Limited atonement !

[zoidar]

Thats what you need to study, Im saying it doesnt say they were under wrath, thats what you said. I showed you that they are reconciled to God while unbelieving enemies, so its impossible to be reconciled to God and under His wrath at the same time. So its all on you

It's all on me because you don't know the answer to my question? I can answer it for you. Being by nature a child of wrath means being a person under wrath. If you don't agree it's your job to tell me what it means. Telling me it's impossible won't do. If you need to study it further, just say so.

 

[Brightfame52]

Christs death is limited to them He obtained Eternal Redemption for, since what He obtains for us He lives to ensure the application of it Heb 9:12

neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.

Now by His own Blood signifies His Death, which by it He obtained eternal redemption for certain ones. Now who are they?

Recall back in Chapter 1 vs 14

Heb 1:14

14 Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?

Its the heirs. Notice again Heb 6:17-18

. 17 Wherein God, willing more abundantly to shew unto the heirs of promise the immutability of his counsel, confirmed it by an oath: 18 that by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us

And the heirs of promise dont just consist of some jews, but some Gentiles, the Church the Body of Christ Gal 3:29

And if ye be Christ’s, then are ye Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.

 

[Brightfame52]

It's all on me because you don't know the answer to my question? I can answer it for you. Being by nature a child of wrath means being a person under wrath. If you don't agree it's your job to tell me what it means. Telling me it's impossible won't do. If you need to study it further, just say so.

Yes its on you, you call yourself opposing something I stated with scripture with another scripture, yet the scripture you used doesnt say what you said. Now how is that on me ? Duh

Eph 2:3 says absolutely nothing about anyone being under wrath, your words, not mine and not scripture. I showed that the people Christ died for are actually reconciled to God as sinners and enemies Rom 510 so how can they be under wrath and in Gods favor at the same time ? You need to explain

 

[zoidar]

Yes its on you, you call yourself opposing something I stated with scripture with another scripture, yet the scripture you used doesnt say what you said. Now how is that on me ? Duh

Eph 2:3 says absolutely nothing about anyone being under wrath, your words, not mine and not scripture. I showed that the people Christ died for are actually reconciled to God as sinners and enemies Rom 510 so how can they be under wrath and in Gods favor at the same time ? You need to explain

The best you have come up with is a contradiction between Eph 2:3 and Rom 5:10. Of course you misunderstand Rom 5:10, but that is another question. If you tell me what Eph 2:3 means I will tell you what Rom 5:10 means.

 

[Brightfame52]

The best you have come up with is a contradiction between Eph 2:3 and Rom 5:10. Of course you misunderstand Rom 5:10, but that is another question. If you tell me what Eph 2:3 means I will tell you what Rom 5:10 means.

Be responsible for your own statements which scripture didnt say

 

[zoidar]

Be responsible for your own statements which scripture didnt say

 

[Dan Perez]

The truth of limited atonement is vital to the Christian Gospel, there's no Gospel without it. See 1 Cor 15:3. It refers specifically to the Death of Christ on the Cross, which death fully satisfied the law and justice of God for not all human beings but only for a certain group, the elect of God, Chosen in Christ before the foundation of the world.

Now let's get one thing understood, when i speak of limited atonement, i don't mean by any means that Christ atoning death is limited in its power, but that its limited in that it doesn't cover or apply to everyone, but only applies to and covers the elect or chosen of God or the Church of God in Christ, or Gods Sheep. Jn 10

And when do say , just where ATONEMENT began ??

AND when did the Christian Gospel begin ?

dan p

 

[Brightfame52]

Christs death was limited to them He actually redeemed Titus 2:14

14 who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

The giving of Himself speaks of His death, and specifically says "for us", who are they? Why it's all that are redeemed from iniquity, and purified unto himself, who constitute a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

 

[Brightfame52]

And when do say , just where ATONEMENT began ??

AND when did the Christian Gospel begin ?

dan p

Thats a different discussion the point now is that its limited to a certain people and it effects their conversion to God

 

[zoidar]

Christs death was limited to them He actually redeemed Titus 2:14

14 who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

The giving of Himself speaks of His death, and specifically says "for us", who are they? Why it's all that are redeemed from iniquity, and purified unto himself, who constitute a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

From that reasoning Jesus only died for Paul.

I have been crucified with Christ; and it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself up for me.
— Galatians 2:20

 

[Brightfame52]

From that reasoning Jesus only died for Paul.

I have been crucified with Christ; and it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself up for me.
— Galatians 2:20

Paul found out he was one of the ones of Titus 2:14, he is an example of how one was by the death of Christ redeemed from all iniquity and purified unto good works.

 

[zoidar]

Paul found out he was one of the ones of Titus 2:14, he is an example of how one was by the death of Christ redeemed from all iniquity and purified unto good works.

John 3:16 "whoever believes" will be one of the ones. That Jesus died for "us" we all agree to, that's not proving anything.

 

[Brightfame52]

John 3:16 "whoever believes" will be one of the ones. That Jesus died for "us" we all agree to, that's not proving anything.

Jn 3:16 is the elect redeemed world Titus 2:14 which He redeemed from all iniquity

 

[Spiritual Jew]

More false witnessig

Says the false witnesser.

 

[Brightfame52]

Did Christ die for every human being of mankind ? No, His Death was limited to them He died and redeemed unto God. Heb 9:12,15

12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.

15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

Now those He died for and redeemed are they which are called, to receive the promise of eternal inheritance or eternal life.

In Gods economy of Salvation, His Kingdom, them who Christ died and redeemed shall be called Isa 43:1

But now thus saith the Lord that created thee, O Jacob, and he that formed thee, O Israel, Fear not: for I have redeemed thee, I have called thee by thy name; thou art mine.

Zech 10:8

I will hiss for them, and gather them; for I have redeemed them: and they shall increase as they have increased.

That word hiss means to whistle, pipe it denotes the call of them to be gathered

So the redeemed by the death of Christ, will be effectually called, and that by name, and gathered to their Shepherd !

So the death of Christ is limited to the redeemed, and then called and gathered !

 

[All Becomes New]

There is no verse in the Bible that explicitly teaches limited atonement.

I know you have your verses (and pitchforks) lined up, so let's see them.

 

[All Becomes New]

His election of us is according to his decree (which is the subject of his foreknowledge) that we shall be born of God, not just of man (Jn 1:12-13).

You render the term foreknowledge obsolete.

 

[Brightfame52]

There is no verse in the Bible that explicitly teaches limited atonement.

I know you have your verses (and pitchforks) lined up, so let's see them.

Thats in your mind

 

[zoidar]

Jn 3:16 is the elect redeemed world Titus 2:14 which He redeemed from all iniquity

Can you prove it is the elect redeemed world in John 3:16? I have proven to you Christ wasn't sent to judge those who don't keep his word (John 3:17, John 12:47), so naturally they are included in the "world" and the "whoever" in John 3:16.

 

[Brightfame52]

Can you prove it is the elect redeemed world in John 3:16? I have proven to you Christ wasn't sent to judge those who don't keep his word (John 3:17, John 12:47), so naturally they are included in the "world" and the "whoever" in John 3:16.

No truth can be proved to you, I dont believe its Gods will for you to believe the Truth since you resist and debate it all the time.