At what point do we become responsible for talking against leaders like Trump?

[1Tonne]

If you can do the same thing towards Democrats that you do towards Republicans, that's at least consistent and not hypocritical.

True. Even in this thread, I may have stooped down to that level. I was trying to be neutral in the original post, but people got on their bandwagon and in turn, I may have followed. So, for that, I am sorry.

Agreed, but as I think you're finding out having a rational discussion about Trump is as difficult as a camel going through the eye of a needle.

LOL. You are correct there.
NOTE: This is the first time that I can recall ever posting something about Trump. Though it was more on our accountability of our mouths regarding the content we soak in. So, it is not as though I am a fanatic about him.

Yep. He's remarkably dense about how those things reflect on him. But as you know, he doesn't think much. He claims that windmills cause cancer, for example.

Romans 13:2. Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment.
God appointed him, and you have chosen to mock and defame him as much as possible. Do you not respect God's decision?

He seems incapable of controlling his mouth. He also throws tantrums when the courts tell him that people he hates still have rights.
It's that Bill of Rights again. Even criminals like Trump have certain rights.

As a Christian, you do not have to mimic him.

 

[Fantine]

God did not appoint Trump. God gave people free will, and people, being sinful, make stupid mistakes that they often regret.
Don't absolve the voters by blaming God.
God is better than that.

 

[dremnant]

...their view was largely shaped by the news sources they rely on—sources that often present only one side of the story. Interviews and coverage usually feature voices that already oppose Trump, and little effort is made to offer a fair or balanced view. This kind of repeated, one-sided storytelling can deeply influence how we think about someone.

Those news sources do worse than just one-sided reporting, because they also twist the facts to make people hate the president. They borrowed Satan's strategy.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

God did not appoint Trump. God gave people free will, and people, being sinful, make stupid mistakes that they often regret.
Don't absolve the voters by blaming God.
God is better than that.

That is for sure. People often make very poor choices.

 

[The Barbarian]

God appointed him

No. People elected him. God didn't vote in the last election.

you have chosen to mock and defame him as much as possible.

It's not libel if it's true. And yes, he really does think that windmills cause cancer. He really was found guilty of defaming a woman by denying his sexual assault of her. He really did boast about getting away with sexual assault. He really is a convicted felon.

Do you not respect God's decision?

God gives people like Trump the freedom to defy Him. The decision will come later. You and I should pray that Trump repents and asks God for forgiveness. But Trump says that he never asks God for forgiveness.

It's that Bill of Rights again. Even criminals like Trump have certain rights.

As a Christian, you do not have to mimic him.

I wouldn't. I'm telling you that he has the same rights as any other criminal.

 

[The Barbarian]

God did not appoint Trump. God gave people free will, and people, being sinful, make stupid mistakes that they often regret.
Don't absolve the voters by blaming God.
God is better than that.

Today's winner.

 

[Yarddog]

I used to be a right-wing nut, and now that I have grandkids, my focus is no longer on myself but on them. I also have not seen things improve in the last 30 years for Americans living with this political climate. News media have divided people to the point of extremism, and with this two-party system, you'll always have this division. I can relate to end-time prophecy, and we will eventually destroy ourselves as pictured in Revelation. Our focus is on flesh and blood but not the principalites behind it.

With all this said, it's not wrong to critique any government official, but what we have today is tribalism. We have a debt crisis coming, and it'll affect everyone. We have issues with national security, with our dependence on China, which was known a long time ago, but the media distracted everyone with social issues. The only time our government can come together is during a crisis, but the next one may be too late.

I've seen things change incredibly over the past 30 years. Not as much economically but attitudes and rage has gone bonkers

Mostly the Conservatives have been swinging further to the right, since Obama was elected and we saw the rise of the Tea party and white nationalism. Many of the moderate Republicans have been alienated and left the party and are Independents.

There has been a swing for some Democrats but more moderates control the party.

We saw violent crime rise until recent years as things calmed a bit.

I worry about my grandkids and the world they will live in.

Keeping the faith.

 

[Yarddog]

True. Even in this thread, I may have stooped down to that level. I was trying to be neutral in the original post, but people got on their bandwagon and in turn, I may have followed. So, for that, I am sorry.

