Georgia family says woman declared brain dead but her body kept alive for months under state's 'heartbeat' law; doctors and family have no options

[essentialsaltes]

Adriana Smith's been on life support 90+ days with weeks to go in her pregnancy. Her family questions Georgia’s heartbeat law — and why they had no say in her care.

“She’s been breathing through machines for more than 90 days,” Newkirk said. “It’s torture for me. I see my daughter breathing, but she’s not there. And her son—I bring him to see her.”

On Tuesday, Smith was moved to Emory Midtown, which doctors told the family is better equipped for obstetric care.

The plan now is to keep Smith alive until doctors believe the baby can survive outside the womb — likely at 32 weeks gestation.

Because she is brain dead — [the mother's life is not in danger] — her medical team is legally required to maintain life support until the fetus reaches viability.

In most cases in other states, the decision would defer to the mother's wishes or those of her next of kin. This is also under the assumption that it would be difficult for the fetus to make it to viability with the mother's condition, so the family could choose to terminate.

Newkirk said doctors told the family the baby has fluid on the brain and they're not sure how much fluid. They're concerned about his health.

 

[RileyG]

Can a clinically brain dead woman even give birth?

 

[essentialsaltes]

Can a clinically brain dead woman even give birth?

I assume by C-section. It's rare and the odds aren't great, but there are a handful of known cases.

Delivery of a Healthy Baby from a Brain-Dead Woman After 117 Days of Somatic Support: A Case Report - PMC

Patient: Female, 27-year-old Final Diagnosis: Brain death Symptoms: Loss of consciousness Medication:— Clinical Procedure: — Specialty: Critical Care Medicine • Obstetrics and Gynecology Rare disease The care and management of brain-dead pregnant ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Development of [brain death] during pregnancy is rare, and only 30 cases have been described in the medical literature since 1982, involving 19 infants who were born and survived the neonatal period

 

[comana]

Mother and baby should have died together. Keeping her body alive as an incubator is very wrong. The fetus is unlikely to develop correctly for viability anyway. This is no better than other cruel human experiments through history.

 

[RileyG]

I assume by C-section. It's rare and the odds aren't great, but there are a handful of known cases.

Delivery of a Healthy Baby from a Brain-Dead Woman After 117 Days of Somatic Support: A Case Report - PMC

Patient: Female, 27-year-old Final Diagnosis: Brain death Symptoms: Loss of consciousness Medication:— Clinical Procedure: — Specialty: Critical Care Medicine • Obstetrics and Gynecology Rare disease The care and management of brain-dead pregnant ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Development of [brain death] during pregnancy is rare, and only 30 cases have been described in the medical literature since 1982, involving 19 infants who were born and survived the neonatal period

I cannot imagine the agony and pain her family must be experiencing.

 

[johansen]

Mother and baby should have died together. Keeping her body alive as an incubator is very wrong. The fetus is unlikely to develop correctly for viability anyway. This is no better than other cruel human experiments through history.

Neglecting the family's opinion of the matter, what percentage of viability of the featus is your cut off for when it should be allowed to die with the mother?

So suppose the mother was already at 36 weeks... Why not save the child?

 

[Apple Sky]

Newkirk said doctors told the family the baby has fluid on the brain and they're not sure how much fluid. They're concerned about his health.

I don't understand. if the baby has fluid on the brain, surely it would be kinder to switch off the machine & let them both die in peace.

 

[RileyG]

I don't understand. if the baby has fluid on the brain, surely it would be kinder to switch off the machine & let them both die in peace.

Why not save the baby? They already lost the mother? Good grief.

Edit: didn’t read that clear enough.

 

[RileyG]

Neglecting the family's opinion of the matter, what percentage of viability of the featus is your cut off for when it should be allowed to die with the mother?

So suppose the mother was already at 36 weeks... Why not save the child?

I don't know. I'm 100% pro-life, and I would love to save the baby...but I have no idea IF the fetus is still viable. That's THE difference.

 

[RileyG]

Adriana Smith's been on life support 90+ days with weeks to go in her pregnancy. Her family questions Georgia’s heartbeat law — and why they had no say in her care.

“She’s been breathing through machines for more than 90 days,” Newkirk said. “It’s torture for me. I see my daughter breathing, but she’s not there. And her son—I bring him to see her.”

On Tuesday, Smith was moved to Emory Midtown, which doctors told the family is better equipped for obstetric care.

The plan now is to keep Smith alive until doctors believe the baby can survive outside the womb — likely at 32 weeks gestation.

Because she is brain dead — [the mother's life is not in danger] — her medical team is legally required to maintain life support until the fetus reaches viability.

In most cases in other states, the decision would defer to the mother's wishes or those of her next of kin. This is also under the assumption that it would be difficult for the fetus to make it to viability with the mother's condition, so the family could choose to terminate.

Newkirk said doctors told the family the baby has fluid on the brain and they're not sure how much fluid. They're concerned about his health.

What an awful experience the family must be experiencing. I have no words left.

 

[Nithavela]

I don't think that there are any good answers to this situation, and hindsight will be 20/20. If the child survives and turns out to not (or only lightly) impaired, it will be seen as a good choice. If it doesn't or the child has a big handicap, it won't.

One could also compare this situation to an organ donor situation, with the mother "donating" her reproductive system to the forming baby until it can live without it.

As a father, and without the mother telling me anything different, I would want the mother to be kept on the machines unless the doctors told me that there is little to no chance of the baby surviving or leading a quality life. But that's just me, and having the state take this choice away only heaps more misery on the family.

 

[Desk trauma]

One could also compare this situation to an organ donor situation, with the mother "donating" her reproductive system to the forming baby until it can live without it.

Poor comparison. Organ donation cannot be compelled against the persons or family’s wishes and does not come with the ruinous cost that months of care will incur.

 

[Desk trauma]

Terri Schiavo part deux. Now with even more authoritarianism.

 

[comana]

Neglecting the family's opinion of the matter, what percentage of viability of the featus is your cut off for when it should be allowed to die with the mother?

So suppose the mother was already at 36 weeks... Why not save the child?

If a fetus is viable when the mother dies, they will deliver and attempt to save it. What is happening in this case is criminal.

Neither the deceased mother nor her family consented to this and it is at a cost the family is forced to bear emotionally and financially.

 

[Desk trauma]

What is happening in this case is criminal.

Not only is it not criminal, it’s legally required if the doctors want to avoid criminal sanction.

 

[BCP1928]

I don't know. I'm 100% pro-life, and I would love to save the baby...but I have no idea IF the fetus is still viable. That's THE difference.

You are not entitled to have an idea about whether the fetus is still viable. Not even the woman's doctors are entitled to an opinion. MAGA!

 

[comana]

Not only is it not criminal, it’s legally required if the doctors want to avoid criminal sanction.

I guess it’s coming to the point that women should avoid medical care altogether in certain states since the laws work against her.

 

[BCP1928]

I guess it’s coming to the point that women should avoid medical care altogether in certain states since the laws work against her.

"She should have kept her legs closed."

 

[That Guy 11200]

Why not save the baby? They already lost the mother? Good grief.

I thought that, as a Christian, you would want to leave it to God to decide whether it lives or dies.

 

[Nithavela]

Poor comparison. Organ donation cannot be compelled against the persons or family’s wishes {...}

Well, actually...

and does not come with the ruinous cost that months of care will incur.

Sorry, forgot we were talking about something in the USA.