslas. When they tackled the issue, including replacing batteries on all the cars, the sales numbers rebounded -- particularly after dropping the starting price to under $30,000 dollars. Despite that, 300,000 total units is not a lot -- as Tesla sold nearly 1.2 million Model 3s in that same general time period (though the Model 3 came out a year later). Or to compare Bolt sales to a similar Chevy ICE car, the Cruze, was selling over 200,000 cars per year in that time frame.

I think the issues with the Cybertruck would have kept it from becoming a status symbol, particularly with how overpriced it has been. It is also hurt that is is much less efficient than other Teslas, so it isn't a great "green" choice (though that is an issue with all pickup trucks).

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Since Tesla is the only EV-only brand I recognize on the street, I can hardly tell what cars are electric while driving unless they have the Tesla badge. I've seen a few other electrics parked, but they look just like IC or Hybrid vehicles. They are a pretty minor component of vehicles on the road and most are small 4-door sedans. (There is that one ugliod driving around town, though.) Tesla is a minor manufacturer of cars.

Gee that doesn't sound like it was driven by politics, does it?

Source: Perplexity

 

[Hans Blaster]

Source: Perplexity

Who is "perplexity"? Never heard of that outlet. You didn't give a link.

View attachment 365771

I don't think all of these bullet points make any point that responds to my post.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Who is "perplexity"? Never heard of that outlet. You didn't give a link.

Imagine a ChatGPT, but more finely tuned to harvest data from news sources

I don't think all of these bullet points make any point that responds to my post.

It does...

My comment was:
As of the first quarter of 2025, Tesla holds approximately 43.5% of the U.S. electric vehicle (EV) market share, according to Cox Automotive . This marks a decline from 49% in 2024 and 55% in 2023, continuing a downward trend from its peak of 75% in early 2022.

Your response was:
Gee that doesn't sound like it was driven by politics, does it?

I assume you were implying that you didn't think the timelines lined up (correct me if I'm wrong)

2022: Tesla has over 70% of the EV market share
Mid-2022: Musk calls democratic party "the party of division" and announces his intent to vote republican
Late-2022: Musk acquires Twitter and starts making posts about supporting conservative immigration initiatives
2023: Tesla's market share dips to 55%
2024: Musk fully embraces "MAGA"
Mid-2024: Tesla EV market share dips to 43%

Seems like the Tesla "dips" perfectly align with his political transition.


Further evidence are the people slapping stickers on their Teslas with quotes like "Bought this before Elon went crazy"

This piece by Politico delves into some of it:

Elon Musk makes parties flip their scripts on Tesla

Republican lawmakers are fawning over President Donald Trump's new Tesla and Democrats are shunning theirs.

www.eenews.net

This one is fun:
Senator Mark Kelly (D-AZ) got rid of his Model S and replaced it with a new, gas-powered Chevrolet Tahoe, touting the fact that it was union-made

Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (D-N.Y.) has been saying that she wants to exchange her Tesla for a vehicle made with union labor.


Gee...It's almost like people are using the vehicle they drive to virtue signal.

I have to wonder, was it ever about the environment for them? Doesn't seem like it if a person swaps an EV for a gas guzzling Tahoe that gets 15 miles to the gallon.


Environmentally-friendly EV that's made by a guy who disagrees with me politically vs. Gas Guzzler "cuz it's union-made"....and they choose the latter -- interesting.

Odd how the "union made" thing never entered the conversation a few years back with regards to gas-guzzlers and only became a backup justification when convenient.

It's almost like they're virtue signaling...weird.

 

[SimplyMe]

Imagine a ChatGPT, but more finely tuned to harvest data from news sources

It does...

My comment was:
As of the first quarter of 2025, Tesla holds approximately 43.5% of the U.S. electric vehicle (EV) market share, according to Cox Automotive . This marks a decline from 49% in 2024 and 55% in 2023, continuing a downward trend from its peak of 75% in early 2022.