Your original post was not neutral. It was right wing propaganda, all wrapped up neatly and easy to see.

It's okay to be a Conservative. Left and right need to balance each other out, so us moderates can survive. Lol

 

[LizaMarie]

Turns out, due process is a right every American has. Even criminals. For which Trump should be grateful. As a convicted criminal felon,, he could otherwise have been shipped off to be imprisoned in El Salvador. Remember, the door swings both ways.

The first step in toward a fascist state is the determination that those considered criminals don't deserve basic human rights.

And no, saving money is not a valid reason to set the Constitution aside.

Yes, this is what sets our country apart from dictatorships. No one is "for" crime, and I agree that in general some far left Democrats have been too soft on crime.(See California, etc) But our constitution guarantees the right to due process, and the presumption of innocence until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.
And for anyone here- If YOU were accused of a crime, would you not want due process and the presumption of innocence and a fair trial?
Remember how some Maga brayed about the J 6 prisoners(who did get their day in court?)
And yes, Trump is on record saying he'd like to ship "only the most violent" American citizen criminals to El Salvador or Russia(I don't think it would pass Constitutional muster.)What about when a far left Democrat gets into power and decides "violence is speech?
Sure, we could get rid of a lot of crime tomorrow if we did away with due process, presumption of innocence and our Constitution.
Is that the society anyone wants to live in? A Fascist State?
In the last few years I see some people on the far right advocate things they warned us that the left would do (under Obama) such as take away free speech, imprison us without due process, and all around trample on our rights.

 

[Laodicean60]

Mostly the Conservatives

There has been a swing for some Democrats

Don't come to me with your tribal garbage, both parties are nuts. You just can't help being biased; only God can help, but one has to recognize their sin. It caused me a heart attack before I realized it.

 

[1Tonne]

There has been a swing for some Democrats but more moderates control the party.

LOL. Democrats who think that men are women. LOL. Your statement got a good laugh from me.

Left and right need to balance each other out, so us moderates can survive. Lol

You are not so moderate if you read your words. Maybe it is time to reevaluate where you are sitting by watching more than one-sided news. This video here should be a good start for you and it is short.

only God can help

They do not believe that God can help. They don't even believe that God can work in elections even though the bible does consistently show that God is sovereign over human authorities, regardless of the method by which they come to power.

 

[Yarddog]

Don't come to me with your tribal garbage, both parties are nuts.

Both parties have always been nuts. It's just the right has swung further right than the left has swung to the left.

You just can't help being biased;

I'm not being biased. Just going on the facts.

only God can help, but one has to recognize their sin.

Well, Americans need God to convict them and then they can recognize their sin. Then allow God to change them through his Holy Spirit.

It caused me a heart attack before I realized it.

I have faith in God, so it won't won't bother me that much. Maybe that heart attack was God convicting you of your sin. Now, he can soothe your spirit.

 

[Yarddog]

LOL. Democrats who think that men are women. LOL. Your statement got a good laugh from me.

Yours makes me laugh. Democrats don't think that men are women but that just shows how right wing propaganda has control of your mind.

You are not so moderate if you read your words.

I have tested my positions on issues and it shows me just slightly left of center.

Maybe it is time to reevaluate where you are sitting by watching more than one-sided news.

I would say that you have been guilty of this. Everything that you write is far right Conservative. I watch local Fox news mostly. It's the most central based new Just news, no commentary.

This video here should be a good start for you and it is short.

It doesn't help with Leavitt on the front. S lies more than anyone on Fox news. They've called her out several times .
.

They do not believe that God can help..

Only God can help.

They don't even believe that God can work in elections even though the bible does consistently show that God is sovereign over human authorities, regardless of the method by which they come to power.

Most Democrats are just as Christian as Republicans.

 

[1Tonne]

Both parties have always been nuts. It's just the right has swung further right than the left has swung to the left.

I would not say that the right has changed much in their wording. They have always said they wanted to get rid of crime etc. The difference is, now they have a President who actually puts actions to his words and the left don't like it.

I'm not being biased. Just going on the facts.

This put a smile on my face.

Well, Americans need God to convict them and then they can recognize their sin. Then allow God to change them through his Holy Spirit.

This is what many Christians miss. God does need to convict them, but first, the believers need to go and share the Gospel. Most will just do nice deeds, hoping people will know the Gospel by their nice deeds. Jesus said, "Go" and preach the Gospel. But sadly, only 2% of believers say the Gospel regularly. This is poor and shows a lack of love for God and the lost.
So, since people on here are so keen to see Americans feel convicted, they should go out and show people how they have fallen short of God's standards and then tell them the Gospel. How will they believe without a preacher? Read Romans 10:14

Are You a Good Person?

Are you a good person according to God's standards? And if so, are you good enough to go to Heaven? Find out if you need God or not.

livingwaters.com

 

[1Tonne]

Yours makes me laugh. Democrats don't think that men are women but that just shows how right wing propaganda has control of your mind.

Then maybe they should have made a law keeping men out of ladies' sports instead of allowing it to continue. Silence or lack of action is a sign of agreement.
Though I am pretty sure that if they did make that law, many Republicans would not have been happy, and so, to keep the votes, they allowed it to continue.

I would say that you have been guilty of this. Everything that you write is far right Conservative. I watch local Fox news mostly. It's the most central based new Just news, no commentary.

I would agree that Fox news is reasonable. I watch it as well.

 

[Laodicean60]

Both parties have always been nuts. It's just the right has swung further right than the left has swung to the left.

I'm not being biased. Just going on the facts.

Seeing you unfavorably calling out the right shows your bias; you don't get it. Let's hear "some" of the left's swing to the left, what issues?

Maybe that heart attack was God convicting you of your sin.

This is the most accurate thing you've said. I agree that God gave me a heart attack, and the reasons were the divisiveness in my country and allowing the Ukraine war to start. While lying in the ICU, I kept asking God what's wrong with my country (division), and the answer kept coming to mind was love thy neighbor which I rejected until the second night, then it dawned on me that it was. Then, coming to this forum, I realized how bad the tribalism was, people arguing everywhere.

 

[The Barbarian]

LOL. Democrats who think that men are women.

Who was the congressman who was puzzled about what the definition of a woman was? Hint: not a democrat. Who were the only drag queens in Congress? Hint: not democrats. (names on request)

Just saying.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

True. Even in this thread, I may have stooped down to that level. I was trying to be neutral in the original post, but people got on their bandwagon and in turn, I may have followed. So, for that, I am sorry.

Its a common issue on both sides of the political spectrum, always best to look within where God is indwelling and see how we can improve.

 

[The Barbarian]

What about when a far left Democrat gets into power and decides "violence is speech?

Precisely. These guys think they will rule forever. But that's not a very realistic expectation.

 

[Yarddog]

I would not say that the right has changed much in their wording.

They have changed significantly since Reagan. They are doing things that wouldn't have been possible 40 years ago.

They have always said they wanted to get rid of crime etc.

The Democrats have, as well.

The difference is, now they have a President who actually puts actions to his words and the left don't like it.

The difference is now they have a President that is a criminal. He has no respect for the US Constitution. He has no respect for the rule of law. He thinks that the office is the highest office instead of equal, in authority.

Biden was removing more illegal immigrants than Trump has, this year. But, he did it legally. Trump has been removing them illegally, which makes him worse than many that he is removing.

This put a smile on my face.

Hopefully God will convict you for bearing false witness against a child of his.

This is what many Christians miss. God does need to convict them, but first, the believers need to go and share the Gospel.

Incorrect. We need to repent and be filled with his Holy Spirit and learn how to love as God called us to. It is not man which spreads the Gospel. It is the Holy Spirit which lives within God's children that delivers the Gospel message.

Most will just do nice deeds, hoping people will know the Gospel by their nice deeds. Jesus said, "Go" and preach the Gospel. But sadly, only 2% of believers say the Gospel regularly. This is poor and shows a lack of love for God and the lost.
So, since people on here are so keen to see Americans feel convicted, they should go out and show people how they have fallen short of God's standards and then tell them the Gospel. How will they believe without a preacher?

Jesus didn't call all to be preachers. There is an order within God's Church, and we should search the Spirit to find our calling. "I was called into faith". So I follow God and believe.