Your response was:
Gee that doesn't sound like it was driven by politics, does it?

I assume you were implying that you didn't think the timelines lined up (correct me if I'm wrong)

2022: Tesla has over 70% of the EV market share
Mid-2022: Musk calls democratic party "the party of division" and announces his intent to vote republican
Late-2022: Musk acquires Twitter and starts making posts about supporting conservative immigration initiatives
2023: Tesla's market share dips to 55%
2024: Musk fully embraces "MAGA"
Mid-2024: Tesla EV market share dips to 43%

Seems like the Tesla "dips" perfectly align with his political transition.


Further evidence are the people slapping stickers on their Teslas with quotes like "Bought this before Elon went crazy"
View attachment 365779


This piece by Politico delves into some of it:

Elon Musk makes parties flip their scripts on Tesla

Republican lawmakers are fawning over President Donald Trump's new Tesla and Democrats are shunning theirs.

www.eenews.net

This one is fun:
Senator Mark Kelly (D-AZ) got rid of his Model S and replaced it with a new, gas-powered Chevrolet Tahoe, touting the fact that it was union-made

Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (D-N.Y.) has been saying that she wants to exchange her Tesla for a vehicle made with union labor.


Gee...It's almost like people are using the vehicle they drive to virtue signal.

I have to wonder, was it ever about the environment for them? Doesn't seem like it if a person swaps an EV for a gas guzzling Tahoe that gets 15 miles to the gallon.


Environmentally-friendly EV that's made by a guy who disagrees with me politically vs. Gas Guzzler "cuz it's union-made"....and they choose the latter -- interesting.

Odd how the "union made" thing never entered the conversation a few years back with regards to gas-guzzlers and only became a backup justification when convenient.

It's almost like they're virtue signaling...weird.

Again, the issue is that you see the exact same time frames in Europe, where Tesla market share has dropped much further. If it was just "the Left" in general, particularly with one of the swipes only against Democrats, you wouldn't see those same dips at the same time in Europe as you do in the US. Additionally, you would have seen those stickers prior to the last 6 months or so but, from what I've seen, no one had those stickers before Musk aligned himself with Trump (and more particularly took the DOGE job).

Worse for your claim, Tesla actually sold more cars in 2022 (536,069) than they did in 2021 (301,998) in the US, and more cars in 2023 (670,000) than they did in 2022. Which again supports the idea that other people started selling EVs, which is what caused the market share drop, and nothing to do with "the Left" not buying Teslas. 2024 is the year sales actually dropped in the US. As I stated previously, Tesla had months long waits for those who ordered a Tesla, my recollection is it was frequently close to a 6 month wait. Tesla was producing as many cars as they were capable of (the increase in production from 2021 - 2023 corresponds with the Tesla Gigafactory opening and ramping up production). That doesn't indicate the left not buying them in 2022 and 2023.

What I hinted at previously and it will be interesting to see what happens, Chinese EVs may be coming to the US. Trump's "deal" with the Chinese to cut tariffs lower all tariffs on Chinese goods to 30% -- which would include the 100% tariff Biden put on Chinese cars also being cut to 30%. At 100%, the Chinese EVs were too expensive to compete in the US but, even with a 30% tariff, that will bring the prices of Chinese EVs down to a range where they will be very competitive with the EVs currently in the US. Trump might still stop the Chinese EVs from being imported but, with his administrations seeming dislike of EVs (getting rid of incentives and even adding EV only taxes in the Big Beautiful Bill), I'm not sure that he'll care enough to keep the tariffs high on those cars. Then Elon could be in danger of losing much more market share, like he has in Europe, regardless of how "the Left" feels about him.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Imagine a ChatGPT, but more finely tuned to harvest data from news sources

Oh great, more pointless AI "tools" to avoid doing our own thinking. Sigh.

It does...

My comment was:
As of the first quarter of 2025, Tesla holds approximately 43.5% of the U.S. electric vehicle (EV) market share, according to Cox Automotive . This marks a decline from 49% in 2024 and 55% in 2023, continuing a downward trend from its peak of 75% in early 2022.

Your response was:
Gee that doesn't sound like it was driven by politics, does it?

I assume you were implying that you didn't think the timelines lined up (correct me if I'm wrong)

2022: Tesla has over 70% of the EV market share
Mid-2022: Musk calls democratic party "the party of division" and announces his intent to vote republican
Late-2022: Musk acquires Twitter and starts making posts about supporting conservative immigration initiatives
2023: Tesla's market share dips to 55%
2024: Musk fully embraces "MAGA"
Mid-2024: Tesla EV market share dips to 43%

Seems like the Tesla "dips" perfectly align with his political transition.

And you know this correlation is causal because?

Further evidence are the people slapping stickers on their Teslas with quotes like "Bought this before Elon went crazy"
View attachment 365779


This piece by Politico delves into some of it:

Elon Musk makes parties flip their scripts on Tesla

Republican lawmakers are fawning over President Donald Trump's new Tesla and Democrats are shunning theirs.

www.eenews.net

This one is fun:
Senator Mark Kelly (D-AZ) got rid of his Model S and replaced it with a new, gas-powered Chevrolet Tahoe, touting the fact that it was union-made

Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (D-N.Y.) has been saying that she wants to exchange her Tesla for a vehicle made with union labor.


Gee...It's almost like people are using the vehicle they drive to virtue signal.

I have to wonder, was it ever about the environment for them? Doesn't seem like it if a person swaps an EV for a gas guzzling Tahoe that gets 15 miles to the gallon.


Environmentally-friendly EV that's made by a guy who disagrees with me politically vs. Gas Guzzler "cuz it's union-made"....and they choose the latter -- interesting.

Odd how the "union made" thing never entered the conversation a few years back with regards to gas-guzzlers and only became a backup justification when convenient.

All of your anecdotes come from 2025.

It's almost like they're virtue signaling...weird.

The world's greatest crime, I know.

 

[iluvatar5150]

Imagine a ChatGPT, but more finely tuned to harvest data from news sources

It does...

My comment was:
As of the first quarter of 2025, Tesla holds approximately 43.5% of the U.S. electric vehicle (EV) market share, according to Cox Automotive . This marks a decline from 49% in 2024 and 55% in 2023, continuing a downward trend from its peak of 75% in early 2022.

Your response was:
Gee that doesn't sound like it was driven by politics, does it?

I assume you were implying that you didn't think the timelines lined up (correct me if I'm wrong)

2022: Tesla has over 70% of the EV market share
Mid-2022: Musk calls democratic party "the party of division" and announces his intent to vote republican
Late-2022: Musk acquires Twitter and starts making posts about supporting conservative immigration initiatives
2023: Tesla's market share dips to 55%
2024: Musk fully embraces "MAGA"
Mid-2024: Tesla EV market share dips to 43%

Seems like the Tesla "dips" perfectly align with his political transition.

They do align, but they could both stem from him getting distracted and going crazy.

I don't recall (and find documentation of) a large anti-Tesla backlash until Musk hooked up with Trump in late 2024. My recollection of the prior couple of years was that people were souring on him personally and also, independent of that, Tesla had been losing some of its luster for a number of reasons related to the quality of the cars and the service. There were a lot of stories about fires and about autopilot steering people into crashes.

 

[7thKeeper]

They do align, but they could both stem from him getting distracted and going crazy.

I don't recall (and find documentation of) a large anti-Tesla backlash until Musk hooked up with Trump in late 2024. My recollection of the prior couple of years was that people were souring on him personally and also, independent of that, Tesla had been losing some of its luster for a number of reasons related to the quality of the cars and the service. There were a lot of stories about fires and about autopilot steering people into crashes.

And in Europe, Musk had especially soured his image in Sweden and Germany with him giving the figurative middle finger to employees unions and deals made with them